hi all, i have an 87 camaro z28 that im having an issue with

so it can be aligned and will drive fine, but the pitman arm wasnt stright. i centered the steering box and got it to be straight but the idler are is a little turned to the right(tward the pass wheel). now the pass side wheel is very obviously turned and the driver side is straight. it also turnes the driver wheel too far and rubs on the sway bar rely bad on a full lock turn.

i mesured the lenght of the tie rods just to see and they were both about 17.5 inches center to center, the caster/camber plates are also adjusted all the way in so there is no more adjustment that can be done

i didnt have these probelms till after i installed spohn A-arms a k member, and new front z28 springs

is it possible that the springs are wrong and maybe its just sitting up to high? or more likly a bent frame? sits about 28.5 inches from the floor to the top of the fender

any help would be greatly appreciated, thanks in advance!

 

Is the arms in the right place, inner and outer? Is the centerlink perfectly level? If the centerlink isn't level youbwill get bumb steer. I have also heard about people installing the centerlink backwards

 

thank you for the reply.

by arms do you mean the tie rods?..yes they are in the right places, inner and outer...if you mean the a-arms/lower controll arms, its all one piece(non-adjustbable)...centerlink isnt currently level cuz the nut on the pitman arme is loose, i can tighten that up tomarrow and check, ive never had a bump steer probelm though..at least not that i noticed

as for the centerlink being backwards, the ends are up and angled forward...inner tie rod on the back side, nut in front

i dont have any pics handy at the moment but i can get some for anything needed if that would help...oh and part numbers for the spohn stuff

 

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/susp...ment-help.html See post #19

What you describe is nearly impossible unless the crossmember or "frame" is bent, or you have the wrong center link which is highly unlikely. Time to visit a frame shop.

 

If its been aligned, what does the alignment look like? And if it was aligned properly, there is no way one wheel would be straight and the other not, unless they put a stupid amount of negative toe to get cross to zero.

 

i was afraid of that sofakingdom lol, that is something ive had in the back of my head though....that being said i would think it would be an easily noticed bend considering how far out the pass side wheel is, but then i dont know to much about body/chassis

as for the alignment, they aligned it with the steering box off center so the wheels would have looked about right...but i centered the box and now this is what i have...i can adjust the wheel in some but it dosnt look like there is going to be enough adjustment room to fix that(see pics)



steering wheel straight and gear box centered

 

Go back to the very beginning of that post. The steering linkage is a parallelogram with the "frame" and center link as opposite sides, and the Pitman arm and idler arm as the other 2 sides. This means that you should be able to install the parts, point the Pitman arm dead ahead with the steering wheel also dead ahead, and the idler arm should point dead ahead. The distance between the PA joint and IA joint in the CL should be identical to the distance between the pitman shaft and the idler shaft (the corners of the back side, i.e. the frame). The only 2 ways these distances can NOT be the same is, if the CL is the wrong length (possible maybe, but about as likely as your problem being a "bug" planted by the space aliens to amuse themselves with frustrating a human), or the "frame" is bent. This is all totally independent of the tie rods; they don't even have to be on the car for getting this set. Also totally independent of "alignment"; i.e., caster, camber, SAI, etc. We're talking strictly about the steering linkage here.

Next, the idler arm should be positioned on the "frame" such that its shaft is exactly parallel to the Pitman shaft inside the gear, and such that the CL is exactly parallel to the line between the control arm bolts. This is done by loosening the 2 bolts that hold the IA on and sliding it around. Again, tie rods don't matter. Ideally the line through the CA bolts should also go through the tie rod joints in the CL, when the steering is centered, but not all cars will have this just exactly right. Should be pretty close though.

Is your like this? If not, find out why, and make it so. Come back and tell us what you found and how you fixed it.

Once you have the "frame" straight with the IA and steering gear mounts the correct distance apart, and the idler arm properly positioned, the steering linkage should articulate in a perfect parallelogram, with the CL parallel to the frame at all times, the IA and PA parallel at all times, and the CL remaining parallel to the line between the CA bolts at all times. This is easy to observe by eye and can be measured easily enough with nothing more complicated than a tape and maybe a level.

What I can most clearly see in your photo, from your description, is a misadjusted right tie rod. Looks like it's adjusted to about ½" too long (maybe 4 - 5 turns on the sleeve), thereby making the RF wheel toe WWWWWWWWAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYY out. Left one looks close.

 

ok..i had seen that there are problems with the idler arms and had gotten acdelco one, so i installed it a little bit ago and made sure the center link was level, seems to be good, though the idler arm is pushed all the way up in its slots. i did notice when i was under there that it seems level verticly, but not straight left to right if you look directly up at it from underneath

 

OK, time to make some progress.

Using your measuring tape, what is the distance between the center of the Pitman shaft (the thing that has the great big nut on the end of it holding the PA on) and the corresponding feature of the idler arm? What is the distance between the PA joint in the center link and the IA joint in the CL? Post these numbers. Are they the same?

 

its 22 3/4" center to center from the pitman arm shaft and 23 1/4 center to center on the centerlink

 

There's your problem then. Those #s HAVE TO be the same or the car will NEVER drive right.

Sounds like your frame is bent in about an inch somewhere. Bummer d00d.

 

i was afraid of that ...guess ill have to find a body shop and see if its fixable....thank you for the help, is very apriciated

 

Look for a frame shop, not a body shop. Body shops almost always send that kind of work out.

 

Tape measures are cheap, guessing and shop labor isn't. 1987 Factory Service Manual.

 

The centerLink is probably on backwards.
The inner tiered castle nuts should face the front of the car.