Any recomendations on the type of Camaro I should be looking at? I've been looking for a 85-90 V8 that looks nice but not a daily driver. My daughter will be driving in a year, will a V8 be too much? or should I just look for a V6? Any big differance in dependablity of a TPI and TBI?

 

YES!!! A v8 is too much. Especially for a first car. (This is coming from a 19 year old with a v8 that's had one too many close calls.) Get a v6 if you want to get a thirdgen, definately don't get the 4-bangers, you might as well just get another car.

There isn't much difference as far as the dependability of a TBI compared to a TPI.. However, if something breaks, a TBI is far more simple and less expensive than TPI. TPI's tend to get better efficiency, though.

But I stress, please don't get your daughter a v8 for her first car.

------------------
89 iroc-z 305 tbi
k&n filtercharger, open element air filter. nuffin' else

 

What are you stressing about man a stock third gen 305 isn't exactly Fast. Its not like shes driving a corvette or something. But the v6 does get better gas mileage (obviously) and besides, girls dont have lead foot like guys do, atleast most of them don't. Just find the best deal, dont worry about the engine size unless you want to save on gas of coarse, since its so high

 

My "slow" stock 305 thirdgen has absolutley no problem breaking traction, fishtailing, doing donuts, etc.

While a 305 can't compare to a 350 as far as power is concerned, don't underestimate them.

 

FiveIron,

Only YOU can decide if a V8 would be too much for your daughter.

Teaching your daughter is the important part. Teach her to respect the power of the car, or ANY car for that matter, and you and her will do fine with whatever you choose.

As far as a V8 car having too much power...You can get into just as much trouble with a V6. It's the driver who determines the actions of the car. Yes, an errant throttle blip may be a little less forgiving on a V8, but I strongly disagree that the power will CAUSE someone to want to be a speed demon. Just because she's a woman doesn't mean we should go assuming she will get in trouble with a stout vehicle. I'd rather a young woman be behind the wheel of a powerful car than a young man just getting his license, all pumped up on testosterone.

If economy and a slightly more affordable car is what you're looking for, then I agree that a V6 may be for you and your daughter. But please don't shy away from a V8. Be it a 305 or 350, They both are capable of satisfactory fuel economy depending on how you drive it, and the condition of the mill.

From the title of the topic, it looks as if you will be driving the car also. In that case, think about what you prefer. The V8 TPI cars are the most desireable, the TBI's are just as reliable, and the V6's are on the lesser side of desireable as far as performance and collector value is concerned, but just as reliable as the V8's.

You have alot more room to do upgrades on the TPI V8's, especially the 350's, so remember that too. Don't get me wrong, the TBI's are mod-able too, just not as much of an aftermarket available for them.

Let us know what you decide.

------------------
86 Trans Am WS6 Black with tinted windows, ZZ4, Mini-ram, true duals, LT4 HotCam, AFR 195 heads.
***Too many other mods to mention***

"In the future, cities will become deserts,
roads will become battlefields, and the hope of mankind
will appear as a stranger" The Road Warrior

 

One thing I don't think anyone here has addressed is INSURANCE...which is going to be waaaay high for an under-21 driver, especially with a V-8 powered sportscar.

Maturity and education is definitely an issue here, but not just for the daughter. You are gonna have to trust her not to let her irresponsible girl or boyfriends get behind the wheel. Just my $.02

------------------
92 Camaro RS, LO3, 5-spd, T-tops

Performance:
K&N Open Air Filter, Edelbrock performer TBI intake, Fastchip Prom, Timing +4 degrees, Centerforce clutch, Xact 8mm wires, SLP 1 3/4" Headers (coated), Flowmaster Catback Exhaust, Z28 Grille w/aftmkt fog lamps, MacEwen white-face guages
Electronics:
Alpine 8030 Alarm System, Valentine One Radar Detector (How did I ever drive without one?), Pioneer DEH 7450 Head Unit w/6-pack CD changer, Pioneer DEQ 7600 Sound Processor, 2 Kenwood KAC-846 Amps powering 2 12" Pro Red subs, 2 Pioneer 6x9 and 2 MTX 4x6 speakers.
NEXT UP: TBI mods, 3.42 gears w/Torsen posi

 

you have to learn to respect the car no matter what engine i myself have had some close calls. but it is all drivers decision and also just knowing you could dust anybody is basically enough for me. i don't have to prove to anybody by being irresponsable that my car is fast. i know it is and the only time people see is if they get on my A$$ or they try and pass me cause im doing the speed limit and they get left in the dust. but just teacher her respect and you should be fine no matter what you buy.
Good Luck!!!!!!

------------------
86 Z28:
350 vette
aluminum heads
T-5
235/60R15 BFgoodriches
dual 3"flowmaster exhaust
20% tint
hatch wing
2 12"kicker solos
300 watt Sony xplod amp
Sony xplod deck
K&N air filter

 

I agree with the "teaching" part... I always see messages from guys that hit the gas on a turn, in the rain, and wind up in a ditch. The same thing happens, but worse, in the snow. I've driven thru snow/blizzards/state of emergencies in my Firebird, and haven't lost it once.

But I gotta say, I'm glad my dad pointed me towards the V6 car (in better overall condition, body/interior/engine-wise), because I might've gotten seriously injured with the V8.

Plus we have our own little V6 board on this website


------------------
-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
---Think your car could be pic of the week? Visit http://www.f-body.net for details!

 

fiveiron,
My 86 IROC 5.0 was my now 17 year old daughters first driving experience. Like others have said, I taught her the responsibilities and respect needed to drive on our roads and she has done just fine. Her younger sister wants her to hot-rod it but the oldest one just uses her best judgement. As far as the insurance, with full coverage already on the car, putting her on it only added $180 per 6 months. As long as she uses her best judgement (like everybody should) she will be fine with whatever you get. Just think about what you want and get it rather than get what you think you need and regret it. Good Luck!

Mark

------------------
1986 IROC LG4 "Bone Stock" (for now)

 

Thanks for all the replies, the car would mainly be my extra car that I would be driving. I have just been looking at the V8's and all have been the 305's. My daughter would just be driving it on occasion.

 

hehehe, I'd have to disagree I know plenty of them, they change lanes way too close to my car too.
Anyway, I agree with what everyone's been saying, just make her learn to respect what the car can do and how to drive it safely

 

I got to say this.. well, for my insurance company at least.. the KIND of car, model, and so on does NOT affect insurance price.. speaking of State Farm here. The one that takes the cake that i always hear is the color.. yea frikkin right! It affects insurance rates in no way shape or form. As for the car.. From the cars i've driven, if she respects teh car and knows when to be careful(ie when its pouring rain and going around a turn). The last 88 305 auto i drove wasnt fast by anymeans, it had a little torque, but i dont see it being a 'dangerous' car to a beginner.. but then again, i am 19 and maby dont have enough insight on the matter to give a good comment or two that could relate to a parents

------------------

• 83 Z28-- not a pretty site to look at, 200k miles and im sure it was treated like a rental car every day of its sad life(before i got it).. sold, thank the lord
• 74 Z28-- 383/400, green on black. pretty clean. FOR SALE!!!

 

I think you should get whatever you want to get then just teach your daughter not to mess around with it and you will have no problems. I dunno about everybody else but i feel a good way to get to know what your car can and can't do, is to take it out in a snowy/rainy parking lot and try some donuts try to skid it etc.... Most important thing I learned there was how to get out of a skid and maintain control. I have driven my camaro through too many snowstorms too, the rear end gets out from under you every minute, but i've never lost it. Last year out here i saw some 20+ people lose control of thier cars going 60 on a snowy interstate, some people just can't SLOW DOWN! 4wd, awd, i dont' give a crap if you hit ice you're gone. I'll second the thing about the insurance, State farm sucks I could drive an almost brand new V8 car for about as much as it was costing me on my old junk SC V6, you pay way too much for the state farm name and the age of the driver, luckily girls are cheaper than boys (lucky for you at least) So basically whatever you drive if your 16 your insurance sucks, and state farm cuts you no breaks.... did i mention i hate state farm?

------------------
1992 RS 3.1
1985 POS (SC 2.8 CFI)

 

Something else to consider that was briefly touched upon above is resale value (I believe a V8 will be easier to sell).

My first Camaro was a V6 that I thought was plenty for my "tame" style of driving and I was perfectly happy with it. But everyone (including women) are different, and only you (or her) will know her style of driving.

Then I got my current Camaro with a 305 and wondered how I was satisfied with the V6 (and now I want a 350).

I think (I have no figures to back up this statement/opinion) V8's, being bigger and more "solid", work less than a V6, and will last longer than a V6. Heck 200K or more miles for a 350 w/o an overhaul is nothing to many people as long as they maintain it right. This could be (working less hard) why a V8 could very well get better mileage than a V6. I know I get better mileage on my '91 305 tpi (with 5 speed/3.07) than I did when I had the '92 5 speed V6. My last mileage check came to 31 MPG - and this is normal (all highway miles - as long as I can keep it in 5th, I know I'll have good mileage).

Another point I'd like to make, and part of the reasons for my wanting a 350, is that a V8, being more powerful, will make passing easier. When I pass someone, sometimes I need (want) to do it quickly; or just wait for the farmer (sorry if any of you are farmers) to turn off or for a looooooong stretch of road to pass. Of course if you don't drive on two-lane roads or are patient, this would be a moot point. Again, driving habits.

If you're still unsure, perhaps a test drive comparing the two will be a way to decide.

 

Well I must say this..

From what I see.. and this is not all.. but MANY..

teenage girls drive FAST!!!!!
I see it all the time, cute girls in there little mitsubishi eclipses, or eagle talons or pontiac sunfires, just blazing in and out of lanes talkin on cell phones, and looking in the mirror playing with there eyeliner, and hair!
as Much as I love these f-bodies i hate to see them wrecked.. and let me tell you.. they arent very strong vehicles when it comes to accidents.. they are death machines!

but it IS in the person as you guys have stated also,.

 

If she got her insurance on her own it would be outrageous. The only reason it's cheaper is because you are signing for it. If you own a home or anything of value beware, an accident that results in a lawsuit against her can seize your assets(if they can't get hers). Let her get her own insurance (don't be nice about the money thing)

Now as for HP. Give her a 350 with a supercharger and set her on her way. I mean really, lookit Kristen Powell, you remember the top fuel dragster girl who was 17 when she started her season? She owns a 69 camaro w/ a very Big Block chevy and even though she didn't make it in top fuel, at least she drove one, and neither did most of us big-***** out there who swear women can't drive. Did we ever sit behind the wheel of soething that could run over 300mph in the 1/4? What makes her so special?

 

Actually; I think I'm proof that they aren't death machines when it comes to accidents. If i was in a little compact car, my face probably would've kissed a chrome bumper a few years ago...


------------------
-Tom P (Hot rodded 1986 Firebird 2.8l) from http://www.f-body.net/mailbag/3rd/3rd_mailbag.html message boards
---Think your car could be pic of the week? Visit http://www.f-body.net for details!

 

everyone thinks that the 305s are slow, but the first time you drove it. did you?
i drove my 350 TPI for the first time a year and half ago, and i thought it was the fastest thing on earth, now i think it is completely slow. i cant wait till i get back from Basic Training my sign on bonus is now called VORTECH or ATI PROCHARGER!!
i think the 350 TPIs are slow now. so get whatever you want
and she will be fine so dont worry. just clarify to her that NO ONE else drives the car when she has it, none of her guy friends. if they do it wont be the same and it might get wrecked. come on guys. we all know we love to mess around!! and in others cars we do it more, since we think we know all. man i remember those days in High School sitting outside of the doors just smokin the tires and having a fun time!!


------------------
Jarrad
1990 IROC-Z L98 350 TPI
TH-700R4
G92- 9 Bolt Borg-Warner 3.27gears
Bright Red Hardtop/ Grey "Custom" Interior
NOT STOCK, NO WHERE CLOSE!
NEW RED PAINT and WELD PROSTARS.

DAILY DRIVER: 1991 GREY S10 2.5L/5SPD -FOR SALE. leaving for army.

 

FIF, There should be no problems with your daughter driving a v8! I notice when my Fiancée"19" drives my firebird 305 she tends to drive very well with no problems and actualy uses less gas than me when i try to be light footed. Although shes scared to death to drive my camaro or truck and thats the way I like it !
Well as far as insurance goes full covarage will be more expensive for a beginer driver but if you go for liability there will be no sportscar fee added, well thats the way it is for famers insurance.

------------------
Next project, retrofit the primary propultion system from the ufo that didn't crash at Roswell into my camaro.

 

With State Farm insurance it didnt matter if I got a V-6 or V-8 same premium ether way. I'm 25 but for my 18yo brother it was the same way.

 

about State Farm, full coverage for my 87 IROC w/305/5sp was more than the same coverage for 89 formula with L98 ? Kind of weird

 

I'd say this to you.

A third gen (V6 or V8) is probably not a good car for someone who has no driving experience to learn on.

The cars can be a bit of a handfull and even on a good day they're just waitin to bite you.

So unless your daughter's got a cool head on her shoulders a well as some natural talent for driving I'd say get her something else.

 

i have to disagree about these cars being death traps. our old 92 z was my girlfriends first car and she would actually sometimes drive under the speed limit. she doesnt hot rod it at all. but in denver in january some lady was driving too fast in a blizzard and crossed the median at 60 mph. she ran right into the drivers side door and narrowed the car about 12 inches. i was driving and besides being covered with glass, neither of us were harmed. the inside of the door didnt even buckle even though the outside was completely caved in.

------------------
1992 Heritage Z/28
5.7 TPI
Auto Tranny
White w/red stripes
Factory Rear Window Shade
Grey Leather Interior
Alpine CD w/alpine's all around
2 12' subs in custom "camaro" box in trunk
G92 performance package w/ a/c
Flowmaster exhaust
only 14k miles on her!
1999 Ford Ranger Sport
2.5l I4
5spd
ram air w/ k&n filters
Daily driver

 

One of the highest risk insurance groups is 16-20 year old FEMALES. They are now viewed by insurers as risk-takers, speeders, and inattentive in traffic. They are just BARELY rated better than 16-20 year old males, and have gained ground very quickly. They may soon displace 16-20 males as the highest risk group. If you don't believe that, get a teenage daughter...

------------------
Later,
Vader
------------------
"Let the bodies hit the floor!"
Adobe Acrobat Reader

 

yeh i got somebodys teenage daughter ahhahaha

------------------
1987 Trans AM GTA
305 5SPD
Hypertech airfoil
gutted maf
kn filter
High Flow Cat,
3"Walker pipe
Dynomax Super turbo Muffler
TB Coolant bypass

"Three of the scariest letters you will ever see GTA"
Take a good look you won't see em for long

 

I don't know how old you guys are but when I was growing up in the 70's WE ALL HAD V-8's. Guys and Girls. W all learned, made mistakes, etc but we didn't have 4 cylinders to choose from and 6's were wussy. If she can drive a 6 she can drive an 8.

Expeience speaking here: My 16 year old son drives a 92, V8 305.

[This message has been edited by dilligaf (edited June 11, 2001).]

 

Now this is what I have just been waiting for the insurance companies to notice for a long time. The majority of the time when I see people doing dangerous stuff, it's teenage girls, not an 18 year old guy in an 86 z28(that's me, so I guess I'm biased:-))

 

305 to much for a first car... um yes and no. My first car was/and still is a 1988 SC 305 TBI I love it the only thing I don't like is having to have two cars. trucks for hunting/fishing,winter,going places I don't want my car in,and when its raining. And my camaro just for funny . Well the trucks fun to ,flowmaster 2 chamber 40 gutted cat gotta love the sound.

 

YES!!!!!! get her a 350 for her first car. as long as she can pick her times and places to race she will b fine. you konw how many guys love chicks with muscle cars!! im telling ya guys will flock to her and she will have to beat them off with a stick (if they are like me) when i get my camaro her and i can go cruising together!! make sure you put some 80 series flowmaster catback on it so you can b sure she will b noticed have her email me when she gets it!!!

------------------
Benji
HAVE- 1970 vette 454 big block edelbrock torquer II intake 850 cfm holley double pumper carb 80 series 2 1/2 flowmaster exhaust etc...

WANT- 88-92 RS, IROC-Z, Z28 Black 305 or 350 Tint Cowl Induction Hood White Gauges Cool Blue Lights 16" 5 Spoke Rims 50 Series Tires Flowmaster Chip K & N Filter
DREAM CAR!!!!

 

My first car was an 87 v6 camaro, it was a good car for a 15 year old to have. Now, just about a month ago, I finally got a 350 camaro. Now that I am all of 17, I can say that as long as you make sure you don't have a very touchy throttle, it doesn't matter the size of the engine. My friend has an 86 z28 that is hard to drive under the speed limit because its throttle is so touchy. I hate that car, even though it is fassssstttttttt!!!!!.

------------------
1986 Red Iroc-z (just got it)
350 4bbl
Edelbrock Open air element

 

I disagree. I started with a V8 and it was no problem. You'll regret buying a V6 later when you try to sell it...

------------------
1992 Pontiac Firebird (stock)
- 305ci V8 TBI / Automatic Trans / Every option, excluding leather
- Killer car audio system:

• Aiwa CDC-MP3 head unit
• Rockford Fosgate 360a2 amp
• pair of 12" MTX Thunder 5000s in a custom box
• Pioneer 3-way 6x9s, soon to add more more more!

 

A v8 is no problem, a car with 1000 horse is no problem, you see it's all on how the individual treats the car... if they RESPECt it and its potential then there wont be a problem.... on the otherhand if they dont respect it and dont realize what kind of beast is under the hood... it could be dangersous...
just my10 cents

 

my first car was a v8 firebird. i was happy that i got a v8 later and i did get out of control a few times but other than that i think i was a safe driver so I think it will be ok to get a v8 for the first car just teach the person thats going to drive it how to drive in the rain (very carfull). it all depends on the driver!

 

get her anything she wants as long as it has GOOD brakes,tight steering,suspension,tires ect... I think these cars are actually safer because of their handling/braking abilities. a strong V8 is good to have too,when your about to get mauled by a semi entering the highway!!! I think you should get a 5-speed,if you find one in decent shape,girls should learn how to drive standard.

I know firsthand with my younger sister,I found her her first car for $300 ('82 AMC concord) it was a decent first car,but she was too hard on the brakes,after two months of driving,she totaled the car at an intersection due to brake failure. lessons learned: don't nail the brakes 10ft before every stop sign and service the brakes,even if it's a $300 car that you've owned for two months.
later that summer,I helped find a new car. she couldn't drive stick and we had to pass up lots of nice cars. I taught her to drive manual and the next week she picked up a mint '87 bmw 325i coupe, 5-speed.
I taught her to drive with my trans am before she had her license,she did fine, I had to tell her to speed up because she was afraid to!

 

did the original poster of this topic ever come back and read this. Some of you people scare me.

 

I have to say I think that F-bods are probably one of the safer cars out there especially for first time drivers. Think about it, they were built to stop quickly and stay glued to the road under pretty harsh maneuvers. I have had many instances that required fast braking and maneuvering to get out of harms way. All I can say is thank God I was in the Bird. If I was in my mom's Buick or my pick-up I would not be here to type this.

Dale

[This message has been edited by 86Chicken (edited July 02, 2001).]

 

whao, where do you get this rast barking from, our brake kind of well SUCK!!

 

I just got my first camaro after having a v8 350 Cutlass. But unlike the cutlass I can't stop spinning my back tires. People probably think I'm a punk peeling off, but I swear I never mean to do it. But ever time, EEEEEEERR voooooooooom. I just gotta learn to ease the gas peadel down.

 

Well, I don't know about your car, but I think my brakes work pretty damn well when compared to other normal street vehicles. I am confident that when I need my car to stop in a hurry it will.

All I have is plain old stock brakes, that is what I paid for and that is what I expect out them. You get what you pay for.

Dale

------------------
1986 FireBird
2.8L MPFI
Gutted Cat, No muffler (Sweet Sound)
Was 700-R4 --> Now T5

[This message has been edited by 86Chicken (edited July 03, 2001).]