I've got two bolts on one head and one on the other that are stuck. They're on the outside of the head, not the ones under the valve covers. They're on so good that they are now slightly rounded and no socket will hold. Got a set of the bolt removing sockets that dig into the bolts, but due to the proximity to the head, they can't get a good grip or won't turn once they do. I've been told a blow torch will warp the head. What other options do I have?

 

A six point socket with firm persuasion should have been enough to break them loose.

 

Too rounded. Slips right off.

 

Did you try to use a 12 point on them at first? a 6 point wouldn't have rounded them off.

I'd maybe try the torch anyway. Even if you warped the heads slightly, it wouldn't be anything that couldn't be fixed with a quick resurfacing.

 

I did use a 12 point first, and at the first hint of slipping, switched to 6. They're on so good, they got rounded anyways. I had the socket on a two foot breaker beam and throwing all my weight into it after having soaked the bolt in lubricant. It just didn't budge and finally rounded.

 

You can use a torch to cut the heads off the bolts. The other option is to use a grinder, cutoff wheel, etc and cut the heads off the bolts. Once the heads are cut off, you can try to pry the head off which won't be easy with a partial head bolt still going through the head. There are dowel pins on the upper park of the deck. To pry the head off, you stick a pry bar into the exhaust crossover and pull up. With the partial head bolts still going through the head, trying to pry the head off the dowels will be difficult but not impossible

Once you manage to get the head off, the remaining part of the head bolt will be sticking up from the deck. You'll have a better chance of gripping what's left to remove it from the block.

Another option is to weld a nut onto the top of the head bolt. A good weld will allow you to turn the nut which will turn the bolt with the stripped head. A bad weld and the nut will break off from the bolt head.

Since the head of the bolt is already stripped enough that a socket can't grab it, a suggestion of hitting the head of the bolt with a hammer and punch to help break it free won't work.

Whenever possible, always reinstall heads with new head bolts. Even if they're only stock replacement bolts. I've seen too many people do a rebuild on an older engine and reuse the old corroded head bolts.

 

First off, i'm sorry, I know the stress.

Do you have access to heat, to get the block RED hot? (you want the threaded area on the block to get hot, that will expand thread hole) You can either vise grip the bolt head (hopefully you have room to do it), I mean vise grip it sooooo hard that you think you'll break the vise grips...heat it up red, and get that first turn goin. If its gonna break off, its gonna break off, atleast with the heat you can tell yourself you did all you could. If you cannot get a vise grip in there, you will want to find the next size socket (preferably the metric one that is barely the nominal size) and hammer it on there in the same clock to match the hex. That method should ensure you wont be rounding corners off anymore.

Godspeed fork!

 

No room for vice grips. I'll try to hammer on an old 14mm(it's a 15mm bolt) and see what I can do.

 

Heat would be good.. But, that might affect the temper of either the block or the heads.. Never the less, Getting a torch in there to heat it up enough.. Depending on where they are located.. Can you get there enough to actually use a carbide Drill bit that is large enough to get in there and drill into the center of the Bolt 1/2 to 3/4 of a inch. If you can do that, then either use an easy out for the appropriate hole you just cut or go with a larger drill bit and just drill the heads off the bolts.. Will make it a little tougher to pull the heads if you pop the head bolts head off though..

 

Neither the heads nor the block are tempered, they're cast iron.

 

Yeah, I guess you are right.. Wasn't thinking for a second.. Hmmmm... Still wouldn't want to try to heat it up to get the block red hot.. I wasn't sure if he had aluminum heads or not.. No matter how much heat you put on aluminum, They dissipate heat too quickly and that wouldn't work. The head bolts are normally torqued at around 65 ft lb aren't they?? I will have to check the Snap-On truck to see what they have tomorrow.

 

Standard 2.8... so iron heads. These bolts have got to be torqued more than that. The other still took all my weight to budge and gave a nice crack when they first moved. I'm thinking someone put some kind of sealant on the bolts and torqued way more than should have been.

 

I'd say desperation would accept red hot K, maybe not bright red, but a glow is really what I meant.

 

Put the other bolts around them back in and torque them down. Then try to remove the stuck ones.

 

I'm not seeing how that would help?

 

Right now the entire clamping of the head is being done by the bolt or bolts that are still in the head. By putting in other bolts and tightening them down, they will do some of the clamping and relieve the load on the ones that won't come out.

That's why you got all but a couple of them out.

 

Naw, hes right, back when i was bustin tires...a method of removing stuck lugs was to retighten the rest of the lugs...and it would usually come off then.

 

If it were me, i'd do Stephens method. Use a die grinder, or angle grinder, and grind the bolt head down to nothing. You'll scuff up the surface where the bolt clamps down, but use a washer after and you should be fine.
Once you cut the heads off all the bolts, the heads should lift up pretty easily.
Then use a PIPE WRENCH on the studs. Those'll come out easy as pie then.

 

Right, put the other bolts back in and torque them down; and if they still won't come out, then WITH THE OTHER BOLTS STILL IN, drill the head off with successively larger drill bits and then take the other bolts back out. Then once the head is off, you should be able to get the remains of the bolts out with a large Vise-Grip or a pipe wrench.

And before you put it back together or try to do this again, go to Sears and buy yourself a 6-point 5/8" deep-well black impact socket from out of the air tools section, so you don't have this problem any more.

 

It's a V6. Make that a 15mm 6-point impact socket.

By the way, when disassembling, it's also a good idea to only loosen each bolt a little, like an eighth turn at a time, in the reverse pattern as used for torquing them down. Avoids this stuff.

 

If you have a welder go down to your parts place and buy 2 of the cheapest sockets you can and weld them to bolts and remove

 

Torquing the bolts down and trying the others didn't work. I'm going to drill the heads of the bolts off tonight and see how that goes. I'll also go pick up a small set of impact sockets to avoid this again.

This is the tear-down portion of my first engine rebuild and it's already hit a brick wall.

 

Sucks ya had to do it, try not to damage the heads to bad if you want to reuse them...

 

Goes to show how much I know about those things....

 

I imagine head bolts are grade L9, so they'll be harder than sin. Hope you aren't thinking drilling out head bolts is going to be easy...
I'd use a grinder if I had the chance..

 

Alright, just got inside from finishing the job.

Waited four hours for a friend to come over with a dremel, which he never showed. Finally went and bought me one myself. Cut the bolt heads off, took about fifteen minutes per bolt. Made a nice clean slice, then I just lifted them off. Now I've got the studs sticking out of the block. Vice grips got one out, the other two won't budge at all. Suggestions?

 

Bigger ViseGrips?

Pipe wrench?

 

On the one bolt that came out, was there threadlocker on it? Or maybe the threads at the tip of the bolt are messed up a little (such as the bolt is too long for a blind tapped hole)? At this point they should nearly un-thread by hand.

Take your time and resist the urge to use too much torque on the bolts. Last thing you need is a bolt broke off flush with the block. It will be EDM time then.

Use some heat, some penetrating oil (Kroil, PB blaster), tap on the top of the bolt with a hammer to help free it. Give it a day, then heat again, oil. Try turning the bolt in a tad, then out. Give it another day, then try again.

Tap on the top of the bolt at the same time torque is applied to it. This can help free them.

In the case that the bolts bottomed in a blind hole, 80% of the time they will break before coming loose.

RBob.

 

Yea, be careful about breaking them off. But a pipe wrench would work. Vice grips rely on how hard you can clamp it on in the first place, the pipe wrench gets tighter as you turn it. I don't know how I lived without one (or three) before.

 

A what?

 

This is when the far end of a threaded hole is closed off. IOW, blind, can't see through it.

When a tap is run into a blind hole for threading it leaves a tapered end. The threads at the lower end are not square cut. But tapered as the tap can only cut a certain amount of metal at a time. Even if the manufacturer used a bottoming tap, it still leaves a bit of taper at the bottom.

If a bolt is torqued into the tapered part of the thread, it locks into the thread big-time. Sorta' like NPT.

RBob.