Hey everyone. So I have done some research about vortec heads. And well I buckled and found a set of 906 heads. They have already been magnafluxed and hot tanked and resurfaced. I picked them up for a crisp $100.00. Not bad I think. Well anyways here is my problem. I currently have a 3970010 block 2 bolt main. I want to produce 375-400 crank hp. My main questions is this.

Which would be a better combo for the least amount of coin.$500-$1000,00 range?

1.Using my current block, with stock 906's with roller tip rockers, and behive springs, XE 276 cam, rpm performer intake airgap and hooker 2046s. <<leaning this direction.

2.Using my current block, with modified 906s to accept more lift since they are off already, and get a bigger nastier cam, with rpm air gap, hooker 2046s.

3. Buy a junkyard roller block,rebuild the stock block, modified 906s to accept more lift, and big nice roller cam, rpm air gap, and hooker 2046s.
I would sell my current block to recoup some funds.

Please note:
-I will be selling my current rpm performer, l98 heads,to recoup some funds.

- I already have the 2046s on the current setup. And it is carbed.

- My suspension is setup with UMI panhard bar, UMI LCARB, UMI LCA.

- My trans is a fresh 700r4 with corvette servo matched to to 4th gen rear with 3.42s.

Sorry for the length but im looking for the most budget friendly build to get me where I want.

 

88 people online and not one reply...

 

A little more than 23 minutes to get back to you would be nice. After all, we aren't being paid for this...

Hooker 2046? Do you mean 2460?

Personally, I prefer the factory roller blocks. Roller cams are readily available, work better, wear less - downside is they cost more. The roller block casting and machine quality also tends to be better than the older blocks like the 010's.

For sure modify the guides for more lift while the heads are still uninstalled.

 

Personally I'd get the heads machined for more lift and get a roller block. But make sure you do a complete rebuild on the junkyard block

 

Thanks guys. So if I sell my old block do you think I can complete a rebuild and install for around 500-750? And with those heads how easy is it to make the power I'm looking for?

 

1. No. Try closer to 3 times that much if you're needing machine work done and new pistons, which for an old "010" block is pretty much mandatory. If you got a pullout Vortec shortblock that wasn't fubar you might be able to hit $750 installed.... but I really, really doubt it.

2. A vortec headed 350 will hit 340-375hp with a big roller cam like an XR276. Maybe a little more. 400 is starting to hit the wall with these heads. It can be done but you lose all the streetability and gas mileage characteristics that make these heads so great real quickly above around 375hp.

If you want to get 375-400hp for that kind of money you might want to consider an LT1..... a big cam in an lt1 CAN hit those power levels, but only very, very barely. LT1 heads and Vortec heads are very similar so power levels are very similar, but hte LT1 is going to have a lot more compression and is a factory roller block to begin with so take that into account. You can run a lt1 carb intake on one and use your distributor and carb. The only other hurdle is the accessories and belts.... you'll need an LT1 serpentine setup, and 1 new power steering line for the LT1's power steering pump. Also you'd be taking a gamble that the LT1 bottom end is good to go.

 

I should of stated that I have two daily drivers. The 010 block was rebuilt 20,000 miles ago. It is currently in the car. I have a 4.3 serpentine belt system on the car. Also I did a ac delete.This car is a weekend cruiser during spring and will see the track once a month. I won't go Lt because at that point I would just do an LS swap. I appreciate the advice. But if I go with the 010 engine already in the car it won't need a rebuild.

 

In that case I can tell you with my setup Im making right around 300 fwhp with my xe262 flat tappet cam. 218/224, .462/.467 lift or something like that. SkinnyZ has an XR276 with his Vortecs and is making 375fwhp or thereabouts. That should give you an idea of the range. A roller LT4 hotcam (218/228, .525/.525 with 1.6 rockers if I recall correctly) should get you into the 325-350hp range depending on various other factors.

Hopefully that helps give you an idea of what they can do in streetable setups.

Just make sure you do a compression test on that 010 block and then take very precise measurements to determine the real world compression ratio you have. If your pistons end up being .045 in the hole and you put even a .025 shim gasket on there, that's still a pretty bad situation. If you want a bigger cam you need to make sure you can get the compression ratio into the high 9's.

 

Had an xr276hr in a stock rebuilt vortec motor and it pulled like an animal in an s10. I figured guestimating 360-380 horse is a good number. Run a factory roller block and buy LS7 lifters. You'll come out $250-300 ahead of the game over retrofits.

 

Id estimate a minimum of 1500. You'd be better of going the route I went which was buying a short block from ATK. 1 piece RMS and full roller. When you're talking about a high number and high dollar build that you're planning on driving daily you want to cut no corners. Reliability should be your priority

 

How was the short block from ATK? That came with pistons,rods,and crank I assume? Where they reusable with just a rebuild kit? And I just figure now if I am going to do a overhaul might at well build a 383? How well do Vortecs support a 383 build?

 

They dont. Of all the factory heads they will work best, but none of them can breathe well enough to make a 383 work well at higher RPMs with a big cam. You stay moderate on the cam size and you can be okay, not ideal, but okay.

Due to the nature of port volumes, port velocity, and the inability of Vortecs to flow enough air for more cubes, you wont see much power gain from jumping from a 350 to a 383 with Vortecs. I would actualyl say the cam choice should probably stay the same regardless of whether you put a 350 or a 383 under it. If cam and heads and bore stay the same, power will be very, very close. But with a 383 and an XR276, if you go with better heads down the road, they will make a ton more power.

 

It's a short block, there isn't a whole lot to be unhappy with, it works. I always heard a 383 with hsr, lt4 hot cam, and vortecs could make around 400 crank. You could get a set of ported vortecs from GM or edelbrock and it would free up some breathing power for the 383. I'd stay with the 350 personally, it's more economical for daily driving

 

RYANJB, thanks for the Plug and im glad our short block is working out for you.

In regards to the 350 vs 383 question: For most of my customers, the upgrade is worth it if they can swing it. Typically you will pay $500-$700 more for the shortblock on a 383, but it does net you MORE power as well as a stronger foundation to improve on later if you dont have the $. Since we are on a Vortec head topic, a 350 vs 383 engine I do with the exact same parts stack minus crank kit will net you 30+ more HP and 60+TQ every time. This is on a mild 220/224 @50 .500 lift Hyd roller cam with stock vortecs. Its the same story on many similar combos I have done.

In regards to the comment about Vortec heads not supporting a 383CI, thats just First, you have to think of what you want to do with the car. If this is a steet/strip engine that you want to RPM @ 5800+, than the stock vortecs are not the best choice. However, with a mild clean up they can make power at 5800-6000RPM. With the same cam listed above and a mild clean up I build a 350CI that makes 400+HP and peaks power @ 5900RPM...probably one of my favorite engines and budget freindly.

Now if your just wanting to hot rod around town and have some power, Vortecs are a great choice for a 350 or 383, they will make good HP and TQ. They wont make peak HP much over 5000-5200RPM, but on a street car most of cars drving time is in the low-mid range. I would rather build for where power is going to be USED.

G92BILL- A flat top piston short block, 9.5:1 compression, Stock vortec heads, Comp XE276HR camshaft, air gap intake and a 650 double pumper, you will make that 370+HP/410+TQ and make peak power at about 5200RPM....not bad at all IMO.

Just my opinion. If I can help with anything, feel free to PM me.

Brandon
ATK HP ENGINES.

 

Brandon,
I do disagree with you on Vortecs and 383's.Minimum intake runner for that is 195cc for the all important torque curve and hp.The patch work correction for that most guys do isn't sufficient.

Cam choices needs to be based of this link that I totally agree with that applies to the smallest stock rebuild to the high hp performance engines.

http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/w..._compatibility

The same thing for this link:

http://www.crankshaftcoalition.com/wiki/Quench

I do not agree with the use of "shim" gaskets VS a good build plan in the first place and correct finish head/deck prep to get the needed .040:

http://www.enginebuildermag.com/Arti..._finishes.aspx

All and all customers tell me all the time they aren't building a race engine,but after I explain the tune up starts with the build sheet and why these strategies are so important for a matched parts build,I can see the light go off in their face expressions.

Now I know I left some reading to do,but it is kind of the basics for most of readership.Not intended for you Brandon beyond showing you my point.Is 400 hp for a proper handled 383 do-a-able??. Any parts matched 383 should be able to do that.Pulling the Vortec trigger on a 350/355 is do-a-able,but for a 383 it isn't in my opinion.

Ya know it isn't reasonable to spend money on a stroker,then short change the top haft where for the most part on all SBC's the power is made.