After market tpi stuff is way over rated.You can buy a whole set for the price of runners and intake.



Jason,

 

they are waay overrated... who has the time to port out stuff that should have been done in the first place... doesnt make sense to pay all that money for aftermarket stuff and still have to do alot of work to them just to make them worth a damn.....

 

also ken has haulted production of the FIRST intake since july 5th..... here is the reason directly from his website...

 

I was going to buy aftermarket tpi stuff.But bought elderbrock pro flo.I got 100% more flow and alot cheaper .Power us price.

 

I was wondering a few things, how do the Accel and AS&M runners flow next to the FIRST intake out of the box? Also can Accel runners be further ported?

 

My TPIS(AS&M) large tube runners measure 1.64. Compared to the First runners at 1.75, out of the box. The ACCEL base (the same goes for the ACCEL runners) can be ported to about 1.75 before it needs welding to go any larger. The first base runners are 1.75 out of the box. Both the First base and runners have enough material to easily reach 1.95 with porting. My engine with the TPIS runners and ported ACCEL base makes good power, but I don't see how to compare an intake with 1.64 runners to an intake with 1.75 runners, especially when it can be ported to nearly 2".

Looking at the ACCEL base next to the First base, it's obvious that the First is just cast with much larger runners to begin with. Recognize that the ACCEL, like the Edelbrock was designed to be a bolt on replacement for the OE piece. This limited how far the engineers could go with it. The First has no such limitations as it was designed as a complete, stand alone aftermarket, hi performance intake option. No part of the First system is interchangable with the OE TPI.

 

Alright thanks that really cleared everything up for me, so if i really want to make power & keep my TPI with the more factory set up rather than go with some type of ram the FIRST intake system would be the best way to go then. It's the best flowing out of the box & i can still have it ported to have it flow even better if i want more power later so that pretty much says you can't go wrong with it from any point of view. Well thanks for putting me on game with the difference in these runners, i appreciate it.

 

I thought I heard somewhere that First is releasing a new intake with 2" runners out of the box. This would be the one I would buy.

 

yea ken told me that he was going to eventually release the first with ported runners...he also said that he was releasing a big block version of the intake too but idk about that...

 

There only one other set up i would buy.Thats the one i have Edelbrock 71383 - Edelbrock Pro-Flo XT EFI Intake Manifoldswith a ls tb.

 

I understand the Pro Flo intake has potential. I personally feel that the plenum is a little small. But that's just my opinion. I have the same issue with the Miniram.

 

KEEP US INFORMED.

 

This intake upgrade looks very promising. I think that this would be a nice mod to "wake up" the LB9, even better with a cam, heads and headers.... I am thinking longer term for what I'd like to do to my IROC. I really like the look of the TPI system, and the FIRST system retains the look and increases the perform where the TPI lacks.... Worst case I could always transplant this intake system onto an L98 block. For a fun street car, this could be a great alternative to replacing the SBC in the car with an LS. No/minimal rewiring of the vehicle, etc....

Thoughts folks?

 

FIRST hasn't made an intake in about 10 months....
They claim to be "waiting on part(s)/mold(s) from the foundry."

 

I thought about going this route, even had everything listed. Had vortec heads and a block all ready to go. Then looked into a budget LS build using an LQ4/9 and saw the cost to power ratio made more sense. Greater potential in the long run. Had a friend explain an LS swap, pretty simple, minus the harness he re-routed.

 

Just looked on eBay for fun.... you can get an LQ4 from an '04 2500 with computer and wiring for $1,800.00 buy it now.... Granted some fab work is needed, but you have a complete setup that cranks out more power than just adding the intake alone.... Decisions Decisions.

 

http://www.spohn.net/shop/1982-1992-...SX-Swap-Parts/

 

I've seen that before.... other than finances... the other variable is time. Trying to be honest with myself... am I ever going to take it to a track of any kind, probably not. But if I do, I can figure it out then.

 

In reality its a swap that if you have the money to do its worth it. even if you drop is a stock LS engine. Its better for emissions, fuel economy, and performance. Not to mention driveability. It is a good swap if you have the money to spend.

 

great thread

 

Post 314 states FIRST has not been manufacturing intakes for 10 months. If true, that is too bad. I read this thread last year and have been focused on this intake as a an option for a 383 I want to build.

In addition to building up the funds to do the build the way I want to, I have been researching the intake as I was contemplating head and cam options that would compliment this.

Now that the funds are close to what I think I need, I reread the thread and see this news. I sent FIRST an email today to see what is happening. I guess, there are other options, but the great look of a TPI system coupled with what should be great performance is why I was going down this path to begin with.

 

I called them twice today at both numbers....no answer...

 

3 times....will try again tmr.

 

Ken and I exchanged emails and I actually spoke to him yesterday on the phone.

He is having issues with production from the foundry he uses and is frustrated by this. His exact comment escapes me, but he is shipping product with a 2-4 week backlog, depending on the foundry.

I was also asking him for more build information or links to builds that I could refer to. Searching for such a common word as "first" doesn't get you very far when researching on TGO or on the net. He recommended that I search for "FFI", apparently people are using this abbreviation to overcome the search issues.

I'm not trying to hijack this thread, this late in the game, so I'll shut down my comments regarding these issues that are outside of the spirit of the original build thread.

 

Thats almost -exactly- what they have been saying for the last 10+ months.......

and "can we/I put you on a waiting list?" NO I don't want to be on a list for something thats seams like it will never happen.

I will try to cll again right now-

 

i don't know why he is lagging around but he is the only guy you can get a hold of these intakes... so it makes them pretty rare and possibly very valuable to tpi owners who are seeking the best tpi intake... its been confirmed that it flows more than a superram and even an hsr out the box.... so you definitely have your cake and eat it to with the intake...

to be honest I don't think he is really interested in doing these intakes... I think he is having too much trouble at the factory.... the throttlebody design is horrible as mention in my previous post and I would be hesitant to get one know how lousy those "ls" style throttlebodies are... ken actually made me a adapter plate two years ago to use my stock throttlebody and he assured me that, that was the first and last adapter plate he was making... he said it was too much of a pita to make... but im glad he made me one because all my problems went away...

 

KEN AT FIRST IS NOW BACK UP AND RUNNING THESE AGAIN! HAIL! HAIL! HAIL!

 

88fastGTA, had a couple questions.

I noticed your fuel pressure gauge seemed to disappear in your pictures, what happened?
Assuming I was to use the provided TB, it has a vacuum port for the FPR, correct?
Where do you get vacuum for the PCV's?
Do you think it would be possible to keep the OEM split intake & MAF using the FFI?

Thanks

 

I ran the FIRST with MAF and the OEM air intake on my 86 IROC - no worries there.

 

Thats a big load off my mind, thanks for the reply.

 

I'm sorry but there is no way that is going to fit without breaking something. How in the world did you make yours work?

 

Looks like you need a shorter intake bellows. A fabricated hose type should work well

look into these guys for that http://www.hosetechniques.com/

How does it run? Really thinking about this intake, are the gains worth it over AZS&M large tube runners and a hogged out plenum.

 

4" - 3.5" ID Hump Hose
https://www.google.com/search?q=3.5%...rchBox&ie=&oe=

 

Thanks BadSS

 

They sure do I found one at a swap meet last yr..never heard of them I did some research after buying it..cant wait to install in on my wifes 89 iroc...it does need some parts...like the tps bracket...and I think you cant use an EGR with this right if not what do I do?...lol

 

As far as how does it run, I have not had the privilege of firing it up yet. I did as the instructions said and primed the fuel system before installing everything else and everything checked out. No sooner had I bolted everything on and turned the key, gas founds its way right out the end of the fuel rail! disassembled everything and decided to check my injectors for leaks, turned out it was a good idea. Ordered new injectors and they should be here soon.

 

You can use EGR with the FIRST. Not familiar with how to personally but if you call and talk to ken he could tell you right off.

 

Thanks for the info..I see a few guys mounted the stock TB on the first intake...anyone making these adaptor plates??? I would love to leave the stock TB....

 

No adapter currently available. Honestly the FIRST TB works just fine...

 

So I should have measured this instead of taking your word and just buying it but the MAF measures 3.1" so the 3.5" will not work.

 

I don't know if the thin silicone 3" hump hose would work or stretch over it or not, but the thick rubber 3" would not. I had to buy the 3.5" and use electrical tape on the sensor to fill in the gap so to speak. Best I remember it didn't take much tape and once the hose is over the taped area and clamped down, it's not going anywhere. Worked for me.

 

Fwiw my stock boot from my GTA fit fine after cutting it.... I didn't need to buy another boot... I think the camaros are plastic and nowhere near as flexible as the rubber boot version of the trans ams....

 

what would be an expected max hp. rpm from this intake with say a comp 502 cam?
Ken dances around this question, and won't comment.
My peak hp now is 4700 with a ported stock base with slp's. 383 with shorty's

 

It's hard to guess on HP and RPM, but I was running a similar cam 218/228-110 in a 355 with fully ported stock base and SLP runners cut back to about the 1/2 way point (as much as you can do without welding on the base and runners). I was shifting that combo at 5500/5300 and running high 12.9 - low 13.0s. I swapped to a box stock FIRST and while I thought the shift point was going to be around 6000/5800, it ran the same time shifting at 5800/5600 at the track,, so that's where I shifted - it dropped ETs down to the mid 12.5s though. If your base and SLPs are not fully ported you should see better results. I guess I should add the disclaimer,,, the above is based on my personal experience,,, your results may vary.

 

Seems to be very little documentation with the FFI. Can anyone post a dyno sheet?

 

I wonder how this setup will work for a 383 stroker? I'm going to be staying my build after the year and was planning on going with a 383, ported vortecs and an lt4 hotcam, but i was looking into the Edelbrock tpi intake and runners, but can't believe the price on them!

 

THOSE ARE WORTH LESS JUNK, NO POWER GAINS!!!!!

 

Any updates??

 

On what?

 

How does it run? is it tuned?

Worth the effort? Like the Power? Mileage - you name it - I'm thinking about doing this and all the feedback possible would be great.

I've read through all the FFI threads and still wanting more feedback, especially since there in production again. Would love to try a ported vortec style.