1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Very nice. I see Ken is continually trying to upgrade his product. The exit ports on the base to head are better than mine was as an example. You have a lot of potential there.

BadSS

Man,, that does look good. I think everyone that's actually seen a FIRST in person has the same initial impression - Damn,, that thing is huge! - lol

I agree with Allen, the base to head opening looks a lot better. I know he has updated the gasket size opening,, and fuel rail (the older ones were welded round tubing). Now,, if he would only modify the mold to at least take that crease out of the inside (if not on both for an SLP look) - so you could fully siamese the runners without weldinng!!

Just a heads up on the runner and plenum bolts. Some of the bolts provided with the older FIRST unit (not from Ken) were too long and bottomed out,, just a fraction before they should have - just barely touching the runner surface. They "felt" snug,, but that's because they bottomed out. I was glad I did a dry run bolt up on the bench before putting it on the car,,, or I may not have caught it. Anyway,,, I ended up cutting a couple threads off all the bolts. The newer intakes from Ken may have the bolt holes tapped deep enough,, or have shorter bolts,,, so this may not be an issue for you.

Also, the bolt holes for the plenum are open (unlike the factory TPI). I was concerned about potential vacuum leaks and used teflon washers like you see on the Holley fuel bowls to make sure everything was sealed up - the local nuts and bolts supplier stocked the perfect size. I also cut the bolts so they didn't stick out in the plenum,, not saying that helped flow or anything,,, just did it 'cause.

One other area that I had to tweak was the indention for the oil sending/pressure switch at the back rail. I was using non-stock fittings and while I could have installed the intake with the fitting in place,,, I would not have been able to get a wrench on the bottom fitting. I beveled the top edge enough to get a wrench on it. Again,, this may not be an issue if you're using stock hardware.

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

thanks 1989gtatransam.... im dying to put it on.... when i take my told tpi off im going to do side by side comparsions of each intake and use my dailing caliper to measure the difference in each ports to see the increase.... i want this to be a well documented thread...

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

I guess ken is trying fix and upgrade all the little "setbacks" with the newer batch of intake with the First to get more people to buy this intake.. i guess thats the reason why i took the intake almost a month to get to me...

.. yes i do noticed that the fuel rail is different.... i have seen some photos of rounded fuel rails but min is more square and has the nice lettering on the side....

I love the fact that it says "made in USA"..... very nice piece of work this intake is.... GM should have done this from the factory with these cars. This is the tpi intake that the 350 deserves.. I know for a fact now that this will outperform my edelbrock/slp combo hands down just by looking at the ports and just how huge the base is my goodness.....

when i checked the runner to plenum bolts and runner to base bolts they didnt bottom out for me.... about the plenum bolts being "open", i had my slp runners super siamesed and ported and they were open too..... i left one bolt out on the top where the slp runner meets the plenum and it caused a vaccum leak... i put the the bolt on and it went away so as long as the bolt is in there it didnt cause zero leaks.. So that issue im not worried about....

apperently ken must have fixed these issues back i dont have any of them...

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

here is the new 3.73 rear end with LS1 brakes that im using with the first... the L.P.W girlde and brace kit is coming soon... in the pic you see stock control arms and panhard bar but i will be re using my tubular panhard and control arms...

86T/A_Ram_Air

looking good, i can't wait to seea side by side with the stock TPI manifold......get to work!!!

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

thanks..... the FIRST is alot bigger for sure... its like a buff version of a tpi....

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

I call the First a TPI on steroids.

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

so 1989gtatransam.... i hear that this flow similar to the superram... do you think power would be similar to a superram...

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

cause really my goal here is to achieve 1 horsepower per cubic inch at the wheels.. so i have a 355 engine.... i would like to make at least 355whp...

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

"so 1989gtatransam.... i hear that this flow similar to the superram"

It way outflows an out of the box SuperRam. Not even close. The Accel base flows in the 240+ cfm area. The First was flowed at 301cfm. With runners attached around 290cfm or so. We never flowed an Accel base with runners attached but I would assume it would be somewhat less than 240cfm.

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

oh wow.... i did not know it flowed better than a out the box superram.... i wonder if this flows as well as what you guys do with your tpi's and the slp runners..... hopefully my power pulls to about 5500-5800.. that would be right into the powerband of the gm hotcam and with the 3.73 rear end it should help me get into those higher rpms quicker.... id say i have a good match....

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

I don't know what the latest edition of Ken's First intake flows. The restriction from an out of the box version was always the port exit into the head. However yours seem to be better profiled so it may flow a little bit more out of the box.

Dr J got one of the heavily welded and ported Accel bases to flow 330cfm. My heavily welded and ported Accel intake with a small clay entrance flowed 335cfm and with a larger clay entrance it flowed 345cfm. I hope within the next two weeks to go over to Joe Shermans and have it flowed with the runners attached and the plenum to see what it does.

The First is quite capable of flowing those numbers and more if it was ported. The restriction again will be the port exit from the head. If you open it up to a Felpro 1206 gasket you will get a larger CFM flow than if it was opened up to a Felpro 1205 gasket. This is assuming the rest of the runner was also opened up accordingly.

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

i see... impressive cfm numbers for a tpi for sure... i didnt want to spend the money to get my intake ported and welded to get those cfms... if my engine pulls hard to about 5500 i will be very happy.... well i need to jump on a dyno once all of this is installed.... i would like to get about 300whp with stock l98 heads... then with the afr swap about 355 or more whp.... i know right now those iron l98s are killing me....

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

The iron L98's will be killing you for sure. You will max them out in a heart beat and they will be the bottle neck. With AFR heads you should easily reach you goals.

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

yea because i never did replace the valve guides on the heads and im pretty sure thats why i see blue smoke comming out the tail pipes..... but im torn between afr 180's or 195's......

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

here is the size difference between the two intakes...... This thing is a monster....

ljhll

BLKIROCZ87

Looks very tempting... Nice!!!

Subscribed!!!

GTA90X

iTrader: (2)

WOW!!!!

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

the best tpi intake by far that outflows a superram, but this isnt cheap... expect to pay close to 1500 for the intake, fuel pressure regulator, custom lines and few misc. parts... also its about a month wait because these intakes are "build on order"... id say if you want out the box max performance tpi the FIRST is it... i have fooled with aftermarket tpi setups and still had a rpm wall at 5000....

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Hey, it cost money to go fast. Or you need a lot of fabrication skills and the tools to do so.

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

If you did the AFR head swap i'd consider a matched cam to get the most bang for your buck. LT4 hotcam is good but there are "better" grinds available to get more out of the AFR heads.

86Z

iTrader: (4)

that thing is a monster, looks great! i cant wait to see it installed, is it supposed to make power over 5500 rpm? is it even necessary? i pull to 5200 rpm

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

If it was me I would go with the AFR 195 heads. I would also do what I could to get the compression up to at least 10.5:1 or up to 11.0:1. IMHO the "hot cam" is dated compared to what is available on todays market. As Orr stated there are better cams available. I went with a custom cam designed for my motor. I am very satisfied with the results.

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

i thought about a cam swap.. but im happy with how it sounds and the way it performs... the hotcam has lazy lobes so its easier on the valvetrain... i know its dated but so is the FIRST... the FIRST has been out since 89 i believe, but it was so hush hush and virtually no advertisement for it that no one has heard of it....i want to keep it streetable and a daily driver... i know im leaving some power on the table but im not trying to squeeze every inch of power out of this.. but i do want better heads and reach my 355whp goal.... Im sure that with the FIRST, gm hotcam and afr 180 heads (mill the heads to 58cc to achieve 10.3 to 1 compression) and a decent tune, i would achieve my goals....

BLKIROCZ87

how did you install you hot cam? straight up?
also does the intake come with a stand alone controller/computer?

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

no i had the hotcam in my car back when i built the engine from scratch on an engine stand back in 2008... right now i have no interested in doing another cam swap at the moment.... i feel that the gm hotcam is "big" enough for the FIRST tpi and my needs.. it was hell to tune that cam with my edelbrock/slp tpi combo.. No im using my stock ecm and wiring harness..... so it will be basically a bolt on upgrade for cars originally equipped with tpi... but i will be getting another tune once all hooked up... im going to take it to alvin at pcmforless... he is about 150 miles from me..

Orr89RocZ

iTrader: (20)

Just saying you could keep the same rpm range and make a good bit more power/tq with new cam matched to the heads/intake and not lose any driveability and in fact, likely gain driveability.

But hotcam with good heads has made over 350whp before...so that will do your goals. Just seems like wasted potential to swap heads and not the cam at the same time

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

well out of curiousity what cam would you go with... i just might do it since i will be down that far anyways...

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

The rear end will be put in monday and the intake shortly afterward...

TORN

iTrader: (17)

So are parts coming off the car yet........? pics.

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

they will be off in a week or so... i just need to go to napa and get fuel line hoses and two fittings and thats sit... it will only take day a morning and a afternoon to swap it over....

oscarfromla

iTrader: (9)

I can't wait to see mine. When did you order yours? I think my order went into Ken May 28th.

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

i ordered mine june first... it took 29 days to get to me....

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

its supposed to pull hard up to about 5800 rpms....

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

The higher the motor revs the more potential power it can make. It is about how much cfm moves through the motor. A large camshaft will also help in this regard. I have been very pleasently surprised by how tame something such as a 228/228 camshaft can be and even pass California smog.

mikespeed

How high can you go before you have to run premium gas?

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

"How high can you go before you have to run premium gas?"

That will depend on a number of factors. One being the heads. The AFR heads have a good combustion chamber with dual quench pads. They will take a little more compression before detonation sets in. Another one is the quench distance. Something around .035" to say .040" will be better than one a .060".

Another would be how good your cold air intake is. The cooler the incomming air the more compression you can run. The dynamic compression ratio is another. For California 91 octane and premium gas maybe 8.5:1 would be the limit. For California 87 octane maybe 8.0:1. Also the hotter your motor runs the octane that is required.

I might add that Dyno Don runs 87 octane around town and is around 10.7:1 compression. Of course no wide open runs just normal driving.

BrianI

Sweet intake

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

im going to take the manifold off sunday and finish by this monday...

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

well i had to get alot of little things for the intake like 90 degree hoses,clamps small fitting etc.... i will resume posting pictures this sunday.... im planning on having my old intake off by sunday night and having it all done by monday afternoon... should be fun.....

86T/A_Ram_Air

whoo hoo can't wait lol

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

i cannot wait also.... but heads up....

people who are using auto trannies and using the first intake need to buy studs for the throttle and transmision lines..... the firsts throttle body does not come with these studs to link up your cables...im not using cruise control because i deleted it a while ago, so goodluck trying to rig that up.... but here are the ones i got for the other two cables....

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EDL-8016/

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/EDL-8018/

you need to drill a bigger hole on the throttle body bracket so they fit.... they work and this is the best way i can do it without ghetto rigging it up.....

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

phew there are alot of little things that you need to get for this thing.... and i mean little stuff.... i see why you cant put this on in a day because you have to run around buying little parts... you must get a swivel waterneck...... stock tpi waterneck does not work because it points into a different direction.... i had to get a swivel design so i can point it wherever it needs to go....

http://www.jegs.com/i/Trans+Dapt/969/6016/10002/-1

thats the last custom thing i need to get.... so people if your switching to the first expect the final cost to be around 1350 from intake to little misc parts...

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

keep watching guys..... now that ive gotten all my little parts teardown of old intake starts at 7:30pm sunday eastern time.. and will post pics sunday night and time of completion of new FIRST intake should be monday in the afternoon or early evening.....

1989GTATransAm

iTrader: (3)

Just for general information I was able to use the stock water neck on my system. However I am using SLP runners and a factory plenum.

gbayfisher

I also used my stock 1987 water neck , its close with the angle....wants to pull towards the alternator bracket, but it should work. Of course for the perfect fit the adjustable one is excellent!

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

well the waterneck i got was only 20 dollars and for it being polished aluminum and being swivel it sure beats the stocker....

88fastgta

iTrader: (9)

by the way i ditched my so called "ls1" rear end... come to find out after further inspection it was a lt1 rear end and it had 3.42 gears instead of the 3.73 that the guy said it was.. so the guy screwed me out of 260 bux but im getting a refund and getting a real torsen ls1 rear wed the 13th from a auto salvage yard.... it has 55,000 miles, zexel torsen rear has 3.42 gears and theh ls1 brakes... so with the first intake and swapping out from 3.27 nine bolt to a 3.42 ls1 ten bolt all in the same month, i really should see a HUGE improvement for sure...

Gallileo60

Isure like how you have your coil mounted, can you show a close up of that??? thanks..Tom