Black is Best

First and foremost I have done a search but never got a for sure answer. My rear end went out and I had a buddy that sold me the 10 bolt rear of his 92 Z28.

So as of right now I'm just trying to put this rear together and get it in my car. But I wanted to strengthen it up a little bit before I put it in.

So here is my question will this Superior Axle kit work with my 92 10 bolt?
I'm also welding the axle tubes and putting on this girdle.

I know that most of you say it's a waste of time building up a 10 bolt but I'm just building it up a little and putting it in my car. Later down the road I will be putting a Ford 9 inch in.

So any help would be greatly appreciated,

Zack

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

This superior axle kit.... Which is "this"? I was thinking you'd have a link there?

But yea, it's 28 splines for the '92 10 bolt, so you are probably looking at the right one. I remember sofakingdom advocating the superior ones, I think it was the EVO-10? I know one version is 1510 alloy or something, and comes with wheels studs, and one version is just the axle (so you buy two).
And maybe one version is the 4140 version, and is a kit with screw in wheel studs. Your call, as long as it's the right width for our cars, the other version is the longer style for 4th gens. If you're at summit you should be able to figure out which is which eh?

AlkyIROC

Any aftermarket axle is stronger than a factory axle. Back when I used a 10 bolt, I was using Tom's Differential's 28 spline KA axles. Never had a problem pushing the car into the 11's with them. I switched to a 9" when I installed a transbrake.

No matter what axles you use, the tiny ring and pinion of the 10 bolt will always be the weak link.

Black is Best

Sorry about the link. I don't know what happened after I made it. Somehow the link didn't come out when it got posted up. But I fixed it now.

But yes it is the EV10-4. It comes with everything.

So the 28 spline axles will work? Awesome!

Black is Best

So you had no problem running 11's on your 10 bolt?
I've read alot of problems with braking the 10 bolt are slicks, manuals, nitrous, and transbrakes. I don't plan on ever using any of those. If I build up this 10 bolt could I push about 450 to 500 HP on street tires and not brake it? I also don't plan to drag it but maybe once a year or so. It will just be my weekend car.

AlkyIROC

28 spline axles originally designed for 90-92 third gens will fit into all the 82-92 third gen 10 bolt housings as long as you have a 28 spline carrier.

Black is Best

So is the 92 Z28 a 28 spline carrier?
It is a posi 3.23 disc brake rear.

Nice video by the way!!

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

trick flow cover? huh, weird. Looks identical to the summit one, I used that one and i'm impressed.
I'd recommend you getting a stud kit for the mains. I think TA racing is the only source for it. It's the same for the 7.5 as it is for the 8.5" 10 bolt IIRC, so you might be able to find another source for it.

Yea, you have a 28 spline 3 series posi now.

I broke my posi unit in mine, so i'd recommend you upgrade that, the stock piece isn't known for it's strength. I'm going for a True-trac, $375 from summit.

I'd also recommend a ratech solid pinion spacer, $20 or something, Rat-4111.

I'm not sure if you're considering getting an aftermarket gearset? I'm also not sure how much stronger they are than stock, for that matter.

Black is Best

Yea I just like the look of the trick flow logo over summit.
Can you send me a link for the stud kit you are talking about?

How hard is it to install the pinion spacer?
It says it is for a 7.5/8.2 inch rear. Isn't the 92 10 bolt a 7.625 inch?

I will upgrade my posi unit and gear set down the road. Right now I'm tring to get my car on the road again. I'll save up for that next.

Black is Best

Also, Where is the best place to take the rear to get the axle tubes welded?
Should I take to to a place that does rearends or can I take to a muffler shop or something like that?

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

The housing is cast iron, the tubes are steel. It's best to use a high nickel rod/wire for that. A muffler shop could lay a bead on it with mild steel wire, but there's a good chance it'll crack away from the housing.
I'd take it to a professional welding/fabrication shop. Call around and ask if they can weld cast iron, when you find a place that can/will, ask them how much to weld that. I can't imagine it being that pricey.

16-TA-1815 at
http://www.thunderracing.com/catalog...vid=6&pcid=210

7.5" = 7.625", they are exactly the same in every way, except the ring gear is a tad larger. The solid pinion spacer is the same.
You have to remove the pinion to get to it, which means removing the gears and carrier. Maybe wait to do this one when you replace the posi unit.

Black is Best

Ok I'll call around and ask about the welding. Does anyone know much much it actually helps. If it doesn't strengthen it up that much I'm not too worried about it.

Thanks for the link! But what good is the stud kit? And is the stud kit just thouse 2 bolts on the middle? Do you have any pics?

So would these 7.5 Motive gears fit?

Sorry about all the questions I know nothing about rearends! I don't want to just go and buy stuff and it not work out right.

You 2 have been very helpful so far.

Thanks

Shagwell

The housing is cast steel, the tubes are steel. It welds fine with a MIG, its even ok with just flux core. - Any decent welding shop can do it, just make sure they do it in small sections and rotate until finished. If they start at one spot and just go around, it may pull the tubes crooked in the housing.

Until you're going to change the gears, don't worry about the solid spacer. It is an important piece for strength, but requires some shimming and such that you might as well do it along with a gear swap.

- 10 bolts are fine down to a 3.73 gear. Any lower(numerically higher) and they won't stay together. The smaller pinion is less tolerant of case flex and starts to break things. I was running 11.7's on mine, some have gone into the 10's on built 10-bolts. - I'm going to be running a 8.8 in my new chassis.

Black is Best

OK so it can be MIG welded. And small sections. Got it! Thanks!

So going with 4.10's is bad?

Black is Best

2 more questions.
I drained just about all the gear oil of of the rear but I want to get every bit of it out. What is the easiest way to do this. I have some engine degreaser. Will that work? If I do use the engine degreaser can I just rinse it out with water. I didn't know if spraying water in it would be bad or not.

I You can see in the pics below that that seal is leaking. So my question is, That is the the pinion seal right? If so this will work right?



Thanks for everyones patience with all my questions.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

Yea, those gears would work. 3.73 is steep, you sure that's what you want? Just making sure. You'll also want to make sure you get the right speedometer gear so your speedo is right. But we'll cross that bridge when we come to it.

I'm inclined to disagree with Shagwell on it being cast steel. We had an argument a while ago on the board about that, and a lot of opinions were thrown out, without a lot of facts. I think I remember pushing EDE to prove to me that the 3rd gen rear is a "modern" rearend, but I think the discussion fell by the wayside. You can use a small hardness tester to find out, or grab a JY housing a break a piece off and ask a metallurgist. Heck, i'd probably be able to tell you, i've just (thankfully) never broken my housing. But yea, Shagwell is dead to rights on the welding technique. If you put too much heat into one side, it'll pull the housing and it'll either have toe in/out, or be misaligned to the point where you're going through bearings like crazy.

The higher the number of gear ratio, means one of the 2 (ring or pinion), must physically change its size. Guess how big the ring gear is? 7.5" (or 7.625", that's from 2.73 (or, gasp lower), all the way up to 4.10's (or, gasp, higher). So guess what has to change? PINION! So yea, 2.73's have the big pinion, 4.10's have a teeny one. Teeny is easier to break. Also, 4.10's would make your first gear a truck creeper gear. I doubt you really "need" that much gear. Depending on engine power output (and powerband actually), and tire size, that's what will determine your rear gears. I'd be most inclined to stay with 3.23's actually, or go to 3.73's if you're so inclined. I wouldn't recommend anything else. (3.42 is fine, but only if you think you're getting a significant strength upgrade with those gears, going from 3.23 ->3.42 is a minuscule change).

Yea, that pinion seal is what you need, sorta. Sofakingdom says that (IIRC here), if your pinion seal is leaking, that is the effect. The cause is a worn out pinion bearing (head or tail, I forget). So yea, new pinion bearings, new seal, now you've got the pinion out, might as well throw on the solid spacer again eh? Then you shouldn't put it all back together with the stock posi, I swear it'll be the first thing to break. Anyway, you'd have to re-setup the backlash all over again when you get a new carrier anyway... (usually).

So, you can spend the big bucks now, or go part way and do it later, but removing the rear end is kinda a pain, do you really want to do it twice? Also, pulling out the carrier is hard (got some pry bars?). Again, I don't want to do it twice but i'm going to have to (no money for me to get a posi, I bought an open carrier :gasp.

Use brake-kleen, or whatever brand name is the cheapest for what i'm talking about, and paper towels. Try not to leave a lot of paper towel threads in there. Lint free towels if you can find them (like unicorns here...)

When you're looking in the rear end, you see the two bearing caps on each side? They have bolts that take a 5/8" socket IIRC. Two bolts per side. Well, those bearing caps are the main thing (only thing) keeping the carrier, and ring gear in position. You absolutely want it to remain in perfect alignment for maximum strength, any misalignment causes incredibly fast failure. So anything you can do to keep those aligned is a good thing. Studs give more clamp strength and help keep those caps down. The axle girdle has preload studs to add some preload to those bearing caps as well, and distribute the load over the THICK girdle, and out to the 10 bolts.

Yea, no water in the rear end, rust sucks.

And you'll need a tool to remove the yoke on the pinion, so you can get to the pinion seal. I'm not sure if you can do the pinion seal without removing the pinion (maybe you can), and give that a try for now, who knows, you might get lucky. This tool consists of a long bar, with two holes in the end, so you can bolt it to the yoke and stand on the end of the bar to hold it still. Then you need a 1 1/4" socket, and a huge breaker bar for that nut. You replace the nut, you don't reuse it. And loctite it.

Black is Best

Ok gears aren't a big issue right now. I'll worry about that when I figure out exactly what I'm going to do with my engine.

I'll just take it to get it done somewhere. I know how to weld but I would rather someone else be at risk. I would hate to warp it. Do you know how much strength I will actually get out of doing this. Is it enough to matter?

I don't want to keep anything stock inside the rear in the long run so I will either go 3.42 or 3.73. But like I stated earlier I will have to figure that out with everything else. I can't believe I never realized the higher numerical the gear the smaller the teeth. Making it easier to break. I guess as long as I'm running a 7.5in 10 bolt I won't go past 3.73 for sure.

Ok so it is the pinion seal but the cause is more than likely because of the front or rear pinion bearings. So to solve everything this kit will work? I don't trust myself to do all of this so I guess I will be taking it somewhere to get everything done. I have a buddy that knows someone so the labor shouldn't cost me too much. So I will also get the solid spacer. I have heard some about crush sleeves. What are these good for and are they worth it? I found this one. It is only $6 so might as well.
BTW what is IIRC?

I just don't have the money to buy a new posi or gear set right now. So I guess I will be doing all this again down the road. O well.

So use brake cleaner to clean it all out? I'm glad I haven't already did this with the water and all. that could have been pretty bad. But if I'm going to take it to a place to get everything installed I'm going to let them clean it.

I saw the two bearing caps on each side that you are talking about. I also saw the 2 bolts per side. So the girdle itself has studs on it or is it the 2 bolt holes that are in the canter of the girdle. Does this girdle come with the studs. I think that is what I'm reading on it. I like the TA performance one but I don't want to buy the kit separate of the girdle. It is already more expensive.
Do you have any pics that can help explain any of this too me?

If I can get away with taking off the yoke and getting the seal in there how long will it last if the pinion bearings are bad? I would like to do everything myself for cost purposes.

Sonix

iTrader: (1)

That Ratech install kit is what you want. It comes with a crush sleeve, but a solid pinion spacer replaces the crush sleeve.

You don't need that kit until you replace the gears and or posi.
I just measure the old crush sleeve in there, then stack shims on my solid spacer until i'm about .002" or so taller, and use that. If i'm ok with the amount of torque to turn over the pinion, i'm done.

So the studs i'm talking about for $25 replace those bolts in the bearing caps.

The girdle also has some studs, those are the 2 bolts closest to the center, furthest "outwards" on the girdle. Those just add some extra strength to the bearing caps.

Pinion seal alone? Who knows if it'll stop the leak for long, that's rolling the dice i'd say.

Welding the tubes - personally I don't think it's that crucial. I don't think our cars suffer from that problem that much, but the guys on the 2nd gen boards think it's a worthwhile mod. Usually you do it because it's cheap and easy to do, and nice peace of mind.

Here's some reading if you never saw it before
https://www.thirdgen.org/beefinguprear

Might clear up some stuff. FWIW (for what it's worth), I used a zytanium cross pin, for $70 or something ridiculous. It's not necessary unless you're offroading, and having the 'car' (truck) on a severe angle sideways. I toasted mine when I killed my posi unit

IIRC = If I recall correctly.

Black is Best

Ok so I'll wait to get that kit sometime down the road. along with the posi and gears.

Ok I did know the solid spacer replaced the crush sleeve. That clears up some.

The seal isn't too expensive so I guess I will be getting it to solve the problem for atleast a little while, or atleast til I have the money to buy everything else.

So I'm iffy on welding the tubes. Unless I can find someone that knows they can do it. I might wait til I take the rear to get the posi and gears put in. I'm sure a they can do it.

I have read the tech article before. But it makes a whole lot more since to me know.

I don't think I'm going to get the zytanium cross pin.

Thanks for everything. You have been more than helpful.

Zack