Will the adapter plate used to mate an LS T56 to an early SBC also work to mate a 03 Cobra T56 to a SBC? I found one cheap that just needs a new syncro and since I'm a tech at Ford, this is not that big a deal.

 

The ford T56 input shaft will have a different length, spline and pilot from a GM one. The adaptor plate will mount, but the input shaft and/or crank/pilot/clutch-disc will need to be dealt with.

 

So if I get this trans, the syncro to fix it, an LS input shaft, adapter plate, and T5 bellhousing and clutch that should work? Because I added this up and minus the cluch, I'm still under a grand.

 

Ok, well I talked to the guy today and the trans is mine! Picking it up tomorrow.

Now, while I'm in there what else should I replace. I've heard about carbon fiber rings and billet keys and stuff like that, but what is considered a must upgrade? I'm not making any more power than the Cobra that this thing came out of so I'm thinking I shouldnt need to upgrage much. Or is that wrong?

Also, are there any certain clutches I should stay away from? I'm looking at a few right now. I dont have a ton of extra money to spend on the clutch right now. $300 or so is about it. I dont think I need a real powerful now anyways. Are the ones from McLeod, Zoom, and Centerforce any good? By the way, I'm going to be using a T5 bellhousing so the clutch would be for that.

And also, since I am using the adapter plate and T5 bellhousing, I can just use 3rd gen pedals, master and slave cylinders, and clutch and not have to mod any of it? Do the pedals have to be from a V8 car or can they be from a V6 car?

 

What does everyone think of this clutch? I have no plans to upgrade the motor anytime soon and the car will see stree tires 99% of the time as I dont even own slicks yet.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/MCL-75225/

 

The Ford T56 uses different gear ratios, thus you need a ford input shaft to match those ratios. You can't just mix and match input shafts.

 

I emailed Thegearbox.org and the guy there said I could put an LS input shaft in. I hope so cuz if not, I'm screwed.

According to wikipedia, 1st,2nd,and 3rd are the same ratio between the LS T56 and the 03-04 Cobra. Its just the overdrives that are different.

 

Looks like the 03-04 cobra's were unique in this way, so it sounds like it should work.. All the other Ford T56s are different. Sounds like you have a nice project in the works.

 

Yeah its going to be unique. Its going to be a Cobra trans with an aftermarket adapter plate with an LS input shaft using a T5 bellhousing and clutch

I just got back from picking the trans up though so the project has officially started. I'm hoping to have the car driving in no more than 3 weeks. I am lucky that I'm a tech at a Ford dealership so the swap is going to be done on a lift and I have all my tools there.

 

What is the name of the adpater plate do bhave or what site did u get it from

 

I'm getting the adapter plate along with the syncro and a few other things from thegearbox.org

http://www.thegearbox.org/catalog/it...17/4803441.htm

 

Is there anything wrong with using a plastic master and slave cylinder? Advanced Auto Parts has aluminum ones online that I'd have to order or is using the plastic ones in stock ok?

 

And here it is. I forgot that the tailshaft was going to be different but thats no big deal. I had already planed on fabricating a crossmember to allow me more room for exhaust and I have the Spohn torque arm so I'm not mounting that on the trans. Being that this is from a Cobra, I dont have to wire the CAGS becuase its not there.

I pulled the tailshaft off earlier tonight to check the magnets and was pleased to see what appears to be just normal stuff on them. I did see what looks like the tip of one of the teeth of a syncro but I already know the 1-2 syncro is shot so hopefully its just from that. I'm going to try to get this thing torn down Monday so I can start ordering stuff.

 

Nice.. Take some pics of the pieces on the magnets. You'll also need a new slip-yoke and shorter driveshaft. The VSS setup is different, you'll need to be creative or run it through a dakota box.

 

I know I need to shorten my driveshaft but thegearbox.org also said they had the same output shaft as the LS T56. I'll pull my DS out Monday and check to be sure. There is a place just a few minutes from my work that can shorten the DS and rebalance it.

As far as the speedo goes, that is one of the benifits of having an Auto Meter programable speedometer like I have. The speedo is made to work off just about any signal. I'll just have to reprogram it (which only consist of driving 2 miles) when I'm done.

I realize that my swap is unique and different than what most people are use to doing so I plan on taking lots of pictures and documenting everything I have to do here.

 

Cool Setup. Keep us posted. I did a T56 swap, nothing as unique as yours. The local Trans guy changed out a bunch of the stock inards with stuff from the viper and cobra. I wish I would of been more involved. Supposedly I am good for 500 ftlbs now. It shifts really solid. So evidently, for the most part the cases and a couple parts are the only thing seperating the big three on this common platform.

 

Ok, got the trans torn apart today which means I have more questions

First off, I found out the blocking ring (?) for second gear is broken like I thought. There is a tooth missing from it and it is actually cracked in half right there as well. So, do I need to buy a complete syncro, or can I buy the kit that has all the syncro rings? The synro is hard to get to go into 2nd but you can watch the ring spread apart as your trying. If you can get the ring to stay together, it will pop into 2nd like normal.

The broken tooth is directly in front of the key.


Second thing. I dont think I need a new 2nd gear but can someone look at this picture and tell me. I know its a little blury but you can see some wear on the tip of a few of the teeth. Its not all the way around the gear and its not deep into the teeth.


Third, would I be ok running a stock replacement flywheel from Auto Zone? I really dont have the money for good one but dont want a stock one to come apart on me either. If I need to order a decent one it will be a steel one becuase I really dont have the money for aluminum and dont think I really need it. If I do order one, and I know I'm going to sound like a complete idiot on this, do I need an internal or external balance? I could have sworn my motor is internally balanced but almost all the flywheels on Summits site say external when I put my car in. Its a 1 piece rear main block.

Fourth, are Zoom clutches ok? I've done a decent amount of reading and found some complaints about McLeod, Centerforce, and a lot about Spec. Found a few good reports about Zoom and not much bad but figured I'd ask here.

Fifth, how important are things like billet keys? And also, is this a steel 3-4 fork? There was only one aluminum one in the trans and that was 1-2. A magnet stuck to it so I know its stell but I thought only the Viper trans came with a steel fork. Am I missing something or has someone already been in this trans? The 1-2 fork is on top, the 3-4 on the bottom.

 

The blocker ring is a wear item and would come with the basic
rebuild kit. You won't need a new synchro (hub and sleeve) unless
the pointed engagement teeth are rounded off.


Gear teeth all look fine.. I'd be more concerned about the engagement teeth on the gear, and there's no good photo of them.


I'll defer clutch/FW questions to others.. They seem to be a religion to some and I don't get into those discussions.


Billet keys are very important IMHO.. Over 75% of the units I've repaired have broken keys as the main problem. Likewise for bronze fork pads. I've had brand new units with 3,000 miles lose a gear+synchro from a stock fork pad breaking off.. I think I can almost see a broken key in your first picture of the blocker ring?

What you have is a steel 3-4 fork. They were standard fair in vipers as far back as 1995, in GM units in 2003 and likewise for Ford I guess..

 

Allright cool. The wear pattern between gears is good. Its right in the middle of 2nd gear and the counter shaft. The syncro teeth look good as well so thats good I dont have to buy that either.

Thanks for the info.

 

Would it be a huge deal if I didnt get the billet keys or bronze pads for reverse? Money is extremely tight and that would save almost $100 and I figure I'll never be slamming it into reverse.

 

IMHO, I would keep the bronze pads on all four forks, and don't put billet keys on Rev and then 5-6 if you need to save $.

 

That will work. Thanks.

 

All right. Well I spent $825 today. I bought the basic rebuild kit from thegearbox.org which consits of front and rear seals, carbon fiber syncro rings, keys, fork pads, and maybe one or two other small things. I upgraded to billet keys for the 1-2 and 3-4 syncros and got bronze pads all the way around. I also ordered the adapter plate, LS input shaft, extended piolt bushing, and snap ring kit. If I wind up needing shims, I can order them through work. Hopefully by next Friday the trans will be back together. I dont know when I'm going to actually get to put it in as money is about gone. I dont need that much more stuff but I do need to order the clutch and I need to find a T5 bellhousing/fork, and 3rd gen pedal assembly.

One question for when I'm looling for a bellhousing, do the T5's use a thin plate between the block and bellhousing? I work on Fords and basically all of them use this plate. Didnt know if the Chevy's do to.

Also, are the pedals on a V8 car and a V6 car the same?

 

Did you ever verify the output shaft mating to your driveshaft/slip-yoke? I think you'll need a larger ford slip-yoke, and thus the GM output seal in the kit won't fit either?

T5's don't have a block plate.

Pedals are the same in V8 and V6 F-body's.

 

I haven't verfied on the car yet, but thegearbox said it would fit. He said it shared the 27 spline output. He did ask me exactly what trans it was for. This was for the rebuild kit. So if the seal is different than I am getting the Ford one. If I can remember tomorrow I'll pull the driveshaft and check.

 

Nice swap...you are doing what I am going to be doing with my 406 and LS T-56.

On the pedals...I had researched this and found a few guys that advocated using the 4th gen pedals due to engagement point...

Anyone shed more light on this?

 

I think everyone is using 4th gen pedals because they are using the LT1 trans with the LT1 clutch. The way I'm doing it lets me use a T5 bellhousing and clutch which is the setup the car would have come with if it was a factory manual car. This lets me use the 3rd gen pedals and hydraulics with no modifications needed to any of it. At least thats how I understand it. We'll see what happens

 

I counted the splines on the output shaft just now and it is indeed a 27 spline shaft.

 

Would it be ok if I used a small propane torch to heat up the two torx head bolts on top of the case? I dont know what kind of loc-tite they used on them but I swear you could glue your wheels to the car with that stuff and they'd stay on. I have already broken two torx sockets trying to get them out. I just want to heat up the loc-tite to try to break it up a little.

 

Yes.. You have to use a torch on the guide pins to remove them.. If the head of the pin breaks, you'll be in for a PITA...

 

Third gens had a lighter 16lb flywheel for 86+ engines and a heavier ~30lb flywheel. IMO the 16lb one is fine; it saves a little weight but it's still easy to launch from a stop; works fine for street / strip. If you order for a 91 Z28 and verify it's the 16lb one from Autozone, you're good.

You'll see complaints about everyone. IMO, McLeod makes good product, but be careful with their line of "put this trans. with this engine with this clutch" adaptation parts.

I'm not hard on clutches. I have a stocker replacement behind a L69 305 w/ TPI. My friends car has a 408 and he uses a stock type clutch that is relined w/ ceramic by a brake and clutch exchange place. It has held up well and is just a little bit more grabby.

You would be fine to use third gen or 93-97 LT1 T56hydraulics. There are reputedly some minor differences in the third-gen through fourth gen pedal position for the master cylinder. Look into that, but all will fit your car (cut off the accel. from 4th gen pedals)

I use a heat gun and a Torx-Plus 40 (Torx+ has more rounded teeth, like a T-47 seatbelt tool) with the end of the teeth lightly ground at the corners and lightly tapped into the bolt. That's the snuggest tool to bolt fit I've found, but it also will break some bolt heads, which I think Mike covered here (along with 800 other things; Go Mike!) I have had a welder get a bolt or two out for me in the past.

 

Cool. Thanks for the info. On the plus side I got some free stuff. Not much though. When I bought the trans the guy still had the shifter base in (Just the nub that sticks out). I was planning on trying to find someone selling the stick or just make one but a guy at work had a Steeda shifter laying around that he had taken off a Mustang and gave it to me. I couldnt use the base as the size is completely different, but the stick I can use. Its a nice aluminum one that has the Z shape to which I'm pretty sure I need. I dont think a srtaight stick would work.

 

The location of the shifter will come up almost exactly where a stock T5 would. All you should need is an aftermarket T56 straight stick. It should have the ~14-17deg angle machined into the mounting to point it at the driver...

 

Oh well. If it doesnt work then it free anyways. The reason though I thought I needed the Mustang shaped shifter is because the shifter hole on my trans seems to be farther foward than the pics I've seen of the LT1 trans. Here is a pic I got from the sticky and then my trans. With the Z shaped stick on, the top of the stick is about where the stick is in the other pic. But it could just be me and I could definetly be wrong. Its been know to happen

 

What you'll end up with is basically the Aftermarket T56 setup:

http://www.sallee-chevrolet.com/Borg.../bwt56pics.cfm

Your shifter is around 2.5inches forward of the LT1, but your bellhousing will be about 2.5inches longer, so it'll be a wash.

 

Ah, I see what you mean on the picture with the T5 and LT1 bellhousings next to each other. Thanks for all your help. I think you've done this once or twice.

 

Ok, got all my stuff in from thegearbox. I'm going to sound like a complete idiot for saying this I know, but I thought the new rings were made out of carbon fiber?

 

The rings themself are made of powdered metal, it's the friction material that's an upgraded CF composite. Your trans is new enough it would have them from the factory, but the older (pre-1998 approx) had a fiber-paper type of friction material.

 

I thought the new ones looked exactly like the old ones. Oh well, I guess new rings all the way around isnt a bad idea since I know I'm going to beat on this thing.

 

Here's the pic I was looking for:



The old paper lined ring is in the foreground.

 

Yea both the new rings and the old rings look exactly like the one in the background. Considering I found a place selling individual carbon rings for a tad over $30 a piece, did I waste a bunch of money to replace them all or is it good insurance?

 

CF rings will wear also, just not as badly as the paper ones. If you're inclined, you can dry the old rings and gears of fluid (paper towel) and apply machinist dye to the gear surface where the blocker rides. After it dries, sit the blocker in place and rotate it with moderate pressure, 90deg in both directions. Inspect the gear surface, if 80%+ of the dye is removed, the ring is still servicable. You may want to keep all the old rings that test good, in case one of your new ones gets burned or cracked and you need a quick/cheap fix.

 

I drove my modified T56 for the first time this weekend. Well worht them money to upgrade. That thing shifts so precise, it is a blast to drive. My small regret may be going with a six puck clutch. It engages tight, but getting around town is dicey.

 

The rings say to soak them for a while before installing them so I need to get fluid for it now. Are you guys running anything special, Amsoil, etc., or is just regular Mercon V ok?

 

Ack... Another religious war will ensue about fluids... ;-) FWIW, I recommend a 500mi break in on DexIII, followed by a flush and fill with Mobil-1 ATF. YMMV. (Make sure you use plenty of Trans Lube when putting it back together, especially in the rear section (5/6/Rev) as they don't get lube during the inital startup. )

 

Sounds good. Should I coat all the bearings and gears with the trans lube? I get it for free so if more is better, then thats fine with me

 

Yup.. Needle bearings, tapered bearings, caged bearings, synchro sliders, synchro keys, anywhere there's metal-metal that may not get ATF until the car is moving..

Just to be clear, trans lube is special as it desolves in ATF at about 130deg. I've seen a few DIY rebuilds come in after a few hundred miles with blockers killed by wheel bearing grease, etc...

 

What I have is trans lube. I dont do transmission work (except cluthes) here at work but we can still get all the different stuff from the parts counter. Thats why I was also hoping Mercon V would be ok. I can get that for free too as it is what Ford uses in most of there cars so we store that in bulk.

 

Question. I found a bellhousing online for $70 including shipping. Does that sound reasonable? I think it does but just wanted someone elses opinion. I cant find anything locally.

 

From a T5 3rdgen F-body?

IMHO, one of the benefits of doing the T56 install this way is that you have access to SFI aftermarket bellhousings. Especially if you're going to be doing any racing with it...