5 speed shifting issues
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Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
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From: St. Louis, MO
Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 5 speed
Axle/Gears: 3.08
5 speed shifting issues
I have an 89 Camaro 305 tbi 5 speed with only 55,000 original miles. I am currently having trouble shifting into gears when the T5 gets warmer or has been ran for a while. Particularly harder in the lower gears. I can shove it harder and it will go in, but usually with a thud. I have found I can time my shifts better in the rpm range and down shift through every gear it will shift through the lower gears better. Any ideas on what possible might be the issue?
Thanks
Thanks
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 19,282
Likes: 103
From: Lawrence, KS
Car: Met. Silver 85 IROC/Sold
Engine: 350 HO Deluxe (350ci/330hp)
Transmission: T-5 (Non-WC)
Axle/Gears: Limited Slip 3.23's
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
I'd go the easy route first and check the fluid level. A small leak often appears at the speedo cable/trans connection when the seals in the gear housing fail.
JamesC
JamesC
Last edited by JamesC; Apr 15, 2011 at 06:32 AM.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: St. Louis, MO
Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 5 speed
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
I've checked the reservoir and it is full. Could it possible be a symptom of the clutch going out. I'm not sure how old the clutch is or how much it has been used.
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 19,282
Likes: 103
From: Lawrence, KS
Car: Met. Silver 85 IROC/Sold
Engine: 350 HO Deluxe (350ci/330hp)
Transmission: T-5 (Non-WC)
Axle/Gears: Limited Slip 3.23's
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,403
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From: ms. gulf coast
Car: 91 R/S , 89 dodge p/u
Engine: L31 GM crate re-cammed , 318
Transmission: T-5 , 4 speed auto
Axle/Gears: 3.42 , ?
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
not the fluid level in the reservior . the fluid level in the transmission . you must get your car on a lift or crawl underneath to check it . good luck .
Junior Member
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
From: Europe
Car: '88 white Iroc-Z
Engine: 305 TPI
Transmission: T5
Axle/Gears: 3.42
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
I had issues too. it was hard to get into gears when warm, reverse was available only with the engine off. I flushed the gearbox first but it didn't solve the problem. Replaced the slave cylinder and bled the system, it didn't solve it either.
Bleeding with the system in place is tough because getting rid of the air trapped in the slave is a pain. I ended up taking it all apart, replaced the master cylinder, reassembled and bled the complete system OUTSIDE the car before reinstalling it as a whole. It works like a charm now, so smooth.
The reservoir barely passes behind the booster but it does work. My old master cylinder was shot. Bleeding outside the car is so much easier than in place.
Bleeding with the system in place is tough because getting rid of the air trapped in the slave is a pain. I ended up taking it all apart, replaced the master cylinder, reassembled and bled the complete system OUTSIDE the car before reinstalling it as a whole. It works like a charm now, so smooth.
The reservoir barely passes behind the booster but it does work. My old master cylinder was shot. Bleeding outside the car is so much easier than in place.
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Re: 5 speed shifting issues
I had a simular problem and it was the clutch fork pivot ball that was a little loose. by tightening it solved the problem. also make sure that your clutch master cylinder is full and properly bled.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: St. Louis, MO
Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 5 speed
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
Hey thanks for all the advice. I plan on first changing the fluid in the trans and bleeding the hydraulic lines, hopefully real soon. Then try other possible options if not fixed. Hope to post back this week with the results.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: St. Louis, MO
Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 5 speed
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 6,521
Likes: 91
From: Aridzona
Car: `86 SS / `87 SS
Engine: L69 w/ TPI on top / 305 4bbl
Transmission: `95 T56 \ `88 200-4R
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
A stock ballstud / pivot ball is threaded into the driver's side of the bellhousing and has an internal hex drive. World Class cases had more material in that area and hydraulic bellhousings had the ballstud further inboard so I forget if this can be driven with the trans. in place or not.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: St. Louis, MO
Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 5 speed
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
Alright unfortunately this week I only had the time to check the clutch fork pivot ball and it is tight, and attempt to change the fluid but who ever owned the car before rounded off the inside of the check plug and so far my attempts have failed to remove it. I can not seem to find the bleed nipple for the hydraulic lines to bleed the lines. Is it suppose to be on the slave cylinder?
Joined: Jul 2000
Posts: 6,521
Likes: 91
From: Aridzona
Car: `86 SS / `87 SS
Engine: L69 w/ TPI on top / 305 4bbl
Transmission: `95 T56 \ `88 200-4R
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
Stock third gens have one on top of the slave cylinder.
Aftermarket ones should too.
LT1 T56 slave cylinders don't.
Aftermarket ones should too.
LT1 T56 slave cylinders don't.
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iTrader: (1)
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 2,403
Likes: 4
From: ms. gulf coast
Car: 91 R/S , 89 dodge p/u
Engine: L31 GM crate re-cammed , 318
Transmission: T-5 , 4 speed auto
Axle/Gears: 3.42 , ?
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
have you ckd. the fluid level in the transmission yet ? if not your tranny may be toast if you have continued drive it . it may cost a few bux to get filler plug removed , but that would be nothing compared to a new/re-built transmission . good luck .
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,359
Likes: 5
From: Pennsylvania
Car: 1992 Camaro RS
Engine: Rebuilt 350 going in after paint
Transmission: WCT5, 7k & counting behind the 350
Axle/Gears: 4thgen disc rear w/ 3.73 Posi
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
The easiest way to bleed the slave cylinder that I have found is to unbolt the slave cylinder from the bellhousing and slowly push the rod in by hand. Make sure the reservoir is full before you start and go slowly. It should only take 2-3 strokes to completely bleed it.
Have you checked the clutch disc yet? It may be worn out and not disengaging fully. That would explain why its easier to shift if you match the rpms properly.
I would also make sure the clutch fork has not slipped off the pivot ball, or that the little retainer spring on the back of the fork is broke. Its a small spring steel clip with 2 fingers that go around the pivot ball to hold the fork tight to the pivot ball. If one of those fingers is broke it can cause the problems you are seeing.
Have you checked the clutch disc yet? It may be worn out and not disengaging fully. That would explain why its easier to shift if you match the rpms properly.
I would also make sure the clutch fork has not slipped off the pivot ball, or that the little retainer spring on the back of the fork is broke. Its a small spring steel clip with 2 fingers that go around the pivot ball to hold the fork tight to the pivot ball. If one of those fingers is broke it can cause the problems you are seeing.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: St. Louis, MO
Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 5 speed
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
Yea, the T5 has trans fluid, I took off the shifter plate and can see fluid in the trans, I just really wanna be able to change it. Hope to bleed the slave cylinder within the next few days. Thanks for all the advice.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: St. Louis, MO
Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 5 speed
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
If you take off the shifter and shift plate can you add fluid from there cause I can see some fluid in there, and if so then I don't have to worry about getting the check plug out and can just fill it up that way. Also how do you check your clutch disc? I have a feeling that is it, the slave cylinder and master cylinder have all been replaced within the last 6 months.
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,359
Likes: 5
From: Pennsylvania
Car: 1992 Camaro RS
Engine: Rebuilt 350 going in after paint
Transmission: WCT5, 7k & counting behind the 350
Axle/Gears: 4thgen disc rear w/ 3.73 Posi
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
Yes, you can add fluid from there. Just pour slowly as it has only a small drain hole in the bottom.
To check the clutch you have to remove the inspection cover on the lower front part of the bellhousing and look up inside between the flywheel and pressure plate. Its pretty hard if not impossible to do. Its usually easier to just pull the trans and bellhousing and check it.
After re-reading your initial post, I'm wondering if maybe your synchros are worn. Difficulty engaging gears that gets better/goes away when you properly match RPMs is usually a good sign of worn synchros. They should last much more than 55k miles, but if the PO of the car was hard on the trans, or didn't know how to drive a manual its possible.
To check the clutch you have to remove the inspection cover on the lower front part of the bellhousing and look up inside between the flywheel and pressure plate. Its pretty hard if not impossible to do. Its usually easier to just pull the trans and bellhousing and check it.
After re-reading your initial post, I'm wondering if maybe your synchros are worn. Difficulty engaging gears that gets better/goes away when you properly match RPMs is usually a good sign of worn synchros. They should last much more than 55k miles, but if the PO of the car was hard on the trans, or didn't know how to drive a manual its possible.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: St. Louis, MO
Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 5 speed
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
Yea that's my worst fear that it is the synchros, which was my original thought but because of the low miles and the off and on being able to shift it easy and not. I'm hoping it is just the clutch disc, cause it feels to me the clutch just is not engaging all the way when the shifting gets tough. Thanks for the help though, I know I need to change the fluid in the trans and will do that within the next two days.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: St. Louis, MO
Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 5 speed
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
Hey, sorry for no update lately. I had an issue with the Vats security and now have it fixed, and have continued diagnoses. I have bleed the slave now and no fix. It has gotten colder in my area and as a result the car has been shifting a lot easier. I have also purchased a new clutch kit, and plan to take the tranny out soon. Allowing me thus to be able to finally get that plug out, change the fluid, completely check the clutch pivot fork, and etc. Anything else I may wanna look for while changing the clutch?
Thanks
Thanks
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iTrader: (3)
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,359
Likes: 5
From: Pennsylvania
Car: 1992 Camaro RS
Engine: Rebuilt 350 going in after paint
Transmission: WCT5, 7k & counting behind the 350
Axle/Gears: 4thgen disc rear w/ 3.73 Posi
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
While its not likely to be causing your problems, check your flywheel for scoring, excessive wear, and cracks while you have everything apart. I would also measure the thickness to see if its been shaved at all. If it has, it needs to have a spacer between the flywheel and crankshaft in order to ensure proper engagement of the clutch disc. Like I said, it doesn't sound like its causing your problems, but I'd check it anyhow while you have it all apart.
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
hi there, The clutch fork pivot ball ajusting head is located on the face of the bell housing right near the transmission mounting bolts and you will need a good size allen wrench to do the job. good luck and hope that this is the problem, it was mine.
Thread Starter
Junior Member
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 24
Likes: 0
From: St. Louis, MO
Car: 1989 Camaro RS
Engine: 305 TBI
Transmission: 5 speed
Axle/Gears: 3.08
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
I am glad to say that replacing the clutch and flywheel has fixed the issue. The flywheel was the original flywheel and looked to have been turned and the clutch was just complete shot! It's is so much more of a pleasure to drive now. If only I wouldn't have scratched my brand new magnaflow tips test driving it afterwards cause some one cut me off into a ditch i couldnt have asked for a better procedure. Thanks to all for the advice!
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 17
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From: Nanaimo B.C.
Car: 1991 z28 Coupe
Engine: 305 LB9
Transmission: 5 SPD MAN
Axle/Gears: 3:42 G92
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
I have a 1991 Z28 5 speed manual (305) and must have my clutch right pedal pushed right into the firewall in order the transmission to shift smoothly without grinding gears . Not sure what is causing this. Is this a symptom of a clutch needing replacement ? Would appreciate anyones advice.
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,589
Likes: 2
From: British Columbia
Car: 90 IROC 5.7 hardtop
Engine: L98
Transmission: T5 swap
Axle/Gears: Yup -- they still work
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
... I would also measure the thickness to see if its been shaved at all. If it has, it needs to have a spacer between the flywheel and crankshaft in order to ensure proper engagement of the clutch disc. Like I said, it doesn't sound like its causing your problems, but I'd check it anyhow while you have it all apart.
I recently had my flywheel surfaced. I don't think they took more than 1/1000 off it, just enough to present a fresh surface to the new clutch. I did not use a spacer.
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,359
Likes: 5
From: Pennsylvania
Car: 1992 Camaro RS
Engine: Rebuilt 350 going in after paint
Transmission: WCT5, 7k & counting behind the 350
Axle/Gears: 4thgen disc rear w/ 3.73 Posi
Re: 5 speed shifting issues
I had never heard of it either until I needed to get mine done during my V8 swap. I picked up a used V8 flywheel for the swap and it was pretty worn. The guy at the machine shop told me about it and I confirmed with a good friend of mine who has been a mechanic for many years. Since the hydraulic clutch setups are not adjustable, the spacer makes up for the difference in thickness from having the flywheel shaved.
I had mine taken down several thousandths though so you may not need it if was only smoothed out.
I had mine taken down several thousandths though so you may not need it if was only smoothed out.
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