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Hi guys that know way more than me! My 92 5.0 TBI with the T5 trans just stopped functioning. Combination of possible hydraulic issues with an apparent throw out bearing failure.
I've replaced the clutch twice over the years with widely different outcomes. Went to a "clutch house" and I found out later they installed a LUK clutch which is apparently cheap lightweight stuff from
Kragens or somebody, that didn't last long. The last one was way more heavy duty, I think the girl at the desk called it a Gorilla clutch. Don't know if she made that up or where it came from. It has lasted over ten years.The car is high miles and stock. I just need it to work properly and don't need any high performance stuff or anything. Does anyone know if any clutches from parts stores are good enough for my needs or
what might you recommend. I don't have much cash but I don't want to cheap out to the point of shooting myself in the foot.
Appreciate any helpful information. Thanks and have at great day!
Henry
I just took a T5 setup out of a 91 RS TBI and it had a Luk clutch that had completely ripped apart. Looked really cheap. I bought the Summit Racing clutch kit (TOB, align tool, pilot bearing). Looks good. Especially for about $100 shipped. Haven't put it in yet.
I just installed a clutch in my 91 Formula. Got a Sachs kit from my wholesale (Worldpac). Much nicer than the LUK that I pulled out - idiot previous owner put in the TOB backwards..... Came with a steel sleeve release bearing and bronze bush for the pilot. I would avoid any kit that has a needle bearing pilot. That's usually asking for problems. My price (including next day AM delivery from CA to OR) was $128.
Feels normal. Pedal effort is smooth. I resurfaced the flywheel and I don't have any complaints. Engages smooth and holds properly for burn outs. The Formula has the 3.42 posi so I tested it right away in my parking lot. It leaves smoke on command. I can see that I'll be blowing through tires.
Incidentally, the clutch is very easy to replace on the T5 cars. I could probably do the whole job in two hours if I wanted to hustle.
GD
Last edited by GeneralDisorder; Jul 6, 2019 at 12:55 AM.
Thanks for the thoughts being shared. I'm still trying to figure out how to budget for this. Summit seems to have some pretty good looking stuff. I think I was told when the last clutch was put in like 12 years ago that the flywheel couldn't be turned down any more so I guess a new one is in order also, and they seem to have some good choices there too. Pilot bushing vs. bearing seems to be the consensus all around. Summit seems to have them in bronze as well as brass? I thought brass was kinda soft for this? And some reviewers of the bushings say they get tighter when installed and need to be honed out to work. Is this just a result of bad installation or something that actually needs to be dealt with?
Thanks again for your valued experience and advice
Henry
Historically, by the time one of my beaters needs a clutch, it's easiest to just get a new flywheel and whatever clutch kit. A little comparison shopping between Advance Auto (retailmenot.com coupon codes), Rock Auto (Vendor review forum for coupon codes), etc usually makes one deal or another stand out. It's not as though a great clutch is really necessary between a low output 305 and a T5. I can't see a mid grade parts store clutch being a liability.
OOPS, I thought I found them both after putting in my car's info but must have missed . I'm guessing 26 spline is the right one.
Too much overthinking how to get this done. With all the noise and vibration going on.
I'm starting to wonder if the fork and pilot whatever are toast but I guess waiting until I get it open to
find out is a good idea.
Thanks
26 sounds right for a V8. V6s were 10 if I remember correctly, could be confusing it with the Brand F in the driveway as it's 10t with the 2.3L and T5.
The fork is usually OK even with a lot of miles. The pivot stud might look mushroomed to hell. I'd probably clean everything REALLY good, then use a good grease to lube the pivot/socket joint between the stud and fork, the plastic cap on the slave cylinder rod should be enough lube between the slave and fork, but a dab of grease never hurt nobody.
Replace the pilot. It should come with the clutch kit in most cases. Needle bearings should come pre-lubed, if it's dry or a bushing, grease again. Loan a tool usually has a stand-alone pilot puller, or the style that attaches to a slide hammer, or pack the cavity with grease and slip a tight fitting punch in, and pop it with a mallet to drive the bearing/bushing out. Last one I pulled out of a LB9 was stuck so hard it broke two or three of Advance Auto's puller tools, ended up sticking the fingers of the tool in the hole, rammed another tool in the middle between the jaws, and beat the living be-jesus out of it with whatever wrench was handy... Came right out at that point. Pot metal tool that had been abused by previous borrowers.
Well I found the money to do this so it's on! Advance auto parts here(Car quest) seems to have some good deals going and their master and slave cylinders are aluminum instead of plastic and that seems like a good thing. Only thing that made me pause was the flywheel they have is made in China. It looks pretty good and is the same one Summit has. It says it the perfection brand. Any thoughts on that?
My fork boot is shot and Hawks seems like the only option. Seems like I kinda need that to be not falling apart as it is now. 'I guess the bigger reveal is taking it out and apart to assess the actual damage and solutions
that are required. Oh goody... LYK how it goes
Thanks to all for guidance
LUK must suck for domestic but they make most honda clutches factory and I see them over 200K miles on 280hp motors all the time.
I have been very happy with my spec clutch kit and hays bearing. I have their flywheel and stage 1 behind my 350 working great. Generally I toss the TO bearings that come with SBC clutches and get a hays one from holly.
The fun just keeps on coming. Lots of abnormal wear abounds. The pivot was really worn so much that wear on the pressure plate fingers was all uneven and the extra fork movement or something broke off the front of the front bearing retainer in the trans. Anybody have or know where to find the 13-52-027-912 front bearing retainer? I've looked online but they are either all sold or for an S10 which is a different part #. I'm thinking this is a necessary part to have and will post under parts wanted. I haven't seen the pilot bushing yet since my neighbor mechanic buddy got it out but he says it's pretty worn also. At least the output shaft that rides in it is still good. Seems fixable if I can just find the part.
Thanks again
Henry
The bearing retainer might be a problem. In the Brand F world, F-Racing Parts sells a couple steel bearing retainers. I had one on the 86 T5 I was using, when I replaced it with a 88 T5 from another car the steel retainer wouldn't swap with the later trans. Went looking for the right retainer for the newer trans, and found that they were long since 'no longer available'. And that for a F application that couldn't be more common.
I ended up using a good Timken TOB, and a very VERY thin coating of Mobil 1 grease on the retainer. It's hasn't given me any trouble since. You might have to settle for used, or look into some kind of repair sleeve.
Geez. I've never seen that. I think the retainer is the same for all T5's. However, IIRC, it plays a part in shimming the input shaft play. I don't recall where the shims go but you may need to reset the play. Just a thought. I didn't look anything up. Lazy lately.
It seems they are plentiful for S-10s, but not our cars. It's what the TO bearing rides on and helps explain the sudden noises, vibrations and failure to go into or out of gear without cramming it noisily in.
Yep, looks like I'll be lucky to even find a used one; that hasn't gone so well so far but I haven't looked everywhere yet...
Thanks, found a bunch of discount codes for Advance on line and that looks like what I'll use. The CARQUEST warehouse is out by the airport so we'll try and see what we can look at before ordering online or whatever you have to do to get the discounts
Well, thanks. I've located everything needed, a used bearing retainer and a seal for the back of it as well as all clutch parts being replaced. I believe I've found the culprit besides the leaking slave and master cylinders
The fork pivot looks like it was never replaced in either of the last two clutch jobs, the last one 12 years ago. The last guy may have turned it some, hard to say, but old wear removed a whole side of it and more shiny wear is all on the other side throwing the geometry all off and putting pressure on the bearing retainer tube until it broke. Here's a pic of it. That sound like a likely scenario to you? Also the fork didn't have one shiny round contact area but shiny slide marks in both directions...
Hi, having issues with the bearing retainer I though was on the way. The old one broke off right at the base. Would having it welded by the right person make it strong enough or is that just asking for it
Thanks
No, that seems like a dumb idea. Now the USPS seems to have misplaced or lost the bearing retainer that was supposed to be here today. Tracking says it's still on the way but it failed to reach the next stop in three days that should have taken 2-3 hours. It's impossible to get a straight answer out of those guys AAHHHHHH !
Sorry, had to vent somewhere.....
sorry about the ranting. Apparently the box missed scans or something at several stops and showed up in town after midnite. Makes no sense but supposedly out for delivery
Doubt if one truck came all the way from Wilbur, Oregon to Bakersfield, but that's what tracking shows. I'll calm way down when all needed parts are in hand...
All done and normal once again. Geez, I stressed over this too much. Must be the 100+ degree days around here
Got it all with 25% off from Advance. Should last longer than the last crummy clutch job. Now if the engine would just hang in there...
Thanks for all the tips and advice
Henry
