A friend of mine gave me two x2 700r4 transmissions along with a slew of new parts. He’s sold his house and has no place to put any of it. So far, I have not opened up either transmission. He doesn’t know anything about either transmission except what he pulled it out of. ......I have never built a gm transmission. I’ve built mopar torqueflites. He told me that the 700r4 was not bullet proof like the torqueflites I’m used to working on and that a lot of upgrades and parts needed to be put into them to make them last under decent power. Then......he proceeded to open up a container of parts......and said “good luck” your gonna need it”
.....they will be going in a Chevy 350 79 trans am with a 600cfm Holley vacuum secondary carburetor. It has a turbo 350 in it right now that’s blown up. Lost all forward gears but kept reverse only. So my buddy just said “take these two and do what you can with them”

One of them is a 92 model 2TBM. It has a large K on it and comes with a 4 bolt torque converter cover that’s aluminum with 2 bosses for some sort of supports that he said were for arms that go to the engine. He told me that it came from a Silverado truck. The transmission fluid smells burned. He never saw the engine or transmission running. He did say that it had a 350V8. The speedometer has some kind of electrical plug. Obviously my 79 trans am has a cable drive. This came with no converter.

The other had a number you could barely see. I had to clean the grime off of it and then take pictures of the number and it was still hard even with photo editing and photo light changes. Eventually I got the number. It was 9YTM and was supposed to come out of an 87 chevy caprice. It has a gear drive like my turbo 350.....but it’s black plastic. I took it out and it’s a similar set up. Nothing electronic about it. The fluid in it doesn’t smell burned. He told me the 4.3 liter engine was running just fine and the transmission was working fine when he pulled it. It does not have the big K on the side of it.....has a plastic torque converter cover and has no bolt holes for the cover like the 92 transmission has. This came with a v6 converter

I tracked the part numbers down of what was in the container

sonnax smart shell.....it comes with some sort of spacer piece and a Torrington bearing. Every part he gave me was still in the box and has not been removed.

Transgo shift kit jr.

29 element borg Warner dual cage forward sprag
Borg Warner reverse sprag

sonnax stator bushing
sonnax wide sun gear bushing

hayden transmission cooler for a car....plate and fin

transgo corvette servo

transgo .5 boost valve

sonnax 3rd ball check valve and cage.....

sonnax 3rd check ball saver....some long pin looking thing that protects the check ball above

sonnax pinless accumulators ......2 of them. One for 1-2 and one for 3-4

aluminum deep pan with fins and no brand name

alto.....reverse drum saver with what looks like a steel. Supposed to replace some Belleville spring

3 viton input to output seals. Kind of looks like a gear made of rubber

transgo sealing ring kit

transgo 3/4 apply springs...CS-7. Suppose to help with high rpm clutch failure

some kit. ....it has 3 apply pistons with blue molded rubber and a spring that he said went on the overrun apply piston.

1 overhaul kit....Raybestos. Still in package. Comes with all seals and gaskets

.....and this one I don’t know. It’s supposed to be a translab pressure regulator made for superior by someone called dean mason
its black......I can post pictures of all this if it helps.

X3 viton input/output shaft seal that looks like a rubber gear...said it was better than white plastic


he wrote down was he was looking at to finish it out.
Z pack or borg Warner high energy 3/4 clutch set
turbulator steels for reverse input and low reverse with borg Warner high energy set
new reverse drum with wide band or borg Warner high energy
5 pinion planets which he said might not be needed for me
something about a newer drum from a 4l60e with a 7 stamped on on the apply tang.....supposed to be shorter but needs a new drum
said smething about the 4 Teflon sealing rings and updating them....not sure.

said I would need an adjustable vacuum switch for torque converter. The superior brand is $45....seems excessive and expensive for a little switch

Is there anything else that needs to be done?

said the 3/4 clutch pack was very problematic and can be trashed from multiple places like accumulators and bands and the drum itself as well as the valve body. Sounds like a nightmare to me.

he wasn’t sure on the .296 boost valve. He said it increased line pressure to reverse and Manual 1 and 2

so ......I have a mess to sort out with both these transmissions and making them last. I have a bunch of parts sitting here and I have no idea if they work together but I trust his judgement.

My driving habits are cruiser. I don’t race and don’t drive aggressively. My engines typically run 300hp

so far mostly I’ve looked at the car conversion and not the transmission itself ....
cut drive shaft
move crossmember back tot the rear bolt hole set
make floor shift into overdrive with shift works conversion
relays for the converter and he said a vacuum switch
holley bracket and throttle adapter for the tv cable

ive considered to get the bugs worked out. To take the v6 caprice transmission and just put it in there. Then build the other truck transmission.

 

So where does the thirdgen come in?

 

Maybe he thinks it's OK because because of the kinship of our third gens to his 79 TA .

In all seriousness Glhx , I'll bet you'd get more info on your car at a second gen F body site , this site is dedicated exclusively to 1982/1992 (third gen) F bodies ....

 

I’m in the right place. The car has nothing to do with it. It goes behind the same 350 as the third gen. My 350 engine is out of a third gen.

you guys here have the transmission knowledge I’m looking for. My car didn’t come with a 700r4 and that’s mostly what your cars came with. You would have the information and they would not. If I went to another forum I would get info on a turbo 350. The 700r4 didn’t come out until 82 which was the first year of the third gen.

I could have said I had a third gen as a simulation to get the information I’m looking for and no one would have known any better.

I need transmission information. Not conversion information. I’m in the right place. I just need people who can help me sort through the 700r4

 

'82 thirdgens used the th200-same dimensions as a th350 I think you have it figured out pretty well-just make sure the u-joint angles are correct after the 700 is mounted in the 2nd gen.I think '81 2nd gen automatics had lock up torque converter like a 3rd gen,700s have kind of a bad rep,but '84 and later 700s are improved over the early ones-might want to put a shift kit in that caprice tranny for best results.

 

That’s not a bad idea. Putting a shift kit in the caprice trans.

What i’m Trying to sort out is which 3/4 to go with and the information to get there. Does it need upgraded drum?
i read something about the 4 sealing rings. Some have to have a special tool to put on and some don’t. The ones that don’t are supposed to be better. You know anything about that.

I would have gone with a 200r4 if I could have found one and I was lookin*when my buddy gave me these two to mess with. I think they have around a 2.74 first where the 700 has a 3.06. Either is an improvement over the turbo 350 and when I drive my car on the highway at 80, it feels like it’s about to fall apart. All of my 3 speed cars are like that. None of them have a lock up converter even so it’s straight 1:1.

I have the wiring figured out but not the vacuum switch. I do know it goes to ported vacuum and is probably normally closed and opens to disconnect the converter at low vacuum. I’m guessing it goes inline with the dual brake light switch which is normally open.

Basically....I want to keep the 3/4 clutch alive and reliable. I looked up some of those parts today. They seem like good parts and seem like they would all work together pretty well and not get in the way of each other. The sonnax shell gets excellent reviews and I saw a video today that said they use the wide gear sun bushing because there is no case support internally and that bushing helps with the support as it goes through 5e entire gear. It makes sense.

Is there a medium apply servo for 4th gear. The superior and the sonnax seem overkill for my application. I spent a good part of the day diving deep into how this thing works as far as what parts are what.

There is a lot of information here from pro built automatics. A guy who makes performance versions of this and his stuff seems to even fall in line with some of the parts I have.

He talks of using the Borg Warner high energy stuff over the z pack and for some reason he uses the narrow band high energy over the wide band.

Parts ive seen that I might not need. A 4l70 reaction shaft and rear ring gear which is supposed to be case hardened. Also.....what my buddy said.....the 5 pinion planet but hat also seems overkill for what I’m doing.

However....the rest of the parts seem to match more in he higher horsepower range....so I question whether or not to build the rest that way. It’s only as good as it’s weakest link

so...I found out that the steel pistons are out of a 4l60e and have the spring set with the kit because the 700r4 has the same set up but one of the sides of the spring retainer is gone and the springs just press into little bumps on the over run apply.
I also found out that the aluminum pistons cracked....but only in the 4l60e due to pressure. The 700 didn’t have this problem....nice upgrade anyway. It also has the blue bonded rubber instead of the black....I guess it’s better for heat.

the dual cage sprag is what most people use. I guess it’s stronger and the sprags don’t flip around.

I asked him why the transgo jr. kit. He said it was because the shifting was fixed some due to it being a post 87 transmission.

The little plastic check ***** by sonnax are supposed to be pretty strong and not wear out but not trash the separator plate which he bought from transgo.

What car this is going in....doesn’t matter.

im after a deep level of transmission building for the 700r4. I want to know why all those parts were ordered and I figured out a lot of it.

The 3/4 drum not so much. I don’t want this thing to break

 

Well.... Maybe, but here's the thing... GM used 700R4s in a bunch of different applications and 83-92 F-bodies are one example. But when you get into it a little, there are a lot of changes just between early and late 700R4s. There are more differences between V6 and V8 transmissions, more still when the trans is from a pickup or a full size car or a Corvette.

When the forum is dedicated to 82-92 Camaro/Firebird discussions, and we're fairly strict about staying on topic, it's just odd when someone is asking about transmissions that didn't come from thirdgens, and aren't going into thirdgens. If there's no thirdgen involved, it's no different from any other off-topic thread. But whatever, maybe someone will help you answer your questions, maybe a moderator will lock the thread, it's not my call to make.

 

what were the differences between all of these 700r4s. The parts list I have shows that they work for a lot of them including third gens. I’m sure the torque converters are different.

i would like to know the difference between the v6 version and the v8 version.

Ive posted that message on several sites. So far some good information has come of it.

I could have just lied and said said I had a third gen and was putting a truck transmission in there and what the difference would be....or what would happen if I put an 89 caprice trans in there. My cars engine and trans shares more with the third gen than it does with the second gen. That’s why I’m here. If I thought the second gen guys could help me I would have posted there and maybe a few of them has done so....but that trans didn’t come in just about every one of their cars like they do yours.

I figured this would have been a lot easier.

 

I'm old fashioned, if looking for an auto tranny for a driver, I smell the fluid...been working for a bit of time.

Now if you have to want to rebuild it, just because it's there..(and I wonder of your skills if you've rebuilt the Mopar TF's) but I digress, contact Dana at ProBuilt Transmissions, he always had a great rep and can hold even your "Mopar Tranny Hand" through the process.

Now why do I sound sarcastic?

Well, I liken it to a fellow who has been doing nothing but rebuilding LA318's for a while, the asked how to rebuild a SBC? Other than heads, same thing.


Anyways, Dana will set ya up, but please don't tell him all you know, just ask what's best for your use.

 

The third gen F body had either a 305 or 350 for the 8 cyl version and a 2.8 or 3.1 for the 6 cyl version . The bellhousing bolt patterns for the V8 VS V6 are not the same (not even close) , so there are V6 specific 700R4 transmissions VS one that will bolt up to a V8 .

Our third gen 700R4 also has a special provision on the tailshaft housing to accommodate the torque arm connected to the rear end , that I believe was unique to third gen F bodies .

 

Well, I could pull out the GM parts catalogs for 82-92 Camaros or Firebirds (they're two different 8" thick books) and compare part numbers that correspond to broadcast codes that inevitably are LONG GONE in most cases, and I can identify all kinds of minor differences between this OEM 700R4 and another. However, since I don't have a mid-80's Caprice parts book, or a full size truck parts book, I couldn't really tell you "the differences between all of these 700r4s". What you would really need is a transmission specialist, that would have access to that information.

I can tell you how to make a Astro van or car/truck 700R4 fit in a thirdgen. Because you know, that's what we know around here, thirdgens... I can't tell you how to make a transmission that will fit in a non-thirdgen, from two transmissions from two other non-thirdgens, because it's none of my business. What you would really need is a transmission specialist, that deals with scenarios like yours, all the time.

If you were asking about putting a 700R4 from a 4.3 Caprice, or a truck, behind a 350 in your thirdgen, I'd tell you it would be best to get a thirdgen V8 core and rebuild it to avoid problems. Maybe what you have would work better in your not-a-thirdgen, but Idk since I'm a thirdgen junky.

Hope that all makes sense.

 

I don't think any internal upgrades will needed to the 700 for street use behind a mild 350-I'd just install a shift kit,mount it in the car and try it out that worked very well for me when I bought a 700 out of an '85 caprice($150 as is,110,000 mi.)installed the shift kit and ran it-that was in 1994 and it is still going strong despite me doing some bad things to it many times back in the past and another 120,000+miles on it

 

As was said, contact Dana at https://probuiltautomatics.com/
He also has videos:
https://probuiltautomatics.com/shop?...-dvd-1982-1993
https://probuiltautomatics.com/shop?...4l60-1987-1993
https://probuiltautomatics.com/shop?...00r4-1982-1986
Look around his site - you could probably answer a lot of your questions by just reading what is there.
Here are the upgrade parts for the 700R4: https://probuiltautomatics.com/shop?...700r4-upgrades

 

Here's my parts list from the best 4L60/700R4/TH700 I've ever been behind.

 

You may also find this update handbook...handy.

 

OMG, that's some great info. Thanks.

 

I found the update manual particularly helpful. I just ordered whatever the newest bits were up to (and maybe including as I'd need to check) the transition to the "E" version.
Plus the 5-pinion planetaries (whether or not they're a reasonable upgrade)

 

I saw the list of upgrades you posted.

The 5 pinion planets hAve an updated stator from 2008+ 4l60e. This has the Torrington bearings replacing the thrust washers. The 5 pinion planet has to have this set up.

From research on this site. It shows that the 4 pinion planets don’t have really have issues.

Question is. Can you run a 4 pinion planet set with the updated shaft. The 5 pinion in my case isn’t worth the money for what I’m doing. However: it would be nice to set it up as being ready if I increase the power substantially. The original set really has gone up in provenance new and supposedly the aftermarket sets are not quality.

And are there here any recommendations on running a deep pan. The pan is easy to find.....the filter not as much.

Also......thank you for the atsg update and build guide. It is a major help in deciding the frictions and steels for the 7 clutch system. I will also contact Dana and see what he has to finish this out.

After im done and in the build process I’ll make a thread just devoted to the transmission and not the conversion process. There’s a ton of information here but you really have to look all over for it