bigger injectors
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
From: Louisville Kentucky
Car: 1991 Pontiac Firebird
Engine: 3.1 V6
Transmission: 700R4
bigger injectors
Hey, I am trying to find out what I would have to do to install 19# injectors in my 3.1L engine. I tried just putting them on the fuel rail, it ran but not very well. Seemed the timing was off or something.
thanks
thanks
Supreme Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,827
Likes: 1
From: Gainesville, FL
Car: 1988 Chevy Camaro Hardtop
Engine: Turbocharged/Intercooled 3.1
Transmission: World Class T5 5 Speed
You can get it done? I'm not sure... I'm working on buying the equipment to do it myself. Ask Funstick... maybe he'll do one for ya, cheap like! 
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
From: Louisville Kentucky
Car: 1991 Pontiac Firebird
Engine: 3.1 V6
Transmission: 700R4
email
Thanks! I'll have to check with him. I just found the GMECM edit program from Magnus, that's killer. Wish I knew what I was looking at though..haha
Supreme Member
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,564
Likes: 1
From: Central FL
Car: 91 Camaro
Engine: 3.1...not hardly stock
Transmission: 700r4....not stock either
Axle/Gears: 3.73
let me know if you can figure any of it out. i've got all the equipment for the prom burning but i can't figure any of it out. if anybody wants to help me....feel free!
Supreme Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,827
Likes: 1
From: Gainesville, FL
Car: 1988 Chevy Camaro Hardtop
Engine: Turbocharged/Intercooled 3.1
Transmission: World Class T5 5 Speed
YOU!! You have the whole prom burning setup?! Must meet up with you.... lol!
I'd be absolutely happy to help you out with prom burning, as it would benefit myself, being able to reburn proms now, lol!
I'd be absolutely happy to help you out with prom burning, as it would benefit myself, being able to reburn proms now, lol!
Trending Topics
Moderator
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 18,432
Likes: 233
From: Chasing Electrons
Car: check
Engine: check
Transmission: check
The 3.1l SD systems ('90-'92) use the 1227730 ECM with the $88 maskid. When the injector size is changed there are two locations and a table of values that require updating. These values need to be changed by the same ratio as the injector size change.
The first two values below are double byte numbers. Keep this in mind when editing them as most editors only handle a byte at a time.
The table of values are single bytes so are easy to edit. Here you are:
The values shown are from cal AZTY and may differ from what you find.
Another nice change is to eliminate the 'AFR drop with time in PE exceeds' parameter:
They kinda goofed with that one as it never resets. Engine gets real sloggy after a while. So I like to set it to 0 (zero).
For the ambitious there is a hac of the $88 mask on the diy-efi site (A hac is a source code listing). It is partially commented.
RBob.
The first two values below are double byte numbers. Keep this in mind when editing them as most editors only handle a byte at a time.
The table of values are single bytes so are easy to edit. Here you are:
Code:
; --------------------------------------
;
; Idle fueling BPC
;
; --------------------------------------
L86BA FDB 0608 ; idle injector constant
; --------------------------------------
;
; BPC for N-Alpha fueling
;
; --------------------------------------
L871F FDB 12288 ; math constant, (12,288) N-Alpha fueling
; --------------------------------------
;
; Injector Constant vs. EGR airflow
;
; BPC
;
; --------------------------------------
;-----------------------------
; ; BPC ; airflow
;-----------------------------
L8754 FCB 182 ; 0
FCB 179 ; 16
FCB 176 ; 32
FCB 173 ; 48
FCB 172 ; 64
FCB 167 ; 80
FCB 162 ; 96
FCB 160 ; 112
FCB 158 ; 128
FCB 153 ; 144
FCB 151 ; 160
FCB 151 ; 176
FCB 151 ; 192
FCB 151 ; 208
FCB 151 ; 224
FCB 151 ; 240
FCB 151 ; 255 Another nice change is to eliminate the 'AFR drop with time in PE exceeds' parameter:
Code:
;*---------------------------------------------------- ; ; PE AFR reduction term ; ;*---------------------------------------------------- L8B05: FCB 0 ; 0, AFR reduction (was 1.0 afr), for above cts/mph thres
For the ambitious there is a hac of the $88 mask on the diy-efi site (A hac is a source code listing). It is partially commented.
RBob.
Supreme Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,827
Likes: 1
From: Gainesville, FL
Car: 1988 Chevy Camaro Hardtop
Engine: Turbocharged/Intercooled 3.1
Transmission: World Class T5 5 Speed
Re: prom settings
Originally posted by mmcdjs
Man, this looks cool, but I have no idea what it means!
Man, this looks cool, but I have no idea what it means!
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
From: Louisville Kentucky
Car: 1991 Pontiac Firebird
Engine: 3.1 V6
Transmission: 700R4
stock size
Well.. that's another problem. I have no idea what the stock size injector is. I've contacted lots of parts stores and even the GM parts sites and they can't tell me either. but what variable do I change
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
From: Louisville Kentucky
Car: 1991 Pontiac Firebird
Engine: 3.1 V6
Transmission: 700R4
injector size
Hey, can you tell me where you found that information? I had figured that the injectors were around 14's, so I was close. The 3.8 also came stock with 19# injectors.
TGO Supporter
iTrader: (12)
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 6,819
Likes: 3
From: AR
Car: 1991 Camaro RS Vert
Engine: 350 S-TPI
Transmission: T5
Axle/Gears: GU5/G80/J65
Alot of research, plus finding the formual for injectors which is...
(hp x A)/(# of injectors x .80)=rating
A=
.50 for naturally asperated engines
.60 for boosted engines
So for my car being a 3.1
(140 x .50)/(6 x .80)=14.583
(hp x A)/(# of injectors x .80)=rating
A=
.50 for naturally asperated engines
.60 for boosted engines
So for my car being a 3.1
(140 x .50)/(6 x .80)=14.583
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
From: Louisville Kentucky
Car: 1991 Pontiac Firebird
Engine: 3.1 V6
Transmission: 700R4
injector size
Yep. that's the same one that I found. Can you tell me where to get a PROM burned with that new information?
TGO Supporter
iTrader: (12)
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 6,819
Likes: 3
From: AR
Car: 1991 Camaro RS Vert
Engine: 350 S-TPI
Transmission: T5
Axle/Gears: GU5/G80/J65
A guy on here name "funstick" I belive has the equipment. Doward would know more info on that part.
I would love to learn how, but need "hands on" to understand it. Plus buy the equipment.
I would love to learn how, but need "hands on" to understand it. Plus buy the equipment.
Moderator
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 18,432
Likes: 233
From: Chasing Electrons
Car: check
Engine: check
Transmission: check
For a good primer on chip burning go to the DIY_PROM board (here on TGO) and the very first sticky at the top has a link to Trax's intro article.
Trax (Tim) covers it quite well including equipment and such.
RBob.
Trax (Tim) covers it quite well including equipment and such.
RBob.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
From: Louisville Kentucky
Car: 1991 Pontiac Firebird
Engine: 3.1 V6
Transmission: 700R4
prom burning
Doward,
Are you going to get with the guy in Florida somewhere that has the equipment and doesn't know how to use it and burn some PROM's? I'd glady pay for a PROM!
Are you going to get with the guy in Florida somewhere that has the equipment and doesn't know how to use it and burn some PROM's? I'd glady pay for a PROM!
Supreme Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,827
Likes: 1
From: Gainesville, FL
Car: 1988 Chevy Camaro Hardtop
Engine: Turbocharged/Intercooled 3.1
Transmission: World Class T5 5 Speed
Yeah, we're talking back and forth... of course, he'd be first in line for a prom, since it is his equipment, lol!
Banned
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 564
Likes: 0
Car: 88 BMW 535i
Engine: 3.5L M30
Transmission: 4HP22E
Originally posted by Doward
LOL! yeah, it should be good... first tho, I have to finish the prototype setup.
LOL! yeah, it should be good... first tho, I have to finish the prototype setup.
i need you done before i get my motor rebuilt. (2 weeks... or less depending on how many days off i get)
As soon as i get my motor rebuilt, i was hoping you would be done so we can see how well it works, what problems you run into, (if any at all) what you used, etc.
I'm buying the nitrous kit along with my rockers in Aug. but if it cant support it I won't get it. Supreme Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,827
Likes: 1
From: Gainesville, FL
Car: 1988 Chevy Camaro Hardtop
Engine: Turbocharged/Intercooled 3.1
Transmission: World Class T5 5 Speed
Hmm... I'm going to have my kit run 6psi. I'd say a 50 shot is doable, but you need to be sure of enough fuel when you hit the nitrous shot... the injectors I include in the kit will have enough fuel delivery for a 75 shot, I'm sure.
(24pph in the kit)
(24pph in the kit)
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
From: Louisville Kentucky
Car: 1991 Pontiac Firebird
Engine: 3.1 V6
Transmission: 700R4
eprom files
ok, I've searched the web and bugged everyone that I could find for the correct ECU and BIN files. I think that I found them on the www.diy_efi.org web site. Here are the links
ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/pub/gmecm/bins...0/730_atta.ecu
ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/pub/gmecm/bins/1227730/azty.bin
Could someone please check to see if these are right? I have the files and the program to change them with, but I have no idea what I really need to change now. HELP! If anyone has luck with it can I get a copy of the modified files too? Remember that this is for a 1991 Firebird 3.1L V6.
thanks
ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/pub/gmecm/bins...0/730_atta.ecu
ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/pub/gmecm/bins/1227730/azty.bin
Could someone please check to see if these are right? I have the files and the program to change them with, but I have no idea what I really need to change now. HELP! If anyone has luck with it can I get a copy of the modified files too? Remember that this is for a 1991 Firebird 3.1L V6.
thanks
Supreme Member
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 3,827
Likes: 1
From: Gainesville, FL
Car: 1988 Chevy Camaro Hardtop
Engine: Turbocharged/Intercooled 3.1
Transmission: World Class T5 5 Speed
TunerCat is the easiest software I've seen yet to use to modify the bin files... you may look into that!
Moderator
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 18,432
Likes: 233
From: Chasing Electrons
Car: check
Engine: check
Transmission: check
Re: eprom files
Originally posted by mmcdjs
ok, I've searched the web and bugged everyone that I could find for the correct ECU and BIN files. I think that I found them on the www.diy_efi.org web site. Here are the links
ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/pub/gmecm/bins...0/730_atta.ecu
ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/pub/gmecm/bins/1227730/azty.bin
Could someone please check to see if these are right? I have the files and the program to change them with, but I have no idea what I really need to change now. HELP! If anyone has luck with it can I get a copy of the modified files too? Remember that this is for a 1991 Firebird 3.1L V6.
thanks
ok, I've searched the web and bugged everyone that I could find for the correct ECU and BIN files. I think that I found them on the www.diy_efi.org web site. Here are the links
ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/pub/gmecm/bins...0/730_atta.ecu
ftp://ftp.diy-efi.org/pub/gmecm/bins/1227730/azty.bin
Could someone please check to see if these are right? I have the files and the program to change them with, but I have no idea what I really need to change now. HELP! If anyone has luck with it can I get a copy of the modified files too? Remember that this is for a 1991 Firebird 3.1L V6.
thanks
The azty.bin is correct for your year and an automatic trans (not for a stick).
I do know that TunerCat supports the $88 mask. May need to request the three locations above be added to the .tdf file though (which they will do for you).
RBob.
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 182
Likes: 0
From: Louisville Kentucky
Car: 1991 Pontiac Firebird
Engine: 3.1 V6
Transmission: 700R4
eprom
Well, do you know of anyplace that has the correct ECU file for my car? I'll contact tunercat and see what they say about it too.
thanks for the help!
thanks for the help!
Senior Member
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 510
Likes: 5
From: Santiago, CHILE
Car: 1986 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am
Engine: 305 Tuned Port Injection
Transmission: The famous 700R4
Axle/Gears: No idea
This post alive
He,
So, if I change 13.5 injectors for 19lbs, then I must increase in 41% the following address in the PROM:
1.- Combinated 6BA/6BB
2.- Combinated 71F/720
3.- Each Singles from 754 to 764.
I'm right for $88 mask?
Thanks for any reply,
Denis V.
So, if I change 13.5 injectors for 19lbs, then I must increase in 41% the following address in the PROM:
1.- Combinated 6BA/6BB
2.- Combinated 71F/720
3.- Each Singles from 754 to 764.
I'm right for $88 mask?
Thanks for any reply,
Denis V.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
