sound sliek u have a coupler partailly blown off, check them all out,

do the boost level drop more each run ?

 

Heres the 14.85 run all the others were 15.01-15.25...LOL

 

I checked all the couplers many times over, soon as I got in the car today the boost suxed. I knew that was gonna be a problem.

I even took the controler wire off, and the reference vac line and still couldnt push above 7psi for the most part

 

check the turbpo for excessive play or anything out of the ordinary, take the wastegate off and inspect it

it has to be something stupid

 

Check for exhaust leaks before the turbo.

 

i cant open that log file

 

Ok checked the turbo, there is not much of any end play.

I took the wastegate off and took it apart again. But first I did notice that there was some black marks as if the gate was not sealed up well on the flang. Would that cause such a loss in boost? I can work on the car anymore tonight but this may be the problem??

 

Well let me just say that I didnt make the commanded Psi untill 77mph. And on the next passes i never made the commanded psi

 

You guys remember when I was saying a long while ago I could smell the wastegate open because it would flow into the hvac stuff... tonight now that I think of it, I could smell it as if the wastegate was open but yet this was when the car was barly under boost. So I guess that a ex leak is basically a boost leak. Thats the one thing I didnt check at the track, was for exhasut leaks.

I let you guys know if this was the problem. It probly was since I took off the wastegate a few time and that gasket probly just got brittle and blew. As it was rough looking. Black marks on both the long sides of the flange.

 

sounds like u found ur problem

 

Yup thanks for the heads up dave and rob. Dammm car better be right by saturday. For the points race.

 

I Think i was just dealing with a few problems that I basically caused.

First I put the WG back on and sealed it up super tight!

Then I wanted to boost check it again on the charge pipe. Wow man was there leaks, basically where I was messing with the couplers, I think I made them worse last night at the race track. But I did find one leak that wasnt there the last time I boost checked it, as it was on a welded 90* bend basicaly right off the turbo before the IC.

So I took the car out attempting to seal up the little hole but failed as you can see in the log it took forever to make boost, but it did make command 12.5psi just took longer then usual. Normally by 40mph I will have 11.5psi by the top of 1st gear(39mph) And in this log I had about 8.5 psi.

So I will remove the pipe fix it right then try it again hopefully tommorow if I get time.

 

told u u more then likley had a coupler partially blown off.

when u presur etest the pipes test them at like 30-40 psi and spray windex or some dish soap and water mix on them just be sure at no time do u let either endcap of the presure tester point at any part of ur body, one of those with 30-40 psi behind it can be deadly

hell they can injure u pretty badly at 10-15psi depending on the volume of the pipe

 

Well man I must still have a leak..its ticking me off. I went out and drove it and its still not right, so much to the fact that I blew the coupler off at the trubo at WOT and 12.5psi of boost. So loud I though I just killed the car. I didnt over rev the turbo as I let off and eased my way home.

My duty cycle on the datalogg says 99.61% for a good part of the log. So theres still a huge leak somewhere that is pissing me off. IDK I dont want to keep over reving the turbo if I have a leak so I hope I get time tommorow to work on it or im not hitting the track on saturday...sad face here.

 

what kind of clamps are u using?
standard hose clamps?

or tbolt clamps

 

Some are t bands some arent. I re boost checked the charge piping and found yet another 2 pin holes. Man they look like there somewhat fresh as the black paint was not on the piping where the hole was at.

One important question though. There is a slight black residue in the turbo outlet. Its not much of anything but there was enough that if you put your finger in there you would get some black out, BUT my charge piping does NOT have this black residue in it or does my throttle body. So is that normal from not always running a filter...exc?? Or oil seal blow by?

 

u will get a tiny bit of dirt and oil residue in there, its not a big deal.
its only a big deal when the oils is like dripping in there

 

na its not dripping in there. The more im looking through the recent datalogs, it seems like ever since I hit that 15psi of "accident" my spool up times are slower. Im just guessing that that amount of psi just blew some holes in my poor welding and showed its flaws, since I added so many coats of paint to the piping in hopes that it would hold tiny any pin hole leaks I may have. I know thats not the right way of doing it but i though it would be a good idea at the time but now I find myself fixing one leak after another.

 

i try not to weld any of the charge pipes unless i can tig weld them
might be worth it for u to buy a 2.5 inch piping kit off ebay

 

Yea it prob would be a good idea, but the funds are very limited at the moment. Ill try to fix then up and hope that gets me by for now.

AFPR arrived. Hope to install that If I fix all the dammmm air leaks.

 

hit walmart n get a $9 thingy of fiberglass resin, $5 for a big section of fiberglass matte and cut strips to re-enforce and build up your connections, then some 99cent paint

 

Did you check the hot side; exhaust gaskets, turbo flange gasket, etc, for leaks? Did you run a compression check on all cylinders for when you accidentally hit 15-psi, to make sure your head gaskets are okay and not blowing some of the charge right out of the block? I would also double check the torque on your head bolts just in case your slightly lifting a head during boost.

 

I think I got it now. I went out and tested everything again 2 times over, let the car cool and went for a WOT pull to 110mph. I used a older bin file with 12psi command and a weak WG duty cycle. If you guys wana check it out and see what you think? My intake temp was 90* off the bat as I had to drive 3 miles to get to my 1/4 mile road. And they got all the way up to 160 degrees at the end(110mph). I didnt realize how fast I was going.

Car has less lag but still is about 1psi lower then it usually was at the top of 1st gear at the race track with open exhaust/slicks, but when I compare it to older log files before I had the exhaust cut out(since its not open header on my log today) and such you can see that the boost at the top of 1st gear is about the same....9 psi or so.

1st log is from today. gtech said 106mph@14.27 seconds, and the second log is just a older crappier one.

 

Your confusing the heck out of everyone, leak, no leak, leak, no leak...

Said it before pages ago, and I'll say it again, you got a 12 second car. You out did Dave.

 

Im sorry for the leak, no leak thing. I just welded the crap out of the joints again and let her rip. It works right now...I think, felt fast again. So i must of fixed it.

Ill go to the track tommorow and see if its back to the 14.00 area(im just going to run 12psi tommorow, if it makes those 14 sec passes normal again, ill go and install the AFPR I got today in the mail so that I can turn the boost up a tad (15psi) and then look for some fast track times.

I know some people probly think I write to much on here but it helps to think outloud sometimes.... still a newbe

 

With close to a 106-mph trap speed, don't even settle for 14's. Get that thing to hook! Did you box the stock LCA's yet...?

 

No I havent, I just have frame connectors. Box them?? How do ya do that?

 

Will help your sixty foot out a lot...

 

Ahh so you just literly weld in a bottom on them? I can do that, looks pretty simple.

 

It's very simple, and the rewards are great, no more flexing and eliminates wheel hop...

 

I think ya could use the standard 3:42s that came in the V6 cars.

That or I got one super fast V6, as your vid runs, I could hang easy up to 50-60 not going much over 4000rpm

faster I don't know as I don't have room on my daily runs but I get up to 50 plus like that without trying very hard.

now after that, you burry the needle awful quick

 

lol hes got a ways to go to outdo me

sounds likes it all fixed now get out there and give it hell i want to see 5 psi launches

 

true that, with an auto he could spool/load it up well

 

Now now, don't be jealous of him Davey lmao, cuz he's got your 104-mph trap beat...

 

umm until he does it on track it dont count

 

It's as good as done once he dials in his AFPR...

 

Give me a few weeks with the AFPR and Ill be flying in the car. If I just had more $$ for suspention and rear end items I would be moving alot faster at the track. But for now im relying on boost to get me some decent times.

Took it for a late night ride...its definitly fixed. 0-100 in the high 13's with alot of wheel spin, you can see in the log I had to let off the throttle basically to 50%TPS a few times..

Im off to the track tommorow so I will update ya on times. Hoping I can launch and make the first 13 sec pass, i really dont even care if its a 13.99.

 

Flying, ehh? Lemme see a 12 second pass first, then you can be considered flying...

Good deal, I'm glad she's running better, and that your enjoying the car...

 

Well Rob Im ahead of myself again, I just get a little excited with this little V6.

Ill go get a 13.xx first then well go from there and see what shes made of.

I just know the power I felt the other day at 15+psi was amazing!! Absolutly amazing and what really shocked me is the car acted like it really liked the boost.....

 

Go back to the first few pages of this thread, do you now see why I was encouraging you to run the $58 mask as opposed to the $59 mask w/its' less resolution? I encouraged the $58 mask because 15-psi is a lot of boost to be dealing with, and I can't see you wanting to push 20-psi and expect it to live. My Grand National buddies are running 30-psi, and I literally cringe when I am in the car with them because I am honestly waiting for the flywheel to come shooting through the floorpan, even with them running a blanket...

 

he is going to go over 15 psi though, so why bother running a version of code that he will just have to update form anyway

 

Yea no kidding.

Honestly I like the $59 BUT I dont like the resolution as you told me along time ago. I should have listen to you because the VE table mainly is just too small for what I need to tune with. It makes it a little difficult at times. The main reason I just went $59 is because I already had the map 3 bar. AND I really had no idea what you ment by resolution a few months ago, dont forget I was a newbe at tuning. Thats a dumb excuse but its sorta in the past now. Im use to $59 so it will work for what I need out of the car for now. And I can see myself going a tad over 15psi in the future.

I dont know how anyone can run 30psi, thats ALOT. At the 15-16psi I went the other day I was praying the car wasent going to go BOOM even though all the data I was reading was ok, except the Injec. DC.

 

He is going to go over 15-psi? Are you going to pay his bill when he grenades the stock cast parts? As for $58 not handling over 20-psi of boost, umm, yeah, tell that to the Syclone/Typhoon guys who are running upwards of 30-psi. If he has enough injector, then $58 will cover as much boost as he can throw at it. $58 is speed density, and the lookup tables are commanded to fuel as much as we tell it to at wide open throttle...

 

yea I agree...... to a stop potential argument I can't see myself running over 16-17psi at the absolute max on a stock bottom end. Thats just too much. Honestly If I get mid-high 13's then thats all the motor I need, then its off to suspention and such that will lower times more then more boost.

Hopefully I dont need 16psi or so to reach mid 13's if I can just launch the car somewhat ok. Then when more $$ is avalible, I can set the car up right with t-headers, rear end, exc...

 

Remember that 15/16-psi on an engine with heads and cam is a great deal more than 15/16-psi on a bone stock engine. At the boost your running now your car is capable of a twelve second pass if you can get it to hook. Up the boost to 15-psi, and with a low sixty foot (1.5x area) you will be in the elevens, I know you will. There is also the weight factor, as every hundred pounds will gain you about a tenth in ET. There are a lot more areas to cover to get the most out of your setup, so you don't have to always resort to just upping the boost. Summertime is almost here, and I know that you don't want to spend it installing a new bottom end, you want to get out there and cruise and do a little street racing with your buddies. Enjoy the car for what it is, it's plenty fast and your only scratching the surface with your setup. I can't wait for you to run a twelve, because I know it has it in it. Eleven and ten second cars w/diminutive engines require lots and lots of maintenance, especially if you drive and beat on them everyday. This is your build, nobody else's, so always do what you yourself feel is right...

 

The resolution being referred to is the MAP sensor itself. A 3-bar sensor has to cover a lot more pressure range over the same range of voltage. The $58 & $59 code has the same VE table size & resolution.

The 3-bar sensor is only spec'd down to 40 KPa, and even at that the error band opens up starting at 71 KPa (and down). So drive-ability suffers.

Just putting a 2-bar MAP sensor on a N/A car for some testing the engine didn't run as smooth. It was a slight change, but non-the-less it was noticeable.

You can still go with a 2-bar MAP along with the $58 code. Easy enough to copy the main tables over.

> I don't know how anyone can run 30psi, that's ALOT.

Missed a word , let me correct that for you:

I don't know how anyone can run 30psi, that's ALOT OF FUN!

RBob.

 

what size is the ve table in 58$ and 59$??

with ms u can have 12x12 or 16x16 or 32x32 im currently using 16x16 on my iroc but ill be opening my tables upto 32x32 here shortly when i get my 4 bar map sensor

 

Make me think of that guy who had the faster 4cyl mini van many year back before he died. Was a 4banger dodge I think, all stock, running 20+ and he had to install 2 extra fuel injectors that came in as needed, I member he first used the cold start hole for a 5th , then had to put a 6th in the intake tube.

guy had an awesome website with great write ups as it was all sort of a backyard build but with sound science. [using a shop vac to test muffler flow dynamics n stuff.]

can't find the website but here is a old uboob vid.

http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=F3Gdm_e_hxs

 

fasteddi - How old are you? Haha sorry this is off-topic, But I was just watching American Pickers, and they are picking at a guys place, and his nick name is FastEddi!

On another note. I have been watching this thread for quite a while. I know I got flamed before for talking about exhaust size. I have done many 4cyl boosted cars, but no v6 or v8, and Even on my little 4 banger, I was running 3" all the way. I didn't need to uncork it at the track or change anything from the street to the strip.

I am not here to start a pissing match with any of these guys. But i'm just saying. My turbo spooled almost instantly when I went from stock exhaust to the full 3". Might be something worth considering.

Another thing, I had a 3" on my L98 Trans am, and I could feel a difference when I uncorked it. I would rather have the right size even for when i'm on the street just so I don't have to uncork it.

For anybody else, I don't want to hear it. This is my experience and my opinion.

 

I would say that you missed the point. It isn't the resolution of the VE table, but the resolution of the MAP sensor. And going to a 4-bar MAP just lowers the resolution even more.

RBob.