How to make my car a 12 second car, and how much. using only a V6. Hehe you guys try to answer that.

 

It CAN be done honestly.
12.5-1 pistons.
Mixed roller rockers. 1.52 intake 1.6 exhaust
headers
throttle body 62MM around somewhere on this board
NOS
Rear gears and posi
Port&polish heads and Intake runners
stripped bare interior for race
A good CAI/Ram air system
roller lifters
Push rod guides
a good cam 2030 or the step up from 2030 crane makes 3 cams for our engines.
good exhaust Dynomax 2 1/2
2 1/2 high flow catco cat
MSD or equivilent ignition system
1.72 intake valve 1.42 exhaust
a good set of small diameter slicks
20-22 Lb Hr injectors
Adjustable Fuel Pressure reg
High Pressure pump(fuel)
Custom burned Chip.. NOT HYPERTECH an actual custom tuned chip for your car.
All ballanced and blueprinted rebuilt/built engine
If auto stage 3 shift kit, if manual lightened flywheel with stage 3 clutch.
With all of that I think you should be looking at every bit of 250-270 Hp and Trq if not more(Which would be my guess to be upwards of near 300) You can get close to 2 HP be CI from the 60* engine. Now the 3.1 is 189 so go 1.75x189 roughly say 290-310 Maybe more IF YOU GOT EVERYTHING ON THIS LIST. And some others that I may have forgotten.

EDIT like all the suspension mods!

 

That really is not as hard as many would like you to think. It wil lrequire a power added of some sort. I bet you can do it for under 5K in your engine if you go the NOS route, 6-7K if you do a custom turbo setup. That is based off you doing none of the work, just going to a real speed shop that does car setups and say:

I run 16.03, I have 5K and want to run 12.99 what can you do to make this happen.

Suspension mods will be big, but cheap
LCA's
Sub Frame
Pan Hard
Torque Arm
Urethane Bushings

Engine mods depend on NOS, Turbo, or Super...

 

If your building this car for 12.99 secs, don't run the mild cam that has not conflicts with computer, you want to run the more aggressive cam.

Also, I believe the 12.99 can be done, take away NOS, and now your in trouble.

 

before 20psi answers, drop in a TT/A/turbo buick engine. other than that, go with what's posted.

 

In the new summit cat, page 58. Crane Part number CRN-254122 1,500-4,500 204/214 duration 423/423 lift. THATS the cam you want. BUT you WILL NEED that custom burned chip!. (I knew I saw that thing somewhere....LOL)

 

Odd; that's the cam for a computer controlled engine.

Honestly; 12 second 2.8/3.1 car = V8 swap. I've yet to see anyone (no matter how big the talk) make a 12 second 2.8/3.1, and don't think it'll ever happen. I'd love to be proved wrong, though!

 

And to get the BEST out of EVERY mod you always will want to change something in you BIN. Cause things change as you bolt on and change stuff. So if you want to continue to get technical go ahead. otherwise I won't talk to/about you and you do the same.

 

Not to sound negative but yes that is possible but not worth it, for the time and money just buy a new car with that power its probaly easier. I had hopes and dreams for that stuff too for my car but for me that aint happenin

DJ

 

Right now I am looking at an option of an engine that WILL find its way into my car, but not for a while. The engine needs rebuilt and hopefully this summer will be the time. Now when I DO rebuild it is it going to stock? I think not. It will get the cam, headers, pistons, rockers, ect ect so UNTIL the time where the other engine is up and running on the stand and ready to swap in I will have something that would be "Spunky" enough to keep me happy for a while. I will be happy if the thing gets to the 14-15 sec range personally. But hell you never know it might be quicker.
Now do I know there are bigger engines out there? Yes. Do I want them? NO. The same reason everyone else on here does not want to swap in a V8. To me there not worth the time money effort, increased Insurance, Increased gas money, Increased chance of getting a ticket CAUSE YOU WILL ALWAYS be wanting to race it. And personally I think its a cop out of a good challange.
I like the challange of getting the HP outta the smaller motor. Its not an "Everyone has" engine. I think it'll be funny as hell to take out a rustang, LG4, L98 and the 350TPI NOT LT1(Yet) and then at the end of the race they come to find they got beaten by a small 2.8-3.1 V6!. thats why there is a "V6" Board on this site. To help people FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET thier V6 Haulin'.

 

Mustanghunter, there is a lot of reasons that some of us might want to do that, I am planing on doing that. The insurance is cheaper, at least it is for me, like 1000 a year. I want to keep the stock engine, i dont want to go through the hastle of putting a new engine in my car, just upgrade my engine. Also, i just like my 6, i want to be different and beat people out with a 6

 

I am totally with you guys i am in the same situation too. I think that was a wrong opinion in my case anyways. I have been trying to build my car and the money thats being put in is crazy and the results are small one mod leads to another but i think to many drill in my head that "he only has a v6" its what i got to work with

 

If they can make a 1.8 liter run 9 seconds, why not waste my time making a 2.8 run 12.99

 

Just FYI they have 1.8L hondas running in the 7's now.... the 6 barier is fast if not already broken

 

Well; write this down in all of your record books: Sorry, I forgot we were talking about a "12 second V6". Otherwise there'd be no NEED for a custom chip after doing a computer-compatible cam.

 

i am still trying to figure out why anything more than a mild cam will make the ECM go crackers...........

i'm not saying i dont believe it will........i believe it will

but why??????? cuz to much air is getting into the cylinders without the engine knowing it???????????

help me out here guys...........i've learned alot but want to learn more.....

 

how about blown & injected? has been done on some GTPs

 

Ya know, I'm not quite sure! A cam with more overlap would probably throw off the oxygen sensor (and emissions). When lobe separation decreases, so does engine vacuum, and you get a rough idle; the computer doesn't like that either. I know lobe separation and overlap are two key points; but you're right... how does the computer know?

 

Rock solid bottom end, those 12:1 pistons... aggressive valvetrain, true dual 2.5inch exhaust... no cat, headers...

no computer BS... (means carb setup)

and...

lots and lots of NOS...

for streetable motor? custom prom, and lots and lots more NOS...

 

Im gonna go the import way here....

Forget "NOS", build the engine up...forged pistons...bigger TB...T51 turbo...front mount intercooler...bullet proof 9" Ford rear end...T56 tranny out of a 4th gen...Griffin radiator...and all the suspension mods needed for traction help...boost gauge...adjustable waste gate...3"exhaust from the downpipe back...and run about 24psi. You wont ever have to worry about V8 guys picking on you again!

 

Will the comp be able to handle the cam stock? Yes. BUT will you be getting the best outta the cam with the STOCK BIN parameters? NO. I bet if you were to run the CAM with the STOCK BIN and then have a chip TUNED to the new engine demands the car would not only run better but be FASTER.
Will the comp know the difference? Who knows. Were not the comp are we. But I am willing to bet your not going to get the full potenial outta the cam under the stock BIN.

 

Hey guys.... Thought i would pipe up on this one as i did get my 91 to the 13.8 sec range after lots o money/time and broken knuckles.... They have the small 1.XX running in that range because theres a market for the engines. Now, that siad those 6 and 7 second buzzsaws are NOT street legal. They are to radical to run on the street. 11 and 12 second 1.XX however are legal and i have seen 2 in my life. They rare and expensive to build. There is no real market for performance 60 degree engines like there is in the import scene. Its too bad there is not as when i did my build the little mill took to performace mods like a natural thing. I would think a turbo 3.1 however would put you into the 14's easy, mod it some and 12's would come but i would imagine it would take 15+ pounds of boost and a good fuel/ECM combo. I have found since getting back into V8 engines and ford to boot, that "most" cars you will see and race on the streets run (if there lucky) in the mid 14's. If there serious about it, they are mid 13's and if there like me and have the car to take out on sundays and play around at the local strip and stoplight they run in the 11+ range. I do know afew 10.XX street runner V8's but they are RARE. Anyways i do hope someone gets into the 12's, i couldn't do it and the few V6 guys both here now and formers would be happy to see it, i think to date the 13's have only been achieved, i was a 13.8 with NOS in a 1991 firebird with a 3.1L.

 

ok, i was thinking the same way everyone on this board does... How to make the fastest thirdgen V6? you guys know the saying, "theres no replacement for displacement" so wouldnt starting with a bigger V6 make the process a lil easier. Converting to 3.4 was always the first step in my plan to make a killer v6. Then mod some 3.4 headers to fit, cam, blah blah blah. Just a suggestion.
Tom

EDIT~ WOO HOO, Im a senior member now! 100 posts! so what kind of special privileges do i get?

 

While we are on topic can anyone give me a link to a site that sells a NOS kit for a 3.4 v-6 as in the third gen 3.4 not the 4th gen
Thanks
David

 

Say i went for some Nos would i need any upgrades? I dont think i can put in there just the Nos without some needed upgrades.
If anyone can help me out on this thanks.

DJ

 

dont look at me then
motor the same size as what you find in a lot of your econo box car
a whole 1.3L think even some metros have the same size motor

running 12.5 according to my G-Tech so I am figuring that I could prolly hit a 12.8-12.9 on the track. if I had a working motor

honest only costed me around 5500-6000 and that is with the price of the car also

once I get the motor rebuild and ported, the boost creep figured out and some more fuel so I can turn my boost up I should be pushing low 11's or so I hope
and that should only put another 1500 on my bill at most I am guessing
now if... my tranny could hold up and the rest of my driveline b/c it is the stock N/A type that is another story




but with a V6 you are going to need to get some power add stuff
my choice would be turbo or SC. dont care much for nos
also take the cheap route and get your car lighter... that will help everything out.
but good luck however you manage to do it
you can always try to swap in a GN motor though right

 

Your talking alot of money man

 

Cheap way to fool insurance.
Get a FOUR cylnder F Body (lots of them in yards)
Throw out the engine and interior.
Toss in a BIG BLOCK V-8.
Save money & insurance.
You will go 12's this way.
Other way, drop car off a tall cliff.
12's ECONOMICALLY in a V-6 ain't gonna happen.
You'll spend more time picking up the pieces from the V-6 engine/NOS system explosion than anything else.
Fun to think of (12's in a 60* V-6) but I'd rather be driving and having a pleasant, RELIABLE ride.

 

NOS nitrous systems- http://www.summitracing.com http://www.nosnitrous.com Call Summit and ask for the kit # (and price) for your car. I don't think there will be a difference for a "3rd gen w/swapped 3.4", since you're still using the same 2.8/3.1 intake manifold & injection & computer.

There's really no upgrades to make. Make sure the car has a major tuneup done. But definately, your fuel system will NEED to be in top shape; mainly, the fuel pump. If you run lean while you're on the spray, you'll burn (melt) a piston. A good idea is adding a fuel pressure gauge to the car. If you're 1/2 way down the track, and see your fuel pressure drop, shut the car off, and coast to the end. NOS (and I'm sure other companies, too) also sells a fuel pressure safety switch- if fuel pressure drops too much, the engine shuts down. I'm not sure if you can calibrate the switch, or if they have a few models available (carbureted engines run at a much lower PSI than our FI motors do).

But I agree with Ked on "how to run 12's". 12's on the street would be insane even for a v8!

 

I know a 12 second 3.4 will be hard to do but if I spend a summer building a 3.4 up with a power adder, torque converter gears and a beefed up 700r4 would it be easy to have ohh say a 14 or low 15 second car and would that give me a lot of reliability problems?
David

 

well, you could do all of those things and than do what i am doing in the spring, after i do a rebuild and add forged pistons, ect, i am doing a custom blower set up that only costs $200, I am converting a leaf blower to run off the engine and force air into the engine, it will be like a supercharger but a hell of a lot cheaper.

 

A leaf blower?
I use the commercial ones during the summer and cant see how you could get one to act as a supercharger?
Could you explain in more detail on how you are going to do it?
Thanks
David