86bird_28v6_5spd_ramair

how many people here got them?

do they work well with stock calipers?

how do they feel compared to regular ones?

where do you find them to be better than stock?

are there any down sides?



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http://PCperformance-usa.com/86bird/86bird.html

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Omega

iTrader: (1)

From what i hear, they are not all that special. They are mainly for show. Upgraded pads are a better investment than the drilled rotors. I must admit though, they look awsome!

Firebird90

iTrader: (1)

1. I got them.
2. They work with the stock calipers.
3. They kinda feel the same when driving hard.
4. I want to think they are better than stock.
5. They could crack when driven to hard (I'm guessing)

grafx

They are mainly for show. The only purpuse they serve is to help keep the roter cooler under hard braking, mainly for racing.

Mark

Hulk0202

I wouldnt say they are mainly for show. I dont officialy race my car, but I ride the hell out of it, and my brakes burn up quick. I've tried all diffrent kinds of pads. Only the top quality ones hold up well without any help. I tried some cross-drilled rotors my buddy had on his camaro, and they kept the brakes cool enough to keep them from burning up and fading. It's not just a show piece.

Kandied91z

iTrader: (7)

i would agree, they look really nice too!

Jza

1) I do.

2) Yes.

3) They whirr under hard braking, but otherwise the same.

4) They're only better in appearance.

5) Supposedly they crack easier, and it's harder to find a shop willing to turn them.

grafx

unless you plan on racing or showing your car the expense of buy a set of cross drilled sloted rotors is not worth it. Unless you have the money to spare.

Mark

wiggy'sIROC

Winston Cup cars don't use slotted or crossdrilled rotors and they need a whole lot more brake performance than I ever will.

Mark

bbtaz97

iTrader: (3)

cross driled rotors are for pretty much show use and track use.. using them on an everyday driver is pointless b/c they will crack in no time. i saw this on my friends camaro. my suggestion is if you want to upgrade stuff.. either go to a complete 1le brake setup,or if you cant afford that upgrade the pads and calipers.

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91 camaro RS
- 305 TBI
Mods: Performer TBI intake, 1" TBI spacer, K+N, jet fan switch ,160 thermo,Accel control module, Jet Stage 2 chip, edelbrock TES headers, Compleate 3" Flowmaster exhaust, Edelbrock springs, KYB struts and shocks, 700R4 built by TSI, SLP tq converter, b+m trans cooler, white guage faces, megashifter..
next month: spohn LCA's and panhard rod, BMR relocation brackets,posi 323 , lt1 cam and new valve springs

soulbounder

Get slotted zinc-washed rotors. They won't have the reduced structural integrity of cross-drilled ones and will look great too. The trouble comes in trying to find some.

powermite

Ive got them.Check out a good close up pic on

https://www.thirdgen.org/rides/index...ew&rideid=4262

Work well

PM

shotgun

If you goto baer's web page, they have them. They also state that they have done testing and there is no benefit at all... heres a quote

"In racing, crossdrilling was designed to alleviate a problem known as out-gassing. In some of the older pad compounds, when the pads reached elevated temperatures consistent with performance or racing use, the binder (that’s the material that holds the friction material in place) boiled off, producing a gas. This gas would build up between the rotor and the brake pad, effectively keeping the pad from directly contacting the rotor. The holes provide a relief path for these gasses, as do slots, so the pad can once again contact the rotor. Crossdrilling was NOT designed to facilitate cooling."

IROCKZ4me

I agree completely with the info in the above post.

Slots and cross drilling do not have any affect on cooling.
If new rotors reduced the temp of your brakes or improved performance it was due to improved coolng vane design, and/or improved pads.

Drilling and/or slotting do not provide significant performance benifits to modern street braking systems. Except for that bad-@$$ serious look, and some improvement in braking force when the rotors are wet, (water between the rotor and pad surface) but then the tires and road are probably wet too so the improvement there isn't usually seen due to decreased traction anyway.

The down side is that cross drilling shortens rotor life (cracking) but slotting is not so hard on them.

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Tracy /AKA IROCKZ4me
'86 IROC-Z Camaro
"Cogito ergo zoom"

• 355 cid
• AFR heads
• Arizona Speed & Marine hydraulic roller cam w/ AFR hydra-rev kit
• modified SLP runners
• TRW forged pistons/ceramic coated
• fully balanced
• Edelbrock headers/ceramic coated
• SLP cat-back
• Paxton supercharger
• Nitrous Express nitrous oxide

EFI Performance Club on Yahoo

Tom84L69

Don't waste money on slotted or cross drilled, if you want, upgrade pads to Hawk pads. They are very aggressive and are more than anyone needs on the street. I mean everyone, check out the glowing rotors here:

www.djrace.com

I worked for this guy over the summer and he uses stock corvette rotors with Hawk pads.

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84 Z28 L69. 5 speed with 3.73 posi (broken)Ported heads, intake, 10:1 comp. 230/230 .480 lift cam @.050"

Kandied91z

iTrader: (7)

what winston cup car needs intensive braking?

how many of you answering the guy actually have these type of rotors?

it all depends on what brand and make you have. I have the gm versions for our vehicles and i love them.

yes they do look sweet!

yes they do improve braking, to a degree; nothing compared to $1000 baer setup obviously.

no these do not crack easily; sure some rotors crack, but those are one's people have purchased from JC witney.

i had a recent brake problem where the caliper locked up and i had to drive on it for 6 miles; (not a good idea if avoidable) and the rotor is fine, neither warped nor cracked. so yes they are better for cooling to a degree. stock rotor would have been trashed without a doubt. the fact that i had these rotors over stock saved me a lot of money over having to purchase a new rotor for the $50 more they cost me that was 100 less i'm spending now (you add it up).

personally, look at it as an appearance mod more than anything that way your not expecting baer performance. they work for what they were intened for.

you can listen to most of these people, but do any of them have the rotors. generally no. but, opinions are opinons and you should go with what you like. They wouldn't be around as long as they have if they didn't work.



[This message has been edited by Kandied91z (edited November 14, 2001).]

clemsparks

iTrader: (1)

Uhhh...Are you serious?
Watch those teams scramble when they're coming up on a roadcourse race or a short track. Braking can and does win races.

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SCCA TransAm Series Race Mechanic/CrewChief
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1983 Z28 with LG4, 5 speed, and (unfortunately) T-tops
1983 Z28, NO T-tops, (unfortunately) Auto Transmission (hopefully not for long)
http://communities.msn.com/clemsprojects

Tom84L69

Watch NASCAR at Martinsville too. They have camera sots of the front rotors glowing cherry red! Do they use slotted rotors? NO..
Quality rotors and quality pads.

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84 Z28 L69. 5 speed with 3.73 posi (broken)Ported heads, intake, 10:1 comp. 230/230 .480 lift cam @.050" w/108 LSA

Triumph Spitfire SCCA roadracer. 1.1 liter 4cyl w/ 14:1 comp.
Outcorners anything!

Kandied91z

iTrader: (7)

lol....your kidding right; sure they get hot; from high speeds. but what winston car does any kind of road race. stock car on a road course would be a funny sight.



you know what it doesn't even matter, because half the people trying to give you advice don't even have these rotors.

do what you want while the rest of us enjoy our upgrade.

86bird_28v6_5spd_ramair

well i do have new rotors and there is no need to change them yet, i guess.


who makes a good replacement capilar, that does not break the bank?

im sure anything made today is better than the stock 86ers.


what does everyone think about pads,

i got the best one the local store sells, the carbon metalic or copper( i dont like the copper)

you know the ones everyone has now that are "nascar" type, with the ends shaved down for cooling.

but you lose a bunch of pad contact, i really have not had regular pad to compare with.

i mean doing 180 all day you need extra cooling but i would think for the street more contact area would be better.


what we really need is for carbon fiber to get cheap.




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stingerssx

You can't even be serious Kandied91z. Have you ever watched a Winston cup race? Do you follow it at all? How can you not know that Winston cup road races? Ever hear of Sears Point?
Why don't any of us have cross drilled, or slotted rotors? Cause we don't fall for the hype!!! That's an obvious one. Why would anyone pay so much more for a degraded product. Once again, they crack. Maybe yours don't, but that just means that you don't brake that hard.

I also don't think that a stock rotor would have died where your drilled rotors didn't. I'm really sorry for being so blunt, but come on, man, are you serious?

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'82 Firebird, dead stock, 9 bolt disc rear, over 200,000 miles and still going strong, more to come...
http://www.spinfrenzy.com/stingerssx...easures.html#4

clemsparks

iTrader: (1)

(homer voice : ) MORON

Get with the program! There's at least a couple of road races a year. (not to mention Busch and truck series races at road courses).
Sorry for the off-topic, I just don't like people acting like they know their **** when they're obviously, sorely mistaken (did you even bother to look at my sig?).

Clem


[This message has been edited by clemsparks (edited November 16, 2001).]

grafx

Has anyone heard of a process where they freeze rotors? They use nitrogen I believe. I heard of it a long time ago. The process is suppose to make the rotors harder and last longer.

Mark

DartByU

Yeah I know about it, it's called cryogenic tempering and it's used on a lot of things, some racing guys do all there engine parts like blocks,cranks and rods, I even read some where that someone tried it on BIC razor blades and they lasted 3 or 4 times longer!! Hears a short article I found on the process.

In laimans terms, freezing metal parts to make them stronger. Cryogenic tempering isn't a completely new idea. The freezing of metal in an effort to increase its durability and strength has been practiced for some thirty years within various industries. The tool and die industry regularly uses this approach to temper and extend the life of steel tooling bits. The advent of "deep cryogenics" opens new possibilities, in the case of brake rotors and brake drums.

By cryo-treating a metal part, the molecular structure is made more uniform, more durable and much stronger. Cryogenic tempering changes the areas of weaker, potentially brittle deposits called "austenites" into harder, more uniform particles called "martensites". These particles are responsible for the exceptional wear characteristics imparted by the process, due to a denser molecular structure and a reduction in porosity. In brake rotors, the process allows the rotor to absorb and sustain more heat, eliminating brake fade and rotor warpage, which is the most common cause of brake failure.

The cryogenic unit consists of a freezer cabinet, a computer system with highly specialized software, and a tank of liquid nitrogen. The process itself takes approximately 72 hours to complete, any faster and you run the risk of thermal shocking the metal. The metal part is slowly reduced to 300 degrees below zero, where it stays for 12 to 24 hours, and raised back to room temperature at the same rate it was reduced.

The end result is a braking system that has unsurpassed brake pad and rotor life, a decrease in stopping distance, and helps eliminate dreadful brake fade and rotor warpage.



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92 Camaro RS 5.0 5-Speed (Quasar Blue)
T-Tops
14" Open Air Cleaner
3.08 Posi-trac
Edelbrock TBI Intake
Crane cam
Ported & polished stock heads 3 angle valve job
HyperTech Chip
UltraFlo cat-back exhaust

74 Dodge Dart Sport 360 (11.2 1/4 mile)

2000 Dodge 1500 Ram Sport

IROCKZ4me

The taper on the friction material isn't really for cooling. It is to reduce vibrations called brake chatter. Basically on street pads it is to eliminate the vibrations that cause the brakes to squeal. It even works on bicycles with caliper (hand) brakes. If you have one squealing just file a taper on the leading edge of the brake pad. For performace purposes removing the vibrations (chatter) improves pad to rotor contact. That equalls better braking.
Losing a little contact area is worth the improvemnt you get.
The leading edge (according to rotor rotation) is the only one that actually needs to be tapered but most pads just have both edges tapered because if only one edge was tapered instead of just having two inboard and two outboard pads for each axle, you would have one inboard left, one inboard right, one outboard left, and one outboard right and lots of people would have trouble getting the correct pad on the correct side of the correct rotor.
This tapering is usually only needed on pads with high metallic content because they have higher friction coefficients (more friction) and the friction material is stiffer so they are more prone to chattering.

ANDYZ28

IROCKZ4me,Thanks for setting me straight on the pads,etc. I always wondred why the darn pads were beveled.Formula 1 cars do have left & right pads.Now I know why. Thanx,ANDYZ28

86bird_28v6_5spd_ramair

well who makes a good pad that is not like this.

i can see why but, to be lazy and do both end, and really the ones around here, i bet you lose 25-30% of your pad contact.

i like the old style of brakes, 2-3 years back before this bevel, i rather have some more pad back, these work as good but dont seam to last as long.

maybe a year on front pads.


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Omega

iTrader: (1)

For more info on cryogenic tempering, check out www.ws6.com He has posted his results and pics.

Kandied91z

iTrader: (7)

aww.. clemsparks; what ever makes you feel better about yourself.

no point getting into this any further.

clemsparks

iTrader: (1)

yeah,

Sorry. I guess I was a little harsh on you. I was having a bad day, presumably.

Basically the need for a drilled or slotted rotor is dictated by the pad manufacturer. They look pretty cool though, I guess.

If we're just putting them on for looks though, it seems we're guilty of the same behavior as the "sticker slappers" more commonly reffered to as a starchy grain.

Clem