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Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
I've had a few different thirdgens over the years, and each have had a few different stereo systems. Some better than others, some LOUDER than others, but none were really too much different from one another. Some various form of 4x6, 6x9, and a sub or two. While I've never had an issue with LOUD, I've noticed over the years as my daily drivers have gone up in quality, that the sound quality from my thirdgens hasn't been all that good. For my current build, I'd like to put a little more effort into Quality of sound.
I can afford financially to put good quality speakers in, and those brands and model can be discussed in another thread, but I feel what I'm lacking is WHAT SIZE speakers to use, and WHERE to put them? I'm no expert fabricator, and I'm good with my hands and I can make stuff if I need to. So here's my question:
If given the choice, what size speakers would you run, and where would you put them. Goal is quality, but I'm not gonna break the bank on some high end speakers. I can build an enclosure or two, but I'm not looking to take on months of fabrication. We all likely have different tolerances for cost and effort, but that's the beauty of discussion. I'd like to see what some of you think.
Re: Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
This was decades ago; I used Pioneer coaxial 4x6's in the dash and 6x9's in the sail panels. I went with the stock size and locations to avoid any panel or bracket cutting. I can't recall what model numbers the speakers are; I think I have the boxes with the OEM speakers within.
These speakers are connected to a Crutchfield 4-channel amp, Pioneer EQ-4000 equalizer and Pioneer DEH-760. Definitely NOT audiophile standards but still nice and loud enough for my tastes.
Eventually, the CD player will be ditched for a period correct, NOS Pioneer KEH-M5500 cassette deck. CD players are just not compatible with the stiff suspension.
The amp is mounted upright on stand-offs to the underside of a board that covers the spare tire well. I ran the power cables along with the factory harness on the same side of the chassis; the audio cables on the opposite side of the chassis.
Last edited by paulo57509; 10-18-2023 at 07:33 PM.
Re: Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
No components up front? Just a regular 4x6? ....if there were ONE thing I feel like I would change, it would be to ditch those 4x6's. BUT maybe if you had good ones....
Re: Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
Yes, just plain 4x6 up front. They were designed to be fit under the dash pad; supplied with no grills. Pioneer did supply plastic spacers with them that were needed for clearance because the factory cutouts are pretty shallow.
I found these in a tote box this morning. The 6x9's in the sail panels are actually tri-axials (installed without the grills).
Re: Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
not much to add from me other than I concur that its the thirdgen packaging that leaves a lot on the table. I have some fairly good JBL 6x9s and 4x6s with some added sound deadener around the mating surfaces connected to an equally good modern blaupunkt stereo (skagen 400 - 4x50 watts) and it sounds very tinny even with the bass turned up. Fair no amp or sub but I'm amazed at how weak it sounds. My partner's base Audi A6 (new) is night and day
Re: Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
"I've noticed over the years as my daily drivers have gone up in quality, that the sound quality from my thirdgens hasn't been all that good"
INSULATION! New vehicles are much better at keeping road noise out and cabin noise in. This is the main reason that no matter the size, shape or power rating of the speakers you use the system will always not sound great. I good friend of mine who competes in stereo contests and usually in the sound quality category tells me this is a must. He is in the process on installing a system in his girls newer Subaru and he took the WHOLE interior out and sound proofed everything! including under the dash. He also said that if you can put your speakers in an enclosure this is much better than in a door or sail panel. He says if you have to do this use mids or high range speakers in those locations. The base reverb into those spaces can't be controlled like a built enclosure. The pics below are a couple he sent me, he has to take these as part of the competition.
I can find out from him the brand of speakers he uses but I know he uses a combo of sizes and most are specific, Tweeters. Mids and Subs. I don't think he uses two or threeway in his builds
Re: Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
The factory speaker locations won’t work for SQ without a digital signal processor. The driver is far too close to the dash and sail panel speakers to compensate. Even with a dsp, the passengers or driver lose out as the dsp corrects for one listener at a time. For less than an AudioControl DQDX dsp one could purchase Qlogic kick panels & a quality set of 5.25 speakers, perhaps even components if you’re willing to do some searching. Shoot for rms ratings to match the output of your amp.
This would provide stage for both driver and front passenger because the distance to each speaker is much more equal.
I would leave the sail panels empty, there is no benefit for the front passengers by using this location, if you’re in the back seat of an Fbody and are hoping for clean sound you clearly aren’t an audiophile.
Im a big fan of the 10” Kicker SubStation. These are getting harder to find now, but fit the price they sound amazing and don’t require a terrific amount of power. They will tuck into the lower trunk area too.
A 4x50 or 4x75W amp would the fronts and sub easily. This setup is killer for the cost, I’d suspect doable for under $1000 all in if you bargain hunt on the deck and amp (you’ll be a very lucky person to find kick panels in your chosen color second hand). Super stretched the budget or if you’ve got some equipment already, add an in dash eq with reasonable cross over and attenuation capacity. Dialing in the sound is much easier with an eq and typically offers better performance.
A little quality time with foam insulation tape will eliminate the rattles, 10 cu ft of sound mat would do the doors, trunk, rear quarters and floors. Carpet lined interior panels are an audio upgrade as well.
Last edited by theraymondguy; 10-19-2023 at 09:38 PM.
Re: Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
I'm not a fan of the q logic kicks as I feel like they take up too much room, especially with a third pedal. What are your thoughts on putting the driver in the door? ....I know you've got that thread going about kick panels too. I'm following along.
Re: Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
Originally Posted by Abubaca
I'm not a fan of the q logic kicks as I feel like they take up too much room, especially with a third pedal. What are your thoughts on putting the driver in the door? ....I know you've got that thread going about kick panels too. I'm following along.
You could run 6.5 speakers in the door but the benefit of relocating is diminished somewhat by moving the drivers side speaker closer too you. Best bet is to mount as near to the kick as possible- right where the power window motor wants to live. Quality 6.5s are 2.75” deep or more.
Leaving the tweeter on the kick panel would be ideal (no more than 6” from mid) a quality 6.5 would make great midbass in a door. If it’s a coupe with a/c firing the tweeter at passengers opposite outside ear can create reflections which help with stage. Open the window, that benefit is gone.
Re: Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
I have had a ton of 3rd gen Trans-Ams and Z28's not to mention hundreds of systems for competitions and customers. If I were in your shoes. I would go to a audio store and listen to several different speakers. I personally would install Boston Acoustics as they have a line of extremely good speakers that replace the OME Junk. They also come with their own crossovers, which keeps them from being driven to hard at frequencies they were not made to endure. In the back you could keep it simple and install a base board into which a pair of *, 10, or 12 in woofers could be installed personally I wouldn't use 12s. instead two 8" subs with a 10" passive radiator in a bass board and compartment that were sealed off very well, would give you a surprising amount of low and penetrating sound without taking up very little room. In the front Boston Acoustics also makes some killer tweeter that you can easily mount or hide in a ac vent to open up so you can feel the songs. For Speakers and subs Boston Acoustics, for a amp I love old school amps. In my mind LINEAR POWER is hard to beat. They are clean power full of power and rugged as hell. I still have 7 of them from the mid 1980's only had to work on one of them because of a solder came loose a 1/2 ohm load . I also would recommend Orion they have some great subs, and their red HCCA series are legendary. With this setup you can annoy your neighbors and impress anyone who sets in the car with you. Good Luck.
Re: Speakers: What size and where? Best bang 4 your buck, AND effort.
Originally Posted by paulo57509
Yes, just plain 4x6 up front. They were designed to be fit under the dash pad; supplied with no grills. Pioneer did supply plastic spacers with them that were needed for clearance because the factory cutouts are pretty shallow.
I found these in a tote box this morning. The 6x9's in the sail panels are actually tri-axials (installed without the grills).
Are you interested in selling these ? Are they good to go ?
10-18-2023, 04:25 PM
