FAST383

What all do I need to convert my 86 LG4 with a computer controlled Q-Jet to a Edelbrock Performer 600 cfm Carb. I know on the box it says not for comp controlled vehicles but I don't have enough money for one of the comp controlled carbs. Will this non comp carb work? what all do I need.
Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks guys!
Josh

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95 Formula
Stroked, and Sprayed
Way to fast

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

You'll save yourself money by keeping your CC carb rather than trying to convert. Let me explain:

Eliminating the CC carb also requires you to change the distributor to a vacuum/mechanical advance model, the EGR valve to a vacuum-only part, and if you really take it to the limit, the A.I.R. diverter valve. Plus, the Perfomer carb is a square-base type, meaning it won't fit on your stock intake manifold. Finally, your torque converter will no longer lock up automatically, so you'll need the kit to provide that function.

So, to the price of the carb, add about $160 for a new intake manifold, somewhere around $100-$250 for a "real" distributor (you can take your chances on a $25 junkyard HEI if you like), perhaps $50 for EGR valve, not sure how much the A.I.R. parts would be, and about $75 for the TCC lockup kit.

You can probably afford the $320 for a rebuilt CC q-jet.

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82 Berlinetta, orig V-6 car, now w/86 LG4/TH700R4, 2300 stall TC. Ported World 305 heads, Crane PowerMax 2050 cam. ZZ3/4 intake, oil pump, pan & baffle. Accel HEI SuperCoil & module. Hooker 2055 headers, 3" Catco cat & 3" catback w/dual-opposite Flowmaster 80. 2.93 limited slip. Spohn SFCs waiting to be installed. AMSOIL syn lubes bumper-to-bumper. Daily year-round driver. Best ET, speed TBD...
57 Bel Air, my 1st car. '66 396, 9.7:1 forged TRWs, Weiand Action+, Holley 750VS w/4150 conversion, GK 270 cam, Magnum rockers, Jacobs Omnipack, 1-3/4" Hedders & 3" Warlocks, TH400 w/TCI Sat Night Special conv & Trans-Scat shift kit, MegaShifter, 3.08 8.2" 10-bolt w/Powertrax, AMSOIL syn lubes bumper-to-bumper. Idles smooth @ 700 RPM in D. Best 15.02/95.06 @ 5800' Bandimere (corrected 13.93/102.4 @ sea level).

[This message has been edited by five7kid (edited November 30, 2001).]

VampireHunterC

Yes, but what if U have headers installed, and have removed all of the emissions control crap? Won't the computer not run the car right without the emissions stuff hooked up?
(I think I asked this question in my other post....)

86-red_dawg

or you could pay $17 and get a carburetor rebuild kit from autozone, plus the 10 dollar haynes how to book - much better alternative

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Last time I priced a rebuild kit it was over $35. It's nice to have someone available to help you do it the first time, and you need real carb cleaner (not the spray stuff), an air compressor, and some special tools to do some of the adjustments.

Although I'm not one to discourage someone from learning more about what makes their car tick (and CC carbs do tick), it doesn't seem that that is very popular these days. People seem to be willing to bolt something on, but having to tweak or tinker with it isn't their idea of a good thing.

So, that's why I didn't mention a rebuild, although it is an economical alternative if you're up to it.

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82 Berlinetta, orig V-6 car, now w/86 LG4/TH700R4, 2300 stall TC. Ported World 305 heads, Crane PowerMax 2050 cam. ZZ3/4 intake, oil pump, pan & baffle. Accel HEI SuperCoil & module. Hooker 2055 headers, 3" Catco cat & 3" catback w/dual-opposite Flowmaster 80. 2.93 limited slip. Spohn SFCs waiting to be installed. AMSOIL syn lubes bumper-to-bumper. Daily year-round driver. Best ET, speed TBD...
57 Bel Air, my 1st car. '66 396, 9.7:1 forged TRWs, Weiand Action+, Holley 750VS w/4150 conversion, GK 270 cam, Magnum rockers, Jacobs Omnipack, 1-3/4" Hedders & 3" Warlocks, TH400 w/TCI Sat Night Special conv & Trans-Scat shift kit, MegaShifter, 3.08 8.2" 10-bolt w/Powertrax, AMSOIL syn lubes bumper-to-bumper. Idles smooth @ 700 RPM in D. Best 15.02/95.06 @ 5800' Bandimere (corrected 13.93/102.4 @ sea level).

toosloz

i did it....and i dont regret it at all


your car will come out a whole different car,my car stock when i got it was a dog...slow as hell...i raced a iroc 350 that just murdered me

i switched everything over and i found him again and put a beat down on him


i paid...$105 for the intake, $220 for the carb and $100 for the distributer.......

worth every damn dime....and anyway......you can reuse the stuff later down the road on a new built up motor

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84z28HO
355
open element/k&n
m5/hurst billet plus shifter
83 z28 fiberglass hood
10bolt w/3:42posi
gm aluminum driveshaft
performer intake
performer 600cfm carb
accel 8mm wires
adjustable thermostat switch
160 stat
gta rims
gts blackouts
s.s rear control arms
s.s panhard rod
s.s subframe connectors
98 camaro rear springs,shocks
98 z28 leather seats
95 camaro rear view mirror
"wonderbar"
4th gen z28 tips
14.3@95mph
http://www.geocities.com/toosloz/84camaroz28.html

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Yeah, 4 weeks ago my stock LG4 was a dog, too. Today I've got a fully-functioning CC system, and it simply runs great. In between, I did the mods in my sig.

I did absolutely nothing to the carb except adjust the idle and choke.

I maintain that the CC carb is not a bad actor that must be replaced in order to get good performance. More evidence at the mag articles link on this board in the two "Stroke in the Desert" articles by Steve Green about his 383 CC project.

I would also suggest (with no flame intended) that if you have to ask how to convert from CC to "old-school" carb you probably don't understand how the CC system works, and therefore don't understand what it takes to make it work better. I am not that far removed from not understanding it, have learned a lot just hanging around on this board, and am quite please with the improvement I've achieved.

I'm actually have more trouble getting the Holley to behave on the '57, if you want to know the truth. It might not even be the carb that's causing my problems - time will tell.

SSC

Reguardless it is easyer to just pop an edelbrock or holley on and gain more power.

I know how to rebuild and tune qjets and theres no way an amature with just a book at hand is going to do any sort of comendable job. Ive pulled apart many qjets that were supposed to have been reciently rebuild and found air tubes laying on the bottem or put in in the improper locations and a vartiety of other problems.

It is worth every penny to replace the qjet. I gained more bottem end with a 600 cfm edelcrap and more top end with a 600cfm holley. The spread to square bore 2 small and two large hole adaptor $18 will fit under the hood with a drop base air cleaner $25 and non CC hei's can be picked up for $50 used.
Add $220 for a carb and you will have a great running car for $313.
SSC

Dont knock it until you tryed it!

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85 Camaro Z28, Cowl induction hood, Black-355/TB400,3:42 posi, Tons of goodies but if you ask, "Its stock"
82 Firebird, White, red in six months-355/TB350,3:42 Powertrax posi. Not an insane amount of goodies but it runs like a motha!
76 Chevy C10, Firemist blue, 355/Muncie HD 3speed,3:73 TorqLine posi. Show me another 12sec@4800ft SBC street truck??
91 GMC 1500 Sierra 4x4, Red, Was 4.3 now the proud recipient of the Firebirds LG4. 305/5 speed.
56 Buick Special, OG Blue&White, V8/auto. Maybee one day I'll get it going.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Why do people think I haven't tried it? This isn't my first time around the block.

I know for a fact that HEI's need help. A $50 junkyard factory HEI is defined not by the "junkyard" part but by the "factory" part. The factory coil and module are JUNK!

I quoted high prices for new stuff because I KNOW most people either don't know how to or aren't willing to learn how to fix what they've got! And, since their problem probably isn't being caused by the carb itself, but by something they won't replace until after they spend all their money on the non-CC stuff, I'm simply urging people to understand what it is they think is wrong, what might be causing it, and not to jump to the conclusion that the "computer controlled q-junk" is the root of their problem.

Is replacing a TPS, for instance, harder than converting to a non-CC setup? Or more expensive? Not hardly.

Josh, you haven't said a word since your original post. What exactly is wrong with your current carb?

86-red_dawg

well for those who say rebuilding is hard, it isn't - i just did my first rebuild - trick is to get another crappy carb and rebuild, so if you mess it up, you can still drive your car - autozone charges 17$ for a rebuild kit, 5$ for a float, if yours needs replacement, and some cleaning supplies - the carb really doesn't have to be spotless,and you don't really need an air compressor and the specialty tools - it took me 5 hours straight to rebuild an old 85 cc quadrajet to put on my 86 camaro, and if you watch closely to what you are doing, you don't even really need the book, except for technicals and things to look out for. My carb however, still had the metal studs in that prevents tampering with, and worked just fine when put back on with no adjustment needed - throttle response is great, no more bog, and best of all, i stand behind my work - don't have to worry about those shady "rebuilt carbs" that other people sell

just my .02 worth

Chris87TA350

Well, this is encouraging to hear seeing as how I'm about to start my first carb rebuild on the CC carb in my car to get it ready for emmissions. I think I agree with five7kid in that most people choose the easy way out and swap out for older stuff instead of learning how to tune what's already on their cars. I love my q-jet and would never replace it for an edelbrock, holley, or even a Demon because I probably wouldn't get as good gas mileage. Did you guys know the primaries on your q-jet are smaller than the jets on a 2-barrel? And you still get 4bbl power! Keep what you've got; it's cheaper and better.

toosloz

my point to dump the computer crap is to have a 450+ 355 and that set up will not work with what i wanna do...sure...you can rebuild the q-jet, but thats more electrical crap i dont want on my car......how many 12 sec cars you see using a stock carb,computer/distributer setup


with just these three pieces...my car went from high 15s to a 14.9....and learning to launch it helped too


granted...this set up is great for lightly modded 305s, but my 450+hp 355/6pd set up it wont do **** for

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84z28HO
355
open element/k&n
m5/hurst billet plus shifter
83 z28 fiberglass hood
10bolt w/3:42posi
gm aluminum driveshaft
performer intake
performer 600cfm carb
accel 8mm wires
adjustable thermostat switch
160 stat
gta rims
gts blackouts
s.s rear control arms
s.s panhard rod
s.s subframe connectors
98 camaro rear springs,shocks
98 z28 leather seats
95 camaro rear view mirror
"wonderbar"
4th gen z28 tips
14.3@95mph
http://www.geocities.com/toosloz/84camaroz28.html

[This message has been edited by toosloz (edited December 05, 2001).]

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Wrong answer. Completely wrong.

What you call "computer crap" will out-flow a 600 Edelbrock Performer. No way a 600 cfm Performer will support 450 HP better than a stock 795 cfm CC q-jet with standard tuning mods.

A stock CC q-jet is more than capable of supporting 450 HP. Have you seen the size of carb GM puts with their "Deluxe" crate engines? Smaller than your CC q-jet. My '57 ran a corrected 13.9 with a 750 CFM q-jet, which is less than a CC q-jet will flow, and that car weighs 3950 lbs going down the track.

You people really need to get an understanding of how things work.

86-red_dawg

five7kid, you are my hero :-)
did you build that 57 yourself?

i'm currently restoring a 53 buick, but it'll be stock with an inline 8 for now, so a little less on the dragstrip times ;-)

www.53buick.com

wiggy'sIROC

I've gotta stand with five7kid on this. Anything worth doing is worth doing right the first time. The kid has given me plenty of advise and tips and he hasn't led me wrong. This is what I think, research the problem, tell us what "exactly" is going on, and at least try to save yourself some money. Heck, if the kid is wrong all you are out is $20 for a rebuild kit. The time it takes to try it will actually teach you. If it works for you, you just saved a couple hundred dollars and the frustration of going from computer controlled to no computer. I was going to do this myself but I chose to learn diagnostics and tuning and save myself a few bucks and me and my car are the better for it.

I know you didn't say anything in your original post about rebuiding and we just assumed that there was something wrong. Why are you wanting to do the change?

Mark

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1986 IROC LG4 "Bone Stock" (for now)

[This message has been edited by wiggy'sIROC (edited December 06, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by wiggy'sIROC (edited December 06, 2001).]

toosloz

never said i was using a 600 for my 450hp 355
....that was for the 305.....i am upping to a 750...so far.....we have a few fast cars in town.....one was a 72 nova with a 540merlin and a 300 shot running 9.17@151mph....he is using holley....others are a 70 demon with a built to **** 340 and he is using and edelbrock 800 and that car is high to mid 11 sec capable

another is a built 69 judge with a 455 running 12.6 on motor usng a 750 edelbrock...

with exhaust, mainly headers.....my car will run in the 13.8 sec area.....and that with the 600just for ****s and giggles....i might see what the 150 cfm difference is when i run my car this spring...oh....and another thing...my car ran that 14.3 with 8 initial timing and no exhaust and a mismatched intake for tha cams powerband....traction would also help....tell me a 600 cfm car can't be fast?

[This message has been edited by toosloz (edited December 06, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by toosloz (edited December 06, 2001).]

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

At the end of this month, I will have had it for 30 years. About the only things I haven't done on it are the rebuild machine work, exhaust pipe bending, front end alingment and tire mounting/balancing. Okay, I pulled the TH400 this spring and had a fellow racer who specializes in trannies do the overhaul, but that's about all the "other hands" that touch it.

My older brother dragged a 53 Buick out of the junkyard back in the mid-60's, rebuilt it and drove it on his honeymoon. Since I was only about 11 years old at the time, that straight 8 crank was about as long as I was tall. A whole bunch of iron under the hood, not much power, not exactly a 1320 warrior. But, you get it on the road, you'll have something unique.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

We still haven't heard back from Josh why he wants to replace his carb, which started this topic.

toosloz

my friends dad is building a 57 with a 385 ...edelbrock jr victor heads and a bunch of other things

------------------
84z28HO
355
open element/k&n
m5/hurst billet plus shifter
83 z28 fiberglass hood
10bolt w/3:42posi
gm aluminum driveshaft
performer intake
performer 600cfm carb
accel 8mm wires
adjustable thermostat switch
160 stat
gta rims
gts blackouts
s.s rear control arms
s.s panhard rod
s.s subframe connectors
98 camaro rear springs,shocks
98 z28 leather seats
95 camaro rear view mirror
"wonderbar"
4th gen z28 tips
14.3@95mph
http://www.geocities.com/toosloz/84camaroz28.html

FAST383

Sorry I haven't got back to reply (lots of school work I think I'm gonna try the rebuild of the cc q-jet. If it still doesn't work I will try the performer and the switch over to non cc. I also have a bad fuel pump so I need to replace that. Thanks for all the help w/ everything. I'll post on how the rebuild goes. Does anyone have a site on how to rebuild a CC Q-jet? That would help a lot.

I'll keep you all informed
Thanks all!
Josh

86-red_dawg

the best idea is to get the 11$ haynes manual from autozone on rebuiding carbs - once you read it over, you can pretty much do it without the manual, just a few of the nicknaks that help

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

You still haven't said what you're trying to fix, just what you're going to do to fix it.

If you have a bad fuel pump, a carb kit isn't going to change whatever problem that is causing (how do you know you have a bad fuel pump?).