Fixing to put on an alchy kit on my car and would like to spray methanol with it. I want to set it to come on at only a couple of pounds of boost and be at full flow. If I tune out some of the fuel to compensate should I still shoot for any different AFR. I know there is no set AFR for every setup but does alcohol change anything as far as exhaust is concerned? AFR is AFR right, no matter what fuel?

 

If you spray a preset pressure of alcohol into the motor, as soon as the alcohol hits, it will drop your AFR's since now you've added a fuel. the as your boost rises, unless you alky rises, your going backwards since the pressure inside the intake tract is rising making less alcohol pressure. Kinda the reason FPR are boost referenced.

Typically boost pressure will increase cylinder pressure which will make the motor detoante more. Adding alcohol into the incoming air eliminates the detonation by dropping IAT temps, assisting with the combustion, and providing a higher ocatne fuel to burn.

HTH

I did an alky kit on an 89 Vette not too long ago, he's running 20 PSI on 93 octane. 383, .700 roller, ATI D1, brodix heads, etc... Pretty clean and lots of room on the car.

 

You never shot for an AFR. You tune for what makes the motor run best.

Your making life more complex then it needs to be. Just use the Alky as a supplemential amount of fuel. Turning off SOME fuel when in boost, while adding alky can lead to some unwanted side effects.

Alky takes about twice as much as gasoline to burn at Stoich..

 

Been thinking of this myself.

Grumpy, what would you do. Tune all your ve stuff and bpw multplier w/out the alky, then up the timing a little and add alky, or would you tune and scan everything WITH the alky ?

-- Joe

 

Gotta first start with a good baseline.
So, IMO, you have to first tune everything in with just the gasoline.
Then start adding alky and see what changes.

And if you're serious about this, maybe start using EGT.
There's a relationship between charge cooling, and EGT.
Knowing at what points, the tune, knees over, would be helpful.

 

I had hoped you would say that. Thats kinda the plan I had. Right now I have 0 tuning with $58. All my stuff was $8d. And my "2-bar" map ended up being a 1 bar. Man, don't try that ..

EGT.. Ermm Exhaust Gas Temp? I feel like I'm wrong.

Thanks Bruce.

-- Joe

 

Grumpy is rite on. Add it to your base tune then work from there.

Its really a lot simpler than appears, and extremely forgiving when you spray too much.

EGT's rock :lala:

Yes Exhuast Gas Temp

 

Crazy. Hope my nozzle shows up today. I'm trying to decide which tank I want for the alky too.. Got tons of different washer tanks on the shelf.

-- Joe

 

Best setup gravity feeds the pump. And offers unrestricted flow to the pump. Use 3/8 hose thats alcohol compatible for feed. I use -4 teflon hose for pressure.

 

Yeah I'm gonna mount the shurflo under the battery tray like the TTA on your website. The question was more of what size tank. I have a small NAPA tank that might work well, won't be in the way of anything.. Or I can mount a small fuel cell where the battery used to be.

I hope that nozzle you sent me shows up tomorrow.

-- Joe

 

Why not use the factory overflow for alky, then use the small NAPA tank for your radiator.

GM still sells these tanks affordably. And the TTA tank is 1 1/2 gallons.

It was mailed out so it in route

Feed hose from tank to pump is 18 inches long.

 

Battery used to be on driver, now its on passenger. I'm mounting the pump on driver side, and putting the tank above it.

I'll post a pic at one point.

I've got prolly 20 tanks.. I buy a *lot* of thirdgens and scrap 'em.

-- Joe

 

The 89 TTA has the battery on the passenger side. New tanks from GM are less than 20 dollars, and wont need to be decontaminated. You dont want to chance debris clogging your nozzle.. clogged nozzle=no alky.

Keep the pump under the tank, you'll be ok.

Just trying to help

 

Might goggle for SMC, and water/alky injection and look at what he sells.
While only one quart, the desing seem reasonable, and lots of folks are running his system. Given a warm day or two I'll be running the wiring for mine, and have it operational.

 

dont mention water and SMC in the same sentance

The little EFI pump he uses will go to a quick death on anything but denatured and lube.

Just trying to save you some heartache.

Google alcohol injection, or better yet, progressive alcohol injection

 

I got a shurflow 1.8gph 100psi pump.. That will work fine.

The Napa tank is brand new in a box. Came with my vortech blower.. But the hose is wicked small. Windshield washer type small. I'll drill and put a different fitting on.. You say 3/8 ??

I think willie runs SMC. I'll prolly give Julios stuff a try if I don't like the way '749 controls it.. Been working on using the wastegate
control in '749.

-- Joe

 

Joe, could of saved you some money if you got the 60 PSI pump. Its identical in every aspect as the 100 PSI pump cept the set screw on the top and how far down its turned. An allen wrench is all thats needed to convert a 60 PSI pump to a 100 PSI pump

You need a gallon capacity minimum, and feed the pump with a 3/8 hose that has no obstructions. the Shurflo pump is very sensitive to input restrictions, and restriction, its output drops big time. I've played with the pump quite a bit. hence the knowledge.

Sealing the tank and keeping it from leaking.. good luck. You cant use any adhesive, becuase alcohol fumes will break it down. kinda one of the downfalls of the SMC tank, becuase there is epoxy sealing the connections, the alcohol will breakdown the epoxy over time. I cant find any adhesive that can be exposed to alcohol long term. And with a V8 your consumption if you plan on making any power will be approx 6-8 oz minimum per pass, so half gallon jug is only good for 6-8 passes before completely depleted. You can make a bulkhead fitting and use a teflon or stat-o-seal washer for sealing, but only do this when there is absolutely no possible other way. The stuff leaks... you'll be sorry. And methanol when it catches on fire, you cannot see flames. Burns 100% clean.

Listen, your motor relies on the system to keep it from detonating. If any place I wouldnt take any short cuts $$$ is in the hoses, pump, and tank. Your better off having no system than a questionable one that you start relying on.

Just the words of experience making, designing, installing, tuning, these types of systems. Spend the money, do it rite the first time, be done with it and spend your time tuning/enjoying vs chasing issues down. We aint talking but little $$.

Wanna save some money, make your own alcohol. :hail:

Drink the leftovers.

hehe