just wondering, and yes i have read a ton of post, but can the average joe (that's me) tune my own car and know what i'm doing in a timely manner....i don't mind learning things, but if it's going to take all summer i am not sure that i want to take on the challenge......is the process real complicated???? i need to tune my car something fierce!!! i was going to go to PCMFORLESS.com but don't know about that either....i just know my car and i need some great advice......thank you guys so much

 

Until recently i had no experience tuning. Started within the last month and between some common sense and posts on this board, got the car running after a rebuild and upgrade. Still no where near perfect but runs good and has no mechanical problems......

 

do you have to manually punch in all the numbers, like for instance injector valve open times (don't know if that's what it's called), or is there a preset kinda of guide for you to go off of??

 

You will learn as you go, read the stickies on the top of the
page then read them again. Once you start, you will
get hooked. Start out slow and read and ask questions
use the search function also.

 

Ain't that the truth?!


I agree whole heartedly!

 

You have a wealth of info and a fantastic community at your fingertips. Dive in the waters great. Once you start you wont want to quit.

 

can you learn how to tune & burn your own chips? yes, you can.
is it something thats fast & quick to learn? no, its not. there is alot of reading.
if you have tuned carburated motors in the past, your doing the same thing but with a computer instead of jets & weights & your doing it much more accurately.
can you get a better overall running car by tuning it yourself over a mail order tune? yes.
you can also find some addtional miles per gallon in a well tuned chip.

warning, chip tuning is addictive & can lead to many hours of frustration, followed by bleeding from your eyes.
that is completely offset by the huge smile & tons of enjoyment when you get it right
then there is the look of amazement on your friends' faces when you tell them you tuned it yourself.

you can start with the bin thats in your ECM right now.
for you i believe that would be AUJP.
AUJP_V4 would be an upgrade if you start burning your own chips.

to get an ideal of whats involved you can down load TunerPro, the right Def files for your application, & the right bin file. install TunerPro & load the files then open the bin you downloaded.

once you have everything you need to burn your first chip, you get a data log & see what the motor is doing. based on what the log tells you, you make changes where they are needed.

this is about as basic as i can lay it out.
in Constants/Scalers you find things like temp settings, injector settings, engine displacement settings along with a good number of other things.
in Flags/Switches you find settings for mainly trouble codes, but there are some other things that you may need to change.
you can think of Constants/Scalers and Flags/Switches as basic settings, once you have them set to where they need to be for your car, you can pretty much leave them alone unless you make some changes like a bigger motor or bigger injectors.
in Tables/Functions is where you find the things that you'll be changing the most, like the spark & VE tables. there are also a lot of other setting that you may need to change for your motor to run properly.

i'll add, once you start tuning, you will always be working on it to see if there is more to be gained, like has been said, it is addictive

 

well i think i'm conviced.....i've had this car torn apart for almost a year doing one thing after the other on it from interior, to suspension and brakes, trans and rear diff., and of course the motor it self....spared no expense (what i could anyway) and did all the work by myself completly.....i suppose it's only right to finish what i started......i'll scroll through and read read read everything till i go crosseyed and give her a try.....
YOU GUYS ARE ALWAYS A GREAT HELP ANYTIME I HAVE A QUESTION OR CONCERN THAT NEEDS AN ANSWER....THANKS A TON!!!!!!

 

Hello average Joe. I too am new to prom burning. I've been tuning a couple of months. It took me a while to get going, asked a lot of questions, read a lot. My kids could have gotten this thing going a lot quicker than I did. My answer to your question is- It really depends on your grasp on tuning in general. I have been tuning cars (hot rods) for 20 years in the "real world" so it really helped me know what to do in the "digital world". If you have experiance or at least aptitude for tuning you can do it. Just take your time and learn as you go. In fact, if you understand and conceptualize what's going on, you may have an advantage in that you wont have to "re-learn" what everything is called. It semed like everything was confusing till something clicked then Ah ha! it made sense. Your experiance will be unique. Making the change to the program is pretty straingt forward and just takes a little while to know how to get the result you desire. Knowing what your engine wants and what to change is a little more difficult. You'll get it. There may be a half a dozen ways to do something and six people may have six ways to do it. You will figure how you want to do it with experiance. Once I got the hang of it I was hooked. In fact, one day I got my tune so close I was lost cause I didn't have anything else to do! Now I gonna add nitrous just so I got something more to tinker with Anyway, it doesn't cost that much to get started and there are a lot of us to help you along. I say DO IT!

 

okay.....now what is everything i need.....and i found the tunerpro web site so thats good....whats and where to get BIN?? andd the programmer and chips.....thanks so much guys i'm going to do it now for sure sounds like a fun challenge!!!

 

Check out Moates.net for your equipment and He also has a binary section with XDF files and differents bins available. That should take care of everything else that you will need.

 

Ok, from www.moates.net get the Burn1, this actually programs the chip. Get the ALDU1 and CABLE1, that allows you to hook your car to your laptop. Get the GP1 package, that allows you to put a EEPROM (re-programmable prom) in your factory computer, it comes with a zif adaptor (I recommend it) and 2 chips. When you order all this you'll also get a copy of Mark Mansur's TunerPro RT. TunerPro is the program that allows you to alter the actual .bin, datalog and record. There are links on moates website under "documentation" that has .bins, and XDF files. XDF files are whats needed to let TunerPro recognize and translate and modify your .bin. There's a different XDF for different .bins. If you happen to have an 89 MAF car, TunerPro already has the .bins and XDF's loaded. If not, get them from the documentation link.

Everything above will get you going. It includes all the cables and programs you'll need and will only set you back about $225. It's a bargan when you recognize what it really can do for you. These guys (Moates and Mansur) have given the DIY crowd a real gift in their work. The prices are a bargan-really!

I also recommend HDR1. It's an adaptor that allows the Burn1 to "read" your factory chip so you don't really need to "find" a .bin at all.

Good luck and have a blast. Just remember follow the directions, ask question and when (not if) you get stumped, slow down and think about it. Most of the problems I had were silly things like putting the chip in backwards when I just KNEW I had it in right.

 

You could also go the route i did and get a EBL Flash system. Will cost about twice as much at $465 for a used ECM, having it upgraded to EBL and having a port mod done with delivery....... but every change you make is done via the laptop.... no need to take out the computer from behind the dash and swap chips...... link for the system is below....

www.dynamicefi.com

 

http://www.moates.net/documentation....entation_id=72

 

ill check it out for sure....now if i understand correctly i can "re-burn" the chips as needed....until i get it right and then when i upgrade more car parts. one more quick question...i should start working on the programming of the car after i finish what i am installing for parts (to me that just makes since, but better ask), or can i start right away on it......i don't know if i listed my mods that are already done but include heads,headers, cam, intake, ignition, etc. etc......the car ran 14.0 stock with just intake.....then the other day when 13.8 with all the mods, but i know i needed to upgrade from stock 48mm TB, stock injectors, and of course the computer.....you guys seem very knowledgable so i want to ask also (i know wrong section but..) 52mm or 54mm TB (both on ebay for $150) and LT1 injectors (running out of money, trying to save a penny or two)....also i read about doing a MAF conversion (don't know if it's worth it or not) would that be something i should consider, I heard it's easier to get fine tune programing with a MAF over MAP system, i would like to leave the MAP if I can do just as well with that..thanks again guys....let me know what you think....I'm going to order my stuff by the weekend if not sooner!!!!! and I'll keep ya posted on the improvements on the track when it's all said and done (will do pre-computer run with all parts installed, and post-computer run to show the improvement for others to see if you think that would be good encouragement for others)

 

Antman, I'm also interested in the tuning. I have a stock 89 5.7 TPI with 2460 hookers without airpump, tubes and Y-pipe without a Cat. converter. I get 20 mpg hwy. I drive 100 miles per day and I'd like to get better fuel economy. All my driving is highway driving. Do you think I can get more MPG and also is that $325.00 apu1 needed for what I want or will the burn1 and other stuff you mentioned be all that I need? Gas just hit $4.00 gal. today, so I'm just looking for a way to improve my MPG. I drive like a Granny and VERY rarely "get-on" my car.

 

Chrisry1995, yes tuning can help with fuel mileage.
before you start, make sure all the basics are good, things like plugs, wires, timing & no air or vacuum leaks.
at 20 mpg hiway, it sounds like something isn't quite right.
with the headers it may be the O2 sensor isn't staying warm enough to keep the ECM in closed loop.
being able to take a data log can help you fix whats wrong with the basics.

the things that Antman mentioned will get you started.
i went with the AutoProm because i wanted to be able to do real time emulation from the start. most people don't have access to a 5 gas analyzer & a dyno like i do, so it
helped me having that ability.

 

Thanks for the reply, With the motor being rebuilt, it did have new gaskets,plugs,wires,injectors, distribitor and the timing was set to factory specs. with the wire unplugged as per manuel. I do have THE original GM book. Anyway, the O2 sensor is a 1 wire Delco made sensor. My car don't seem to run hot at all, around 180.Too cool??? Factory 220??? I'll make sure I've got a 195 thermostat installed. Not going into closed loop then, as you said. Can I find out if it is going closed loop without buying the prom stuff first? It has a varible fan control/sensor on 2nd. fan and the first fan is hooked-up stock. I've seen O2's with 2 or 3 wires available. Would that be an option? And how do you hook it up? I can also smell the exhaust, and it is running rich. Plugs are not as clean burning as I would like. Put in brand new set, ran the car on highway and plugs were alittle sootey...black....rich. So I agree with you on O2 sensor/closed loop. BTW all vacume hoses are new/good. Also the old Very tired 305 that came out of car with ALL original parts/exhaust only got 21 MPG...and it had 6 injectors that were reading 2 ohms to 28 ohms across the coil's. Not sure exactly,but only 2 were with-in specs. Car ran like crap. So I was disappointed when the new motor only got 20 MPG..but I was thinking it was bigger, so??? and it did have headers,no cat, and the air foil thing for intake. That should improve gas mileage. I didn't worry that much until now. Today gas is $4.12 a gallon!!!!! So I need to make sure it's running correctly before I burn any prom's...Right? And THANK-YOU. You did get me thinking.

 

no problem.

180 is a good temp, its what i have in my car. i don't know what the closed loop temp is set to in your chip, maybe someone who does know will answer.
having been run with bad injectors, the ECM may be damaged. sometimes the only way to know for sure is to try a known good ECM.

you can check to see if its going into closed loop without a scanner, but using a scan tool of some kind is the best way.
i do not recommend driving the car or letting it run for an extended amount of time using this method.
bring the motor up to operating temp, turn it off & wait 10 seconds. jumper terminals A & B as if your checking codes. while watching the check engine light, start the motor & let it run for a few minutes. the light should be flashing fast after you first restart the motor, about 2 & 1/2 times per second. if it goes into closed loop the light will slow down & flash about 1 time per second.

if your O2 sensor is in one of the header tubes close to the exhaust port it may be staying hot enough, but its only looking at one cylinder & not the whole bank.
in that case i feel a heated O2 sensor mounted down in the collector would be better.
i believe the heated 3 wire O2 sensor is AC Delco #AFS-74
you could also get a 4 wire heated sensor which uses 2 ground wires instead of 1.
a search here on the boards for heated O2 sensor should turn up the info you need.

if your still using the 305 chip & knock sensor on the 350 motor, it won't run like it should. you may also need to swap out the knock module too. a search should turn up
the info you need on that too.
when you went to the 350, did you use injectors for the 350 or for the 305? they are different, a 305 uses 19s & a 350 uses 22s

 

OK, lots of stuff scince last post. should start new thead titled "New user looking for improved MPG" so I don't hijach this one o.k.?

 

Stock TB is more than adequate for your mods. Spend your $$$ on some tuning gear