Before anyone jump and say search for the answer I did search for it and found out that the VATS is a common problem in late third gen model so here is my story I have a 1992 Z28 that was converted to carb long time ago it was fine till it started to act up before a year or so when I try to crank it nothing happens sometimes it fires up right away and sometimes not even a click just now I was working on the carb I crank it over to let the mechanical fuel pump fill the carb and when I left off the ignition switch and give it little gas to start up the car wont even crank I checked few wires grounds connections everything seems normal and checked the fuse box everything is working here I know its another problem I searched for the answer and VATS was behind this as some members here have the same exact problem as mine the PCM with the wiring is long gone I didnt have this problem before or at the beginning of the converting so Im assuming its the VATS about to die,now I want to cancel the VATS forever is there a way? Or should I get hot shot starter wiring like the drag cars and hook it up? I want to have fun with this car but this problem wont let me and I never had the chance to look at this problem till now it happened to me

 

jumper/bypass the starter enable relay

 

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/elec...o-rs-wont.html

 

Ok this sucks I just tried to fire her up and it fires up !! I think when the security light was blinking before I cant remember but now it doesnt so should I just bypass the starter enable relay? I think I will put a pushbutton just in case it acts up on me again

 

By the way the neutral switch is bypassed long time ago it was purple wire with green wire I will check those wires again later they might be not contacted good

 

Have tried to clean the resistor contacts on the key. Sometimes the key gets contaminated or oxidized and doesn't make good connection to the VATS circuit. It worked for me until I just did the resistor trick,(you must have seen how it's done through your search). But the best way is to get it programed out with a custom chip.

 

My Camaro is carburetor and I have taken all the wiring and ECU out so why a custom chip? If I run a hot shot bump switch from painless will this help me get over the VATS ?

 

The pellet in your key is worn and doesn't make good contact everytime you start your car. I took a fluke meter and got the resistance from the pellet in the key and went to radio shack and got the same value resistor. Take the resistor and put it inline with orange and white wire that runs to your ignition cylinder just under the dash. It has a black plug-in that you can wire the resistor into without cutting anything. Add a little black tape and you are done. I did this years ago and haven't had a vats problem since. When it locks you out I think you have to wait 13 minutes or so before it will re-set and allow you to try again.

 

 

just connect the purple wire too the green with white stripe wire at the starter interrupt relay pigtail. no need to install relay unless you are running into hot starter woes caused by excessive heat from headers and a old ford starter relay works great for that.

 

Just now the security was on so I tried this method I learned from Corvette C4 owner lock the doors from the inside and let it be 10min or so I tried that and it worked

 

Door switch has no connection to VATS or the starter
https://www.thirdgen.org/vats_passkey_system

As already noted , once the ECM is gone all you have to is bypass the starter relay and VATS is gone for good
no need for resistors
If that is done and you still won't start then you problem lies elsewhere ;
Ign switch , P/N inhibitor switch , wiring to starter solenoid , etc

 

So all I need to do now is bypass the starter relay?

 

Can anyone tell me exactly how to bypass the relay I searched for it and cant figure out what exactly to do I will go now and try to find the relay

 

I posted on post #10, the relay is under the drivers side kick panel.

 

I opened up the driver side kick panel just now and I didnt find any relays for the starter I found two connectors I disconnected them and try to fire her up and it fires one of them was for lock and unlock the doors and the other looks like a relay but when I disconnected them both it can be fired, I remember along time ago I did bypass the neutral safety from the shifter it was purple wire and green wire will this effect the bypass starter relay?

 

why dont you just put a new tumbler and key in it? its a lot less of a headache than doing all of that other stuff..

 

Wait a minute so my problem is the ignition key ?!! I tried another key and same results is it ignition key cylinder dying? Did anyone use non-chip ignition key cylinder?

 

https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/elec...-location.html
https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/elec...0-starter.html

If the key turns it is not your problem
but you could have a problem with the Ign switch which is operated by the key.
If it is out of position ( or faulty ) it won't operate the starter circuit when key is turned to start

 

the key could still be a problem regardless if it turns or not. If the resistor in the key is damaged or what not...

say your vats resistance is 12 ohms. if the resistor in the key has a higher resistance than 12 ohms, guess what. its going to turn and not crank.


Usually, 1 of the 2 wires coming out of the ignition cylinder breaks inside of the column, causing the car to not crank. your car sounds like it either has a wire thats really close to breaking, or the resistor in the key is messed up and intermittenly showing a higher resistance.

thats the easiest way i can describe this. I would honestly just get another ignition cylinder and a key. its not real difficult to change it out, but you'll need to know the resistance value of the key. Most dealers still have their VATS tester, I'm sure they could stick your key in it and figure it out for you.

 

Why bother?
With the carb he has ,VATS is gone anyway as a anti thieft device so just delete the VATS operated starter relay and no more VATS related problems

OP still has not confirmed that he has a complete circuit from the Ign switch to starter terminal?

 

if you measure the resistance of the pellet you can a get blank key on eBay and get it cut at any hardware store.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/1989-2002-CA...edd289&vxp=mtr

 

What does OP stands for? Anyway I tried putting the test light on the starter terminal and when I hit the key the light turns on that was my first test before doing anything

So should I just change the ignition cylinder key or bypass the relay? I noticed something about the ignition switch when you turn it counter clockwise to turn on the acce. It wont stay on that position it goes back to off but this problem was there since it was fuel injection back in 2006 maybe like some members said the wires about to get cut

 

op stands for original poster. check the solenoid purple wire with a volt ohm meter not a test light. you stated before you bypassed the neutral safety switch you wire contacts there maybe bad. you need to check the voltage and connections all the way too the starter to determine if you are dealing with a voltage loss from a faulty connection at the p/n switch or a vats starter interrupt issue , faulty or mis adjusted ignition switch or bad starter solenoid.

 

Will check them later and get back to you,the car now starts fine from the first hit from the ignition key dont know whats going on

 

I checked the ohm on the keys one read 475 and the old key 477 and it didnt read directly I had to scratch it little bit with ohm meter then it read

 

You are still missing the point.
With a carb , VATS does nothing for you car anymore so why stuff around with new keys / or the resistors/ yada ,yada.
Bypass the relay ; VATS GONE

Still doesn't mean you have solved what appears to be a intermittent problem with your wiring to the starter as already outlined by tunedperformanc in post # 24 above
Instead of playing around measuring your key resistance you should be metering the wiring from Ign switch to the solenoid to see where the fault(s) lie
As I already noted , the Ign switch itself may be at fault; not adjusted correctly or it's contacts worn

 

i had a vats problem for two months and about drove me nuts....sad thing is that had it programmed out the computer and it was still giving me a fit...i just bypassed mine today with a resistor under the dash... u need to get a ohm reader and see what the values are in the key and get a resistor at radio shack with the same ohms.....there is a orange wire with two white wires in there... splice them and put the resistor in there and problem solved.... one less electrical problem to worry about...

 

Not really ,
all you have done is fool the VATS module into thinking the correct key is being used.If in future the module or relay fail you will still have no start
Bypass the relay and anything VATS related is gone completely

 

Vetteoz can you please tell me exactly what to do when I find the relay?

 

Post #10 tells you. The relay is usually behind the driver's kick panel. Mine has gooey black stuff on it. If the relay is missing, then there should still be a connector, but somebody will have already made the modification.

 

Your wire colors may be different to those shown in the diagram above
.
In any case , at the starter relay there should be 2 thick wires and 2 thin wires.
Cut the 2 thick wires off the relay connector and join them together

 

This is what I wanted to know just connect the two thick wires nothing else should I do?

 

Ok after searching for the relay I found one I believe thats the right one it has one thick green wire and one thick tan wire and two slim wires should I disconnect the relay and try to fire her up to make sure thats the right relay?

 

Yes
Before you cut anything ;jumper the 2 thick wires together at the relay connector

 

Dont touch the large wires.

Just cut the ground wire coming from the vats box to the relay a few inches from the relay, put a ring terminal on it and bolt it to the body.

Starter relay no longer vats dependent.

 

Does anyone tried this way?

 

I've done it numerous times, mainly just to bypass the vats lockout when testing, or on cars with vats programmed out.

 

Now Im confused on which way to go with !!

 

So let me get this straight

Cut the ground from relay and connect it to the body this way Im keeping the relay for the starter and in the same time the VATS is not woking anymore?

 

Bingo.

 

Appreciate the simplicity of your solution but if VATS is no longer in the car , why retain a item ( the relay ) that is performing no function and subject to failure? ( with age )

If the relay fails on the road he will still have a no-starter situation

 

K.I.S.S

 

Isnt some cars needs a relay for starter? I've seen some cars wont crank till after few tries because of no relay and when they put one it cranks right away

If it fails on the road I will keep extra relays with me

 

I had to add a relay to my old truck (66 GMC). When the engine was warmed up, the truck wouldn't start. I'd have to wait about an hour for it to cool down enough. It wouldn't crank because the old ignition switch and wiring just weren't up to carrying enough current to pull the solenoid in once everything got hot. I ran a 14GA wire from the battery to the relay and from the relay to the starter solenoid. Then I connected the original start wire to the relay coil. The other relay coil is grounded. Starts every time no matter what. Pulls the solenoid in like new car now.

Sometimes an exhaust leak can heat the starter and solenoid up and cause a similar no-crank situation until it cools off.

 

Correct .
In some cars it supplies power direct from the batt to starter to reduce voltage drop.
In a VATS car it only functions as a means of cutting off the power to the starter for anti theft and with a carb you have already deleted the most important part of VATS ; the fuel cut off function
A half decent thief can throw a wire on your coil and a wire to the starter and be off with you car

 

That's why I like my VATS. Bypassing the relay is a piece of cake, but supplying that signal to the ECM to make it pulse the injectors is a tough one for even the best thief.

EDIT: My car will not be driven away. Possibly even by me some day.

 

So what now? Should I keep the relay or not?

 

It's up to you, you have several options available to effect a bypass of it. I'm not a fan of cutting the factory wires, so I'd probably remove the relay and install a jumper into the socket to connect the fat wires. That way it is completely reversable.

 

Indeed, however most people arent very good at wiring, and from a lot of experience i've seen that even most who claim to be, arent, so the likelyhood of a good solid reliable connection of the two large wires, isnt nearly a possibility as a reliable small ring terminal onto the ground wire, also the failure of the relay is a slim chance, do you go replacing your fuel pump and fan relays with house light switches because "its something else to go bad" too ?