Engine Swap Everything about swapping an engine into your Third Gen.....be it V6, V8, LTX/LSX, crate engine, etc. Pictures, questions, answers, and work logs.

Lemme get this straight

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old May 1, 2003 | 03:39 PM
  #1  
87WS6's Avatar
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,565
Likes: 10
From: Texas
Car: 1992 Formula Firebird
Engine: 305CID (LB9)
Transmission: World Class T5
Axle/Gears: 10-bolt, 4.10 gears
Lemme get this straight

Just to make sure I do everything necessary to make a swap from my 305TPI to a 383.

I need SFCs.
Better gears.
Some sort of aftermarket intake. Or can I port my existing TPI stuff?
I have a posi rear already.

then of course I need an engine and a new prom.

Am I missing anything? I just want to make sure I know what I am getting into before I start blindly buying parts.
Reply
Old May 2, 2003 | 11:16 AM
  #2  
kfoley's Avatar
Supreme Member
 
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,766
Likes: 2
From: New Palestine, IN (Just East of Indy)
Car: '85 Z28
Engine: 305
Transmission: WC T5, 3.23 posi
You might want to get a heavy duty posi unit if you plan on putting out some power, the stocker won't hold much. The tranny will also need some beefing up, but that can hold off for a while as long as you don't beat on it too much (the same goes for the rear end).

An aftermarket intake is a must, and aftermarket runners are reccomended. Personally I'm not a big fan of TPI (or FI in general) so I can't really help you out a whole lot in that department, I only know what I've heard. Most people running a large displacement/high power motor use a Stealth Ram or something of the sort, or you could always go with Accel's DFI setup, which I hear is pretty good but kind of pricey.

You will also need an externally balanced flexplate and damper for that 383. If you plan on going with Vortec heads (best bang for the buck, if you want I have a set for sale) you will need a special intake.

If it were me, I would buy the best bottom end you can afford. That way it will cost less for balancing. You can also get an internally balanced 383 crank and that will allow you to run your flexplate and damper you have now (although I would reccomend upgrading to a Streetdampr). The block will also have to me machined for the longer crank throw at the pan rails, and the rods might need clearanced for the cam (at least .050" clearance cam/rods) or you might be forced to run a small base circle cam.
You should probably also replace the motor and tranny mounts with good poly ones while you're in there.

Your cooling system will have to be up to par for the new motor, if you're pushing a lot of hp, chances are the stock system won't cut it. Check out the tech articles for a good single or dual fan setup.

That's about all I can think if right now, I'm sure I'll think of stuff later. Sorry if I gave you more info than you wanted, I just didn't want you to miss some hidden cost of the project.
Reply
Old May 2, 2003 | 01:16 PM
  #3  
87WS6's Avatar
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,565
Likes: 10
From: Texas
Car: 1992 Formula Firebird
Engine: 305CID (LB9)
Transmission: World Class T5
Axle/Gears: 10-bolt, 4.10 gears
I've got the factory dual fans. Shouldn't that setup be good enough if I set the second fan to run most of the time? Replacing the motor mounts sounds like a good idea. From what I understand replacing them is fairly inexpensive. Also I found this crate engine at http://www.desertperformance.com.

Thier 383 seems like the best bang for the buck I have found. They also have an emissions complaint engine which is what I will need in my state. I don't know about the flexplate deal though. I think the engine I found does have it. I am not sure about mating it to the 700r4. But from what I have read on here any autoflexplate on a GM engine should mount to the 700r4. Correct me if I am wrong. I want to do this right. Buy all the right stuff and make this as simple as possible. I'm going to try and do the swap myself. I've never done one before. I have friends that have. They will be helping me on this. I will try and do as much as possible myself.

Last edited by 87WS6; May 2, 2003 at 01:22 PM.
Reply
Old May 2, 2003 | 01:36 PM
  #4  
kfoley's Avatar
Supreme Member
 
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,766
Likes: 2
From: New Palestine, IN (Just East of Indy)
Car: '85 Z28
Engine: 305
Transmission: WC T5, 3.23 posi
Ya, I think it's like $52 (IIRC) for tranny and motor mounts from PST. The dual fan setup should work fine, but you'll probably want to change the fan switch and change to a 170* t-stat (great tech article on this by willie). I would also run Water wetter or something else like that just for the extra insurance, it's only $20 extra, and it's supposed to lower the temp by like 20*. As long as you have a good cat and the cam isn't too nasty emmisions shouldn't be a problem. Might have to do some tuning on it though to get it to pass (run lean, or I've heard alky works well). I'm not sure about the 700R4 either, I don't have much experience with that (I'm a manual guy). Engine swaps are fun, at least I think, I love working on cars and motors. Just make sure you label everything and bag eveything (ziplock bags and a sharpie are your friend) because I guarantee of you throw everything in a box you won't have a clue where what goes when you put it back together. Pictures also help too.
Reply
Old May 2, 2003 | 01:42 PM
  #5  
kfoley's Avatar
Supreme Member
 
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,766
Likes: 2
From: New Palestine, IN (Just East of Indy)
Car: '85 Z28
Engine: 305
Transmission: WC T5, 3.23 posi
Those motors look pretty good. I'd reccomend the Vortec headed one, it had good numbers. Have you looked anywhere else?
Reply
Old May 2, 2003 | 09:18 PM
  #6  
My85IROC's Avatar
Junior Member
 
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 57
Likes: 0
From: Wichita Kansas
Car: 1985 IROC
Engine: 305
Transmission: A4
Don't forget the stickers I just started my 383 project. After months of trying to figure out cost, I think the best way to do it is just start. Depending on what your goals are and if you have any parts to start with the cost can very a lot. As far as other mods to accommendate the added power, my plan is to fix what I break when I break it. Hope it dosent all go at once.
The reason I would just start is because for me this is a hobby and the money I spend is entertainment. Good luck with your project.
Reply
Old May 4, 2003 | 09:53 PM
  #7  
87WS6's Avatar
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,565
Likes: 10
From: Texas
Car: 1992 Formula Firebird
Engine: 305CID (LB9)
Transmission: World Class T5
Axle/Gears: 10-bolt, 4.10 gears
I've looked alot of places for engines. I've considered doing many things. Money is only a concern due to how much of it I can mass at one time. I don't worry about spending to much in the long run. The money is for entertainment purposes. I have a good daily driver I like, so buying the Trans-AM was something I did because I have always wanted one. Working on it is not necessary. I just enjoy it.
Reply
Old May 5, 2003 | 06:22 PM
  #8  
cr125r's Avatar
Member
 
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 266
Likes: 0
From: Ringwood, NJ
Car: 1988 trans am
Engine: 5.7 gm H.O. crate engine
Transmission: 700r4
http://www.golensengineservice.com/
or
http://www.online-racer.com/chevy_383_stroker.htm
have good prices
Reply
Old May 6, 2003 | 11:05 AM
  #9  
87WS6's Avatar
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,565
Likes: 10
From: Texas
Car: 1992 Formula Firebird
Engine: 305CID (LB9)
Transmission: World Class T5
Axle/Gears: 10-bolt, 4.10 gears
Not bad. That gives me more choices. That 400HP 383 just might be the ticket.

And all my emissions crap should work on them right?
Reply
Old May 6, 2003 | 11:18 AM
  #10  
kfoley's Avatar
Supreme Member
 
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,766
Likes: 2
From: New Palestine, IN (Just East of Indy)
Car: '85 Z28
Engine: 305
Transmission: WC T5, 3.23 posi
Yes, it will all bolt up, but I can't guarantee you it would pass. That cam is pretty big (as far as emmisions go) at 230*, I don't think you could pass with it.
Reply
Old May 6, 2003 | 01:54 PM
  #11  
87WS6's Avatar
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,565
Likes: 10
From: Texas
Car: 1992 Formula Firebird
Engine: 305CID (LB9)
Transmission: World Class T5
Axle/Gears: 10-bolt, 4.10 gears
Well this is going to sound retarded but there is no way to know without asking. Why would the cam make any difference in passing a smog inspection? Does it do someting to the exhaust? Does it put out more power than the emissions systems can handle?

If that is the case would I be better off getting a weaker engine and adding a supercharger? Would that produce different results?

Dallas is pretty strict on emissions and I would like to keep the car street legal. But the stock LB9 doesn't cut it for me.

Last edited by 87WS6; May 6, 2003 at 01:58 PM.
Reply
Old May 6, 2003 | 03:24 PM
  #12  
kfoley's Avatar
Supreme Member
 
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,766
Likes: 2
From: New Palestine, IN (Just East of Indy)
Car: '85 Z28
Engine: 305
Transmission: WC T5, 3.23 posi
A cam with a wide duration allows unburnt fuel to exit the chamber because there is an overlap when the exhaust and intake valves are open at the same time. This increases emmisions, and I don't think the cat would be able to take care of it (but I may be wrong, we don't have emmissions in IN). You would probably be better off with a superchager and the appropriate cam (not some off the shelf cam, needs to be designed for superchargers) and that will lower emmisions along with raising power.
Reply
Old May 6, 2003 | 04:19 PM
  #13  
87WS6's Avatar
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,565
Likes: 10
From: Texas
Car: 1992 Formula Firebird
Engine: 305CID (LB9)
Transmission: World Class T5
Axle/Gears: 10-bolt, 4.10 gears
Well then I think I might go with the emissions compliant engine from http://www.desertperformance.com. Get one that will work with all my stuff. Then get a power adder later.
Reply
Old May 6, 2003 | 10:30 PM
  #14  
kfoley's Avatar
Supreme Member
 
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,766
Likes: 2
From: New Palestine, IN (Just East of Indy)
Car: '85 Z28
Engine: 305
Transmission: WC T5, 3.23 posi
Oh, make sure the C.R. isn't too high if you have plans on forced induction in the future.
Reply
Old May 7, 2003 | 10:45 AM
  #15  
87WS6's Avatar
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,565
Likes: 10
From: Texas
Car: 1992 Formula Firebird
Engine: 305CID (LB9)
Transmission: World Class T5
Axle/Gears: 10-bolt, 4.10 gears
What would the ideal max compression be for forced induction?
Reply
Old May 7, 2003 | 12:36 PM
  #16  
kfoley's Avatar
Supreme Member
 
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,766
Likes: 2
From: New Palestine, IN (Just East of Indy)
Car: '85 Z28
Engine: 305
Transmission: WC T5, 3.23 posi
Well, for high boost applications 8.5:1 is reccomended. For lower boost apps the highest I would go is 9:1. I would suggest you play around with some numbers on a dynamic CR calculator and find out how much boost you plan to run, then you'll know exactly what you want your static CR to be.
Reply
Old May 8, 2003 | 03:08 PM
  #17  
87WS6's Avatar
Thread Starter
Supreme Member
iTrader: (1)
 
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,565
Likes: 10
From: Texas
Car: 1992 Formula Firebird
Engine: 305CID (LB9)
Transmission: World Class T5
Axle/Gears: 10-bolt, 4.10 gears
I will definatley keep that in mind when selecting my engine.
Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Rousseau92maro
Exhaust
9
Feb 1, 2016 05:12 PM
1990FirebirdGTA
TPI
3
Sep 22, 2015 07:26 PM
R13_Braz
LTX and LSX
22
Sep 18, 2015 05:00 PM
FED 387
Engine/Drivetrain/Suspension Wanted
0
Sep 16, 2015 12:18 PM
TexasMaro
Organized Drag Racing and Autocross
2
Sep 15, 2015 06:50 PM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:12 PM.