First off Im doing a single turbo to my 305. It is a bit modified, but my main concern is fuel delivery. The only mods to fuel are remanufactured fuel pump, AFPR and 19# SVO injectors. I plan on staying at 6psi w/ a Turbonetics T60-1 Turbo. I do have a slightly big cam. Its an Accel 74211 Cam

Specs
211/219 .503/.525 112deg

I am running Vette Aluminum heads. Any ideas on where timing should be set at and above all would prom burning be necessary. Im assuming it would should anyone clarify that i NEED to go w/ bigger injectors. Any help would be great. Thanks

 

Look into the 7749 ecm with $58 or $60 code change over, if done, chip burning is one place to start. Since your displacement is slightly smaller than a 350 which uses 30lb inj as a starting point with 6psi boost, I would still run the 30's and adjust the tune accordingly. Read everthing you can find on the 7749 ecm swap. My .02

 

Im hearing its possible and not possible to stay w/ my MAF unit. I really dont want to go Speed Density. I understand its prob best, but can i retain my MAF and somehow make this project work without converting to the 749ECM and SD swap?

 

?

 

Sure it does. Boost is just a way of getting more air mass into the engine. There is a reason that it’s called a “Mass Air Sensor.”

The real problem with the 165 setup is that the maf is not capable of reading a particularly high mass of air and you end up having to tune WOT using PE more then actual mass flow.

most of the ECM’s that you’ll find in mid/late 3rd gens all use the same processor, none of them is any faster then the other. Secondly, a few people have done some testing with cars setup so that they could swap from 165 to 730 quickly and found that they ran the same times with both. SD does tend to be more responsive because a MAF setup has a bit of lag time before whatever you just did with the throttle becomes a change in the airflow going through the maf, where that same change causes almost an instant change in the manifold that the MAP sensor will detect.

 

I was thinking about going w/ Accel's DFI system. It seems easy. Its a bit $$ but im not worried about that. To be quite honest im not really a computer guy, lol. I tried reading Traxon's threads with prom burning and while i understood some of it, its still basically intimidating. Im guessing i'd have to get a 7749 ECM, Wiring harness from a TPI SD vehicle, MAP sensor(again i read 2 bar or 3 bar MAP) What exactly is the 2,3 bar?(MAP Manifold Absolute Pressure) Anything else i'd have to exchange or get rid of? Im sorry if these questions have been asked numerous times. Im just at the brink of getting the car finally done, i'd really appreciate any answers if you got the time. Thanks if anything.

 

I guess I have nothing intelligent to say.

 

SO?

You don’t need to know pressure. The MAF measures the actual MASS of air that is entering the engine. With an SD setup the ECM takes input from the MAP, MAT… and looks up what the mass of air being injected under those conditions should be. Technically, although it’s slower to respond a MAF car will be more accurate, which is the reason that it seems that all cars are going in that direction now (emissions testing is much easier if you know exactly how much air is entering the engine rather then having to guess how much it should be).

For that matter, GM is the only manufacturer that I know for sure runs a MAP on their MAF cars, boosted or not, and the main reason for it being there is to monitor emissions devices like the EGR.

There are airflow and MAT ranges that could only happen if you’re under boost, so burn a chip accordingly.

Again, this is pretty much academic, since it doesn’t take much to exceed the amount that the MAF can report anyway.



Huh… has anyone actually opened one up to check that they actually do have newer electronics in them? I know that the reman ones that I have laying around are pretty much indistinguishable from the originals, with the exception of the service replacement tag on them.

 

Actually, that raises another question, is there a table/chart somewhere for repining a 165 equipped car to a 749 pinout (I’ll actually be using a 730 with $58, but that shouldn’t matter, as far as the wiring is concerned it will be like there is a 749 plugged in)? I know that Mike Davis has some 165 to 730 stuff posted and I thought I saw somewhere a 165 to 730 and then 730 to 749, but I don’t know that I’ve seen it all in one step (worst case I’ll pull up both pinouts and make my own chart, but having a confirmed good one will probably save me a a lot of time)

 

If anyone's up for giving a few more pointers please hit me up at

Audimaro on AIM. thanks

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 83 Crossfire TA
Actually, that raises another question, is there a table/chart somewhere for repining a 165 equipped car to a 749 pinout (I’ll actually be using a 730 with $58, but that shouldn’t matter, as far as the wiring is concerned it will be like there is a 749 plugged in)? I know that Mike Davis has some 165 to 730 stuff posted and I thought I saw somewhere a 165 to 730 and then 730 to 749, but I don’t know that I’ve seen it all in one step (worst case I’ll pull up both pinouts and make my own chart, but having a confirmed good one will probably save me a a lot of time) [/QUOTE

So you are not actually running a 7749 or 7730 with $58 code. I am. Try out your MAF'd 7730 with $58, you'll be swapping to SD. I don't believe you can repin a 7730 to MAF, so fill me in if you can.

 

Vortech305, this is the info I used to get started with my 7749 swap. http://www.speedtoys.com/~bort62/7749/Main.htm I stand by my suggetion to go SD. The documents are available, It is a stock application, bin files are available. It is turn key easy. I do run this set-up and I drive it daily. Shoot me a PM if you need any help. I'm sick of getting beat up.

 

WHAT??? That didn’t make any sense.

I’ve got an ’87 maf car, which has a 165 and can be run as a MAF or MAP, depending on the code that you run in it with very minor repining, I’ve played with that but it’s not a great answer since it doesn’t have any previsions for the TC and doesn’t work correctly with the KS.

The 730 and 749 are virtually identical with the 749 having 2 injector drivers (used on the 4 cylinder sunbird turbo to run 4 low Z injectors) vs the 730’s single driver and the 749 has an extra output that was used to control the boost control solenoid. You could plug either in to a 749 style harness and run the $58 code (sy/ty/sunbird) and it will work virtually identically assuming that you’re running high Z injectors and no boost control solenoid.

I’m just looking for a single step conversion chart to save me some time/hassle building the adaptor harness in the next couple of days.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 83 Crossfire TA
[B]WHAT??? That didn’t make any sense.

I’ve played with that but it’s not a great answer since it doesn’t have any previsions for the TC and doesn’t work correctly with the KS.


That is my point. Why bother with MAF, The ecm is not for boost.


Check my link in the last post, good swap info, 165 to 730 & to 749, also a good bin file to start with.

 

This is honestly like talking at a rock.

The part that you quoted is in reference to running the 165 with the aussi code to make it work with a MAP. With a MAF it does all that fine. Also, it does do fine with boost when using a 2 bar map

I know about that link, it has information that you can get dozens of other places and it doesn’t answer my question, I was looking for 165->749 to save the extra step in the middle.

 

Really. Insults are greatly appreciated. This is why I never post. A thirdgener was asking for help, no-one replies. Against my better judgement, I do. Sure enough, right after my post someone beats the crap out of me. Thats why I don't post. I have to weigh the factors of trying to help vs this. Usually I hold back.

83crossfireta, we are obviosly not hearing what eachother is trying to say. I try to keep my replies brief and sometimes leave out details that I assume are understood. I often quickly read other replies and pull from them my own conclusion which may not be what the poster meant. I was thinking the same thing about the rock but I don't go there.

Check this thread same topic, perhaps more victims. https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...hreadid=279583