im wanting to put a simple single turbo kit on my 305 tpi im just wondering what size turbo and what kinda boost i could run without having to do any tuning or changing much up and my car is a maf so also what would i do with that

 

If the 305 is essentially stock, I would install no greater than a 60-1 turbo, this will leave you some room for future upgrades without going too crazy, while being able to enjoy your setup on the street. Up the injector size, up your stall speed (if auto), and have someone burn you a chip to compensate for the amount of boost you plan on running. You do have options as far as fuel adjustability in the MAF sensor through the aftermarket, but the stocker will work fine with your application. If your planning on running the stock cast assembly, then I would go no more than 15-psi on a very good tune, meaning keep detonation in check by running an intercooler, meth injection, or both...

 

Could look into blowerworks MAF upgrade and chip. Suppose to beable to read up to 600whp. Not sure how much the stock maf will take, since even 330whp will just about max it out.

 

Stock MAF could handle more than that. We rescale the MAF so that it doesn't hit it's limit until you are at full boost, as well as 75% of your redline. Rescale the LV8 so spark can adjust for load properly, then set PE threshold to work from either TPS of LV8...

 

Yeah without rescaling it will max out early. Scaling would be the only way to get abit more flow out of it. I'm curious how that all works, i never did a car like that. Working with a guy that has a p600 blown L98 that is setup using FMU but I want to use the MAF as much as possible.

 

well im really not wanting to upgrade anything else unless i have to so i was just wonderin what i could run with the stock injectors stock pcm and stock everything

 

0 to 2 PSI depending on elevation

 

thats a good one

 

That is reality.
If you run an FMU then you could get by with more, but then will run out of fuel pump.

 

so puttin on a fuel pressure regulator could i run like 5lbs of boost

 

You don't want a turbo. You want nitrous...simpler install, easier on the budget and easier on a stock motor.

 

best suggestion on this thread.

turbos are atleast a $25k commitment.

 

Call me ignorant but how is it that much? I fail to see how that could be true. If it was there would be no one building turbo'd anythings as you could make an insane N/A for that amount.

 

Just a bit of an op-ed piece on this but if you're not planning on doing tuning for modifications on your car you may as well leave it stock. If you're planning on doing forced induction on your car and don't plan on doing any tuning you should definitely leave it stock. That is if you enjoy driving it. There's no quicker way to kill an engine than running a broken calibration on it.

You're also leaving huge amounts of power on the table. Just as an example lets take a look at the Buick Grand Nationals. They can run deep into the 12s with very very little in regards to upgrades. These primarily consist of matching everything up so it runs at its optimal and some exhaust work. They run 14s stock, so you're talking a full 1 to 1.5 second difference in the 1/4 mile. Supposedly the new Mustang GT500s will gain 40hp with no other changes than calibration. Boosted systems are very sensitive to the calibration even N/A engines are. I knocked about .2-.3 off my 4.3L V6es G-tech time just by bumping the FP up 3 PSI. Why? The engine was "needing" more fuel at WOT and although it's crude it is a form of tuning.

You need bigger injectors, a fuel pump and a way to change your calibration and make your system "boost aware." Speed density using Code 59 or a Megasquirt are also viable options.

The 60-1 definitely would be a lot of fun, look at ZZ3Astro's thread about his stock TPI. You wouldn't be far off of that with a 305 compared to a 350 TPI honestly. You could make some decent power, have a fun street machine and still get pretty good mpg with excellent drivability.

 

Then go heads and cam if you don't want to upgrade the injectors or touch the ECM (and even then your going to have to if you want it to run right), because if you don't install more injector, and if you don't setup the ECM to compensate for the additional air charge, then your engine is going to run lean and will be in pieces before you know it. Compressor's add more air, so you need to compensate with more fuel...

 

And I can tell you exactly what it cost to get to each level of performance. Doing EVERYTHING myself and using ebay parts where feasible, on a quest to maximize results per dollar, I put a stock 5.7/auto Iroc into the 7.8's in the 1/8 mile. Had I spend the bucks on a better quality turbo, it would likely gone 7.50's.

Last trip with no turbo (but with Megasquirt, 65lb/hr injectors, stock exhaust) 9.29 @ 72 mph. Total cost of mods ~ $1000 (injectors, megasquirt, wbO2)

First trip with a turbo, 8.67 @ 82.8 mph. Configuration was stock fuel pump, megasquirt, 65 lb/hr injectors, T70 ebay turbo @ 9 psi, non-intercooled, 3" catback with a Flow(less!)master muffler. Total cost at this point was ~ $3000 (mostly the cost of the turbo + tubing/fittings/lines/thermal protection)

First intercooled trip, 8.0 @ 87 mph. Backed up with 7.8's on subsequent trips. Changes include intercooler, 11.5 psi, 2800 stall, upgraded the trans to pro-built intoernals, changed to a straight thru Magnaflow muffler, MSD-6AL, new tires - still radials but Firestone Wide Ovals now. Total cost now ~ $5100

In my never ending quest to reach 6.99 in the 1/8, I have now built the new engine and upgraded to a 67mm Precision Turbo. I haven't even totalled up my costs on the new stuff, but it is safe to say I am approaching $5000 very rapidly. My first trip with the new engine but old turbo got me 7.71 at 92 mph. Not a huge improvement so that when I ordered the 67mm. Now I'm finding every bug in the system and have already dumped $300 into replacement fuel pumps. I'm still not sure if I've worked out those bugs. Feels like it will run 7.30s now though at 14 psi! Total cost in the $10k range.

 

.... you sir are delusional. Best suggestion on this thread? A turbo at 5-psi is essentially the same thing as a small hit of nitrous, and any stock engine will last with either, not to mention laugh at both of them when it is tuned correctly for it. A turbo at 15-psi is essentially the same thing as a 200 hit of nitrous for his engine, so it isn't a matter of which power adder being better, but how much additional horsepower the person is shooting for, then making it work with any application. Nitrous runs out, and costs more and more money in the long run, and is a hassle when it comes to repeated refills. As for a $25k commitment, what the devil are you smoking? I can buy a fully forged nine second turbo vehicle that is already done for $15k, not to mention build one for $10k from the ground up, car included.

 

factor in engine build/upgrade cost
turbo or twin turbos (no ebay,mp garbage)
all tubing (stainless,mild steel,aluminium)
any welding fab skills, do you have a tig/mig machine
intercooler (a/w or a cheaper simplier a/w)
fuel system (injectors,pumps,regulator, hoses,tubing,AN fittings etc.)
engine management (fast,bs3 ,accel dfi,motec,pro efi etc)
can you tune a turbo car??willing to learn at the expense of engine parts if tunning is not spot on.
ignition system

transmission upgrade
torque convertor
rearend (9" , bolt 12 bolt)
suspension
chassis upgrades (roll cage,sub frame connectors etc)

yes it all adds up.

 

The orginal poster wants to install a turbo on car without changing anything else , sounds a low budget . n2o will work the best for the poster`s needs and budget.

i bought a Duttweiler built GN for less than half of what Duttweiler charged the previous owner.It is sad fact that modding a car has a 50-60 cent on the dollar return. what else is new.

If it only takes $10k to run in the 9`s we would see flood of cars running 9`s on this web site but we dont how strange. So would it only take $30k , car included to run 7`s???

 

I would agree that it could add up to 20k very quickly if you are subbing out any of the work. I'm at 10k in parts and no one has done a single thing for me besides machine work and minor porting. Factor in a mark up and labor and I would be in the 25k range by now and I'm not even in the 10's yet

But back to the OP.. it's pointless to go to the expense of turbocharging without changing anything else. Much better result to spend $500 on nitrous and $500 on tires if you want cheap + be a bit faster than you are now. Make sure you are saving up for a new transmission though.

 

Going through a single turbo build myself, daverr is not that far off. If you want a turbo third gen that is fast and NOT a grenade, you are going to pay. Third-gens are not the cheapest car to mod out there.

If you want low buck, SPRAY that 305 till KABOOM! then build a proper motor.

 

You obviously do not do your own work. Grenade? What exactly are you referring to w/grenade? Detonation, perhaps? That must be what your referring to because detonation, as well as running too lean, is the only thing that will destroy a boosted engine, that and inevitable time, but that also applies to forged as well. 15-psi is nothing in the turbo world, and that is all that it is going to take for a 305 to run in the elevens with the right heads and cam, and for a 350 to run in the tens with the right heads and cam. Cast parts came stock in every Grand National, TTA, Syclone and Typhoon, and every single one of those V6's were tuned for 15-psi right out of the factory. Guys are running over 30-psi w/meth using the stock parts, so what do you mean by grenade? A V8 will get away with much less boost, in turn decreasing the chance of detonation, because it has two extra cylinders. What doesn't the 305 have that a stock LC2 does have in terms of boosted protection? Tell me...

 

to run 30psi of boost on GN your going to have tear in to it which =$$$$$.
its not going to happen with all stock parts in it. Unless its a stage 2 block it is not going live much.

The number of cylinders have nothing to do with power output. its all about total displacement.

305 is a waste of time to talk about and modify. Spray till it blows up then get an engine with at least 400ci .

 

there are an awful lot of far fetched price quotes and ideas on this thread. i sure didnt spend 25k on my turbo project.

the reason there arent a ton of boosted cars running around isnt so much that its expensive as its hard to do without knowledge and ability.

also a 400ci engine isnt the only thing worth boosting...there are tons of 4,6 cylinder cars that are just as much fun if not more fun.

 

Nonsense. Paul Miller has run upwards of 30-psi in his '86 Grand National without touching anything, other than swapping to Cometics, and has run a best of 10.42 @ 126. He has over, yes, over, 500 passes on the stock block. Rodney & Ted Derikson have gone 10.80 with a stock motor; stock heads, turbo, intercooler, intake, plenum, and it it holds 8 NHRA records. I won't even get into Ed Brewer's story. Fact of the matter is, detonation kills engines, period. If you yourself need the added insurance of running a fully forged setup, while paying top dollar for every single thing just for peace of mind and because it enhances your sense of security, well that is your choice. But don't imply that it costs $25,000 to run a decent setup, because countless people can prove you wrong....

Now I know you are delusional! The number of cylinders is VERY significant when comparing a V6 to a V8, not to mention corresponding valve size. Are you really this dense?

Are there any vids of your $25k terror going down the track, or are we only relegated to the same pics that you post over and over again of the engine bay? My 305 has run a best of 11.50 @ 117 w/12 pounds of boost when I ran the T76, 30-lb injectors, and crappy camshaft and heads. Now it's entirely different setup. Come bring your $25k killer to e-town on your trailer, I'l put it up against my 305 any day of the week, and anyone who knows me knows that I am a man of my word, and will run anyone....

Oh look, a BONE stock long block Grand National running 30-psi WITHOUT methanol. Hmm, I wonder how it survives. It can't be, it just can't be...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhtgLsg0PSQ

 

Oh please anything but that 305 lol. Obviously I struck a nerve with you, im sorry the truth hurts.

My 276" v6 GN went 130 mph in the 1/4 with 15 psi of boost. you did not do your homework!

 

No nerve struck, just have no patience for the same fodder you spew over and over....

 

Please. Stop shitting in other people's threads. We know how much your engine cost to build, we know what other people have done with theirs as well. There's plenty of setups out there that prove that you don't need to spend 25K on a stage engine to run successfully. For 25K it had better run the times you are talking about. Is it nice? Yes. Is it required after a specific point? Sure. Can you make plenty of power above stock without doing it? Absolutely. The LS guys are proving this all the time with stock engines, there's turbo355's grenade, and the many many stock guys who've put the boost to their 5.0s and made great power on stock short blocks and even some that have done it with stock long blocks. Not everyone is trying to run low 9s or 8s, not everyone is shooting for 4 digit power levels. Get that through your head.

 

where did i say how much i spent on my cars????
Here i am telling the reality of building a turbo car ,make a list on what it takes...... I guess some ppl cant handle the truth and get bent out shape.

on a side note LSx engines are junk . I rather install a Ford engine in my car given a choice between the two.
stock 5.0s literally splits the block if you over 500hp.

speed=money

 

Well then I must have done something magical because I pushed over 30 psi with both 116 and 91 + twin M15 methanol combos on my stock LC2 long block. I ran a 7.2@97 with a 1.65 60

Having actually built up a 109 block since then, and ported and flowed 8445 heads on my own flow bench, I can say with confidence that there is nothing the LC2 has over a 305. Even the crappiest 305 heads outflow most ported buick irons. The SBC oiling system is better, they come with a proper damper, and doing a roller cam is cheap and easy. Unlike the 800+ you are going to spend in an LC2.

Number of cylinders absolutely helps with the power output because you are dividing the work amongst them. With a V6 you have fewer power pulses per revolution so in order to make the same amount of power as a V8 the amplitude of those pulses has to be greater which means more cylinder pressure per combustion stroke.

A turbocharged LB9 would absolutely smoke an LC2.

 

you guys do realize that not everyone adds boost to a car to be the baddest and fastest mo fo in the world right?

just like the op was looking to do before everyone crapped on his thread, i added a low boost setup on a motor that(guess what) is built to handle anything i want to throw at it. i did it for about 2500 - 3000 dollars because i wanted to be able to tune and go faster if i felt like it. can it be done cheaper than that....YES

big deal you can run 10sec or less in a straight line...i have a fun car i can street even daily if i want and still run 25 to 30 lbs of boost if i felt like. its set on 5lbs for now and its fun.

 

Followed by...

Where is your relevance, though? The original poster wanted to boost his 305 without touching anything which would be a huge mistake. He needs larger injectors, and he needs to rescale the MAF sensor. He isn't running a Megasquirt that has a built in MAP sensor to handle the additional boost, like you...

 

what a pissin match this turned into im seeing a lot of closed minded-ness here. you dont need to drop $4K+ on a TA stage II or $2K on the stage II heads that barely flows 220 cfm. you dont even need to bring that in here. 25K will build a purpose built street/strip car if you know what the hell you are doing. Mars built a junkyard 3500T thats been 11's. didnt even spend 5K iirc. most of you wan to boast your knowlege but dont want to offer REAL suggestions to keep it on the cheap. so STFU and keep go bench race somewhere else

 

relevance when out the window a few posts ago lol and i never said he wouldnt have to touch anything and in all honesty wasnt talking to him. his question was answered.

wonder where mars has been havent seen a new post in awhile, its a v6 car most people on this board ignore its exsistance.

 

my camaro sure as hell didnt cost 25k to build.

my car will deffiantly run low 10's and it sure as hell prolly go mid 9's
and i have under 4k with the price of the car invested in it and im sorry but mp turbos are not junk

the most exspensive things on my car are saftey items like roll cage and parachute but dont need those for what the op wants

 

PICS!!!!!!

 

yea,, we had this discussion before..

I can get a Muffin at Food Mart for $.80 the government can get them for $25.

You will have to make modifications to your vehicle to have it run correctly and be FUN! if you can't do it now, wait and save up. It took me about 4yrs buying things a little at a time and then put it all together in a weekend (lets hear it... I can do it in 1 month... I can do it in 1 week... I just ordered everything online as i read this insane thread!)

My first trans am had N2O.. it was cheap and easy, i'd recommend it also! There is alot of knowledge that is needed to properly build/tune a turbo car! you can get around somethings(I bought my manifold) but need to research alot to get a good combination that works for YOU!

 

Agreed Dave. People make such a big deal about this, and it is such a waste of time to argue about. 25k for a turbo setup for a car that cost everyone here less than three quarters of that amount. I bought my GTA for a little under five thousand dollars, who in their right mind would spend 25k on a turbo setup for it lmao? I would go with an F1A from Procharger before spending anywhere near that amount. Guess how much my GTA would be worth once that 25k turbo setup was installed on it, $7500 in today's economy, perhaps, if I'm lucky? How the hell is that even feasible lol...

Two headers, a crossover, a turbo, an intercooler, a downpipe, charge tubing, silicone adapters, T-Clamps, oil supply, oil return, larger injectors and a tune. Sounds like a lot of stuff, but it isn't, and all of it can be had for cheap, and will last a very long time to be enjoyed. If something happens to break or go bad down the road, guess what, you replace it for the same amount of money you spent on it, big woop, and even then I have yet to see a cheap setup break down. The only thing I have ever witnessed go bad with an ebay setup was the crossover for a single turbo setup cracking, but they are garbage to begin with....

 

Say someone were to look at 8-10 lbs of boost on an otherwise stock 305, what injector size would he need to run. I saw earlier 30lbers listed, but wasn't sure what psi that was at. Also there has been no mention of fuel pump. Would the stock pump, as long it is in good shape, handle the power levels of 8-10 lbs?

Reason I ask is I am now looking to go down this path. I have a stock 305, sans free mods, with an ARAP based tune running Accel 24lb injectors. If I am able to use those injectors and my other parts I might be able to get away with building a set up for not much money.

 

My 30-lb injectors went static at close to 15-psi of boost on my old 305 setup, mind you I was running ported heads, cam and a siamesed TPI setup. At 8-psi of boost on a stock 305, your looking at approximately 300 horsepower, give or take a few depending on the variables, so your target .85 duty cycle would require at least 28-pound injectors. You would be safer at 5-pounds of boost with 24-lb injectors. Remember that your 24-lb injectors give you 5% more fuel over the stock injectors, and for every pound of boost your adding your looking at 6.802% increase of additional air...

 

Thanks. I looked for the calculation, but didn't know what to search for. I would not be running anything other than non-ported 081s, slightly ported plenum, "350 TPI" cam (stock cam), and stock MAF.

How is it that 24lb injectors are only 5% more than the 19lb injectors that were in there? Wouldn't that be around 20% more fuel? Not trying to argue that I need larger injectors, just trying to make sure my math/brain is accurate.

 

MY 30lbs injectors also went static at about 12 psi with my tune.

I am running the stock fuel pump and am not sure of the pressure. i have the stealthram injector rail with the non adjustable regulator

 

the stock fuel pump is only good for around 300fwhp. when we dynoed my v6 car and it put down 270rwhp and 370rwtq i was on the stock fuel pump and fp would drop under wot.v6/305/350 cars all have the same pump

 

At the same, or given, duty cycle. Stock 305's come with 19-lb/hr injectors, and by installing 24-lb injectors without changing anything you would be running 5% more fuel over stock at the target duty cycle. By altering pulse width to compensate for the larger 24-lb injectors, your able to lower your duty cycle, thereby giving you 5% more room to play up to the target duty cycle for any additional increase in air. The larger the injector, the more of an increase in fuel you have to utilize at the same, or given, duty cycle. Call it leeway if you will. There are many ways in determining injector size that you would need, but I usually just go by the estimated horsepower alone depending on the setup at a given boost pressure...

 

yeah, depending on what shape your fuel pump is in. Or just put a Hobbs switch activating a Nitrous Fuel Relay spraying the extra boost fuel into the plenum.

 

My buddy and I put a single turbo, carb hat style on his 82 305, no wastegate, made 200hp, and 333ft lbs of torque, no engine mods except an intake and carb.

 

didn't ask about nitro or getting 1000 horses if you don't have an answer then shut up and let someone that knows say something. What's the matter with you?

 

What's the matter with you? Didn't ask about making 1000 hp. All he's asking is adding a little boost to the 305. You go off about a 400 like you're a badass. Do you not understand the concept of answering a quertion? Go somewhere else.

 

holy thread revival batman! is 12 years a record?