At what point would yall consider i might have to worry about washing out my rings.I`m getting a pretty rich smelling exhaust,but i`m not running any emmisions so i considered that normal.I adjusted my fuel pressure to stock to see if that made any change and i couldnt really tell if it changed any.still seemed to be pretty rich smeeling exhaust.I`m thinking i need to check my air fuel ratio but those meters are out of my budget right now and the shops i`ve talked to don`t have them.Any ideas? One more thing.Just changed my oil.It had a slight gas oder to it but noy bad.I have a magnetic oil plug and it had a little bit of metal flakes on it.This is normal on a break in if i`m not mistaken,I would just like a little peace of mind.Thanks

 

I'm not totally sure how you've got your engine setup here. Is this a TPI setup? So then, doesn't it have an O2 sensor in the exhaust, in order for it to run right at all? You could read off that sensor (can you read off a sensor that's already being used by the ECM?). But if the sensor, ECM, etc, are all working, then it shouldn't be running rich.

I doubt you've washed out your rings, I don't think it's as common as some people think. A roller cam will have very little shavings in the oil, and virtually no break in. Have you run THE ***** OFF IT? I mean, seating the rings is best done by driving it like you stole it sorta thing. Oh, and engine breaking, that too.
How many miles on the motor so far?

 

It is a TPI.It has about 2000 miles on it.the o2 sensor is there and new,and as far as i know the ecm and all are working fine.I thought maybe the guy who did my prom work may have set the fuel curve too high or something.It is a non emmissions so i thought the gas smell is normal cause my last third gen was about the same when i cut the cat out.A friend was just telling me to watch out for Washing the rings.I have run it pretty hard a few times,but after it had 1500 miles on it.The entire engine is all brand new gm parts.Ijust noticesd a little bit of metal flakes the last time i changed the oil,and thats the 3rd time in 2000 miles ive changed it.started with straight 30 ,then used 20w50 for a while and just changed to 10w30 when on a below freezing morning i got a few knocks at start up on two seperate occasions.Havent heard it since.I`ve had it up to 130 mph and i`ve done some hard 0-60 times.I do noy know how to read off of the o2 sensor.Thanks

 

ooh, that's not good, you shouldn't be getting metal flakes anymore.
Also, thick oil like 20W50 should silence any knocks, going to 10W30 would make it worse.

I don't know F-all about TPI and fueling curves, so i'll bow out here. Best of luck!

 

Forget about the rings and the fuel curve for now.You`ve got me a little worried about my new engine now man.The knock only happened twice on really cold mornings and now its stopped and the car seems to run just as good as it should.The metal flakes were very few and could be from the other oil change(I`m hopeing)cause I didnt do that oil change.I`m hopeing thye were just still stuck to the magnetic drain plug.Are you thinking maybe my valves are out of adjustment or worse damage like crank bearing or bad rod or what man?This is my first engine build and i`m a little inexperienced so anything you could help me with would be great.Do i need to pull the moter and check everything out or just drive it and see what happens.Thanks-Grady-

 

If it were mine I would go with your gut instinct. You are thinking that something isn't right. You are probably right but that doesn't mean you need to pull the whole thing apart (yet).

If it seems to run pretty decent with no stumbling and decent preformance you should be reasonably OK. What is your gas mileage? If it is really in the toilet then that confirms way too much fuel.

I didn't look on your profile but it has been way below zero here in ND and a little bit of noise at startup is not uncommon. Pistons shrink more than iron... However, a KNOCK noise like a serious clanking sound is cause for concern... but I bet that noise you had only lasted but a couple seconds. Dyno juice doesn't flow worth a crap at -20 deg no matter what the viscocity is (not really a true statement, just trying to make a point).

Oil should NOT smell like gas. It should have its own unique odor (fragrence to some of us).

Get a stock chip and put it in for comparison. Keep changing the oil and collecting information. It would be great if you could get some O2 info to help confirm or deny the too much fuel theory. I wouldn't drive the heck out of it till you get it figured out.

Good luck

 

I`m in Mississippi and on these particular mornings(happened twice) it was in the mid to upper 20`s,and yes the noise only lasted a second.Mileage is pretty good as long as i keep my foot out of it.The oil really had no different smell than any of the other thousands of times i`ve changed the oil in cars or trucks.All I have as far as the stock chip is the 305 (stock)and a 305 fastchip I`ve been told I could use the 305 chip to see if it leans out any but I`m a little skeptical.At any rate thanks for the info.How do you use the 02 sensor to check rich or lean status?I am gonna do a search.

 

If it were mine, I wouldn't put the 305 chip in with that motor. Lean is very bad... better too rich than too lean.

It only takes one bad injector to ruin the engine though. If you do anything, pull the injectors and have them cleaned/rebuilt.

A freind is currently doing an engine swap in his diesel pickup because one bad injector decided to dump fuel, washed cylinder, and melted it down (FORD).

 

if the knock is from low oil pressure, a lighter weight oil will make the knock worse, but if its from lack of lubrication on cold start up, lighter oil will help.
on your other post about the noise i didn't notice where your at, 10w30 may be a little thick for that area when you get really cold. it doesn't get into the 20s here much so 10w30 is fine for where im at, you may need thinner oil for the extreme cold there, such as 5w20, or maybe switch over to synthetic.
keep an eye on your oil pressure.

as far as seeing if its rich or lean, an investment into a scanner of some kind, or better yet a cable, an old laptop & TunerPro wouldn't be a bad ideal. i have used a number of different scanners, the latest have been the OTC Genisys, the Snap-On MT 2500, & the Modis, a laptop & TunerPro with the right definition files blows the all of these high dollar scan tools away. if you already have a laptop all you need to buy or build is a cable, Mark allows TunerPro to be downloaded & used unregistered free of charge with nothing more than a 10 second nag at startup. toss in a Burn1 or an AutoProm & you can do your own chips. which with your mods probably wouldn't be a bad
ideal.

 

The injecters are brand new and were all pulled twice after build when we were having a problem getting the #4 hole to fire.The injecters were fine.My oil pressure is and has always been excellent .The oil pump is also brand new and came with the crate engine i bought.Evarything about the engine is brand new other than the TPI.It has not made the noise since I changed the oil to 10w30 and it hasn`t been below freezing.However i think it may have dropped timeing a little and i hear a little very slight valve tick, once it warms up.It may be i`m not used to the alluminum head sound or the roller rocker valve train noise,But it made the knock noise one time before right after we built it and the timeing dropped.It was just the valves needed to be adjusted.If that is the problem again i`m gonna save up and get some crane roller rockers instead of these cat stainless steel ones i`m using. My prom was done by tpi chips and was supposedly done to go with my mods.I do have a laptop,but everything else you said sounded greek.plus, i`m` still hurting from christmas money wise so anything over a $100 is out of the question for a couple of months.I do know haveing someone burn a prom for you without being around for the test and tune can leave room for improvement.brian @TPIchips said just try lowering the fuel pressurewhich i did to 42 psi with no difference it was at 47.5.I`m not that concerned about the rings washing as i am the knock I had.I had a 87 T/A WS6 about 6 years ago and it didnt smell any worse than this as best i can remember.Thanks for all of yalls suggestions and help guys.Its great to have a place like this to get feedback from more knowledgeable people.The guy who helped me build the moter has been building race moters for 30 years and is ASE certified but he works and i cant always get in touch with him wth my work schedule.I`M gonna run through the valves the first chance i get,luckily its not my daily driver

 

Well it is a little rich i pulled the plugs and they had a little bit of carbon on them like sute but they didnt appear fouled but i cleaned them up anyway.Hasnt made the knock on start up since the weather has been slightly warmer and i changed to 10/30 oil.Adjusted valves but they needed no more than a 1/8 turn.Hadnt changed the oil again yet,just hopeing the little bit of flakes I had were still stuck to my magnetic plug from the first oil change cause i didnt change it that particular time. thanks.

 

well after 2000 miles the rings either seated or they didnt!

Do a leakdown test and that will tell you all you need to know.


Chances are if its been dumping fuel in and running pig rich that its possible you have washed some rings!

But no need to jump the guns, just do a few simple tests and eliminate some things...

 

I had the same probllem with my motor, it wasnt a TPI, it was carbed, but oil smeeling like gas is bad. My motor may have had 1500 miles on it and runned really rich. Was going down the road showing off to some friends and heard a nasty sound, ended up spinning the #3 & 5 rod bareings and ruined the crank. After pulling the motor I let the oil drain over night in a 5 gal bucket. It looked liked straight water with a black color and smelled just like gas. I washed some rings cause of the choke getting hung. Hope that ur motor is fine. It took me monthes to get mine running again couldnt aford another rebuild. Hope u have better luck.

 

I`m reviving this thread because i mentioned before I had a some metal shavings on my magnetic drain plug yall told me to keep my eye on it and.........Car is running well but has some idle and very low rpm issue but still hauls pretty good ***.I`m thinking I need to adjust my IAC or maybe its an ignition problem.Anyway changed my oil and I got more metal flakes ans shaveings.WTF causes this and shouldnt it have broken down already after I`ve run it hard a bunch of times and drive it regularly.I mean if somethings bad wrong enough to give me metal shavings I would think it would have quit or clooged up the fuel pump strainer,or be burning/useing oil?If the distributer is installed wrong could that be eating up my gear on the distributer/cam?Its the stock distributer for a roller cam.

 

TTT