http://www.dartheads.com/products/sh...ll-blocks.html

It has 350 mains and a 4.125" bore. they are clearance for a 3.75" stroke, has siamese cylinders, blind head bolts, splayed 4 bolt mains,and can be bored to a safe 4.165". That''s the general info.

What heads, cam, intake, pistons, carb, etc. would you recommend for me to get the expected RWHP? Basically, what setup with this block for a street (mostly)/strip 91 camaro.

Thanks

 

So a 400cid engine, and you want 500RWHP? Or around 600HP at the crank? Naturally aspirated I assume?
This won't be a street car anymore- I think perhaps you read too many magazines. Assuming you could afford to build it, and keep it fueled (getting 6mpg), you'd have a hell of a time driving it...

I'd say you'll need AFR 210cc heads at the very start. A solid roller cam, custom grind I imagine. A super victor or something along those lines, and a holley 950cfm double pumper, or something gargantuan like that.

You've got some very vague and hard to accomplish goals. There's a MILLION ways to accomplish your goals. Why not get started yourself, then post up your ideas and we can shoot them down? ie, rather than getting a pile of alternating suggestions?

 

well since my motor let go, i plan on doing another motor with 500rwhp.

here's what i'm going to do.

either 383(350 block) or 377 (destroked 400)
minimum 11:1 compression
forged flat top pistons (mahle, JE, or similar)
forged rods (eagle or manley) ARP BOLTS
forged crank (eagle or scat)
studded mains and heads
AFR 227 heads or 210's (eliminators)
super victor intake, port matched to heads and smoothed runners
shaft rockers or stud girdle(a must)
custom grind solid roller cam
950HP from prosystems (or just my 750 mighty demon for now) but the carb can be a big power gain

should make good power with the right cam. i would rev the 383 to 7200-7500, and the 377 will rev to 7500-8000. gonna need to drop some gear though.. 4.56 or 4.88

 

How did it handle on the street?

Thanks for the response too

 

I read too many magazines huh? Instead of taking shots at me it'd be nice just to help me get started. And if there's a MILLION ways to do it, I want to hear from those who have done it so I can make my own decisions from that. Considering that, I'd like to get started and not waste money. Thanks for your input though

 

those are the plans i have for a future motor with similar goals as you. my motor that let go was making about 460-475hp. the cam i had, had loads of duration, which makes low rpm cylinder pressure suffer and it didnt like to be pushed under 1800rpm.. but that was mainly due to the fact that i didnt tune it for low rpm use.. the power range was from 3000-6700..

if the new motor has the rpm range i want, it'll probably be from around 3500-4000 and up.. but drag motors do need high stall converters or manual trans with a deep gear.. if you are planning on 500rwhp, dont expect it to be a low rpm torque monster.. you will need a decent stall..

if you are will, a safer bet would be a stout 400rwhp motor with nitrous.. it will last longer as a street motor..

 

For 500rwhp you will need somewhere around 600hp at the crank. Here are some thoughts.

With the new Dart SHP block build the biggest motor you can with it. I would call AFR and talk to Tony about your goals. I'm sure he will say the 210cc head at a minimum and I see where they have the new 227cc head available. He might recommend that one. Regarding the cam there are a few options. Again I would talk to Tony at AFR as he has been involved with numersous high output motors. A solid roller takes over from a hydraulic roller above 6500rpm so depending on the required rpm's you could go either way. Of course you will have to have a first class intake and exhaust system.

 

Sorry guy, not meant as an insult, but based on the lingo and goals some people have (ie I want 600HP from a 400cid engine, mostly street) just aren't realistic. ie. it sounds like you get your goals from a magazine.

I'd be highly impressed if you could afford the gas to daily drive something like that ( I sure as heck couldn't!).

5678TA had a 475HP (FWHP right?) engine. It had TONS of cam, 260* at .050" or so right? That would be a BEAR to drive.

600FWHP is LOTS. In order to get that naturally aspirated you need;

- extremely exotic parts (very expensive) - ie 18* heads
- Very high end parts (AFR heads), and revving very high - ie wouldn't last long, hard to drive on the street - big cam, etc
- or, and I recommend this course of action - forced induction. A turbo charger or supercharger.

Now i'm not entirely sure why you're basing your build around an aftermarket block, and a HP number. Those seem like strange starting points to me? Do you already have the block?
Is 500RWHP written in stone somewhere? Or are you just trying to be REALLY FRIGGEN FAST? Would you settle with 400RWHP? That's fast enough to be the fastest street car in town for most towns.... plus you'd actually be able to drive it....

I've spent a good chunk of change on my car/engine, and I didn't even use exotic parts. I bet i'd be hard pressed to be making 350RWHP with my setup. It's still *barely* driveable on the street. It's got lots of cam and nowhere near enough traction. I don't want to have to use drag radials on the street (and be buying new tires every year...), and i've got enough power to shred the tires all over the road. 500RWHP would be un-fathomable to me, it's just not really a *street* car - in my eyes.

Why don't you shed some light on your goals here? beat a friends car? run a certain time slip? go fast with x dollars? get z mileage? Your existing goals are just too broad I think.

And personally? I'd just turbocharge a 383 and be done with it. Use short fill on a factory block. Some some cash and make that amount of cash. Blow through a carb, or run an aftermarket injection system and be done with it.

 

Here's my thoughts,

Keep it a 400 as that block comes. Bore is pretty much finished so just hone is all is necessary. Boring over is waste of money and 6 cubes aint gonna help much anyway.

Keep the bottom end stout. Forged crank, forged H beam rods or one of the more elite I beam setups. I'm going with Callies stuff for my turbo build. Reasonable prices too.

studs for the heads/studs for the main caps. Use good hardware, ARP premium stuff.

Heads i'd run AFR 227 eliminators...nothing less. Compression, try to get it in the 11-11.2 range, but if you play your cards right with the tune, and the cam is big enough, you MAY beable to get 11.5 and keep it on pump gas.

Cam, solid roller definately. Talk to Jones cams. My idea would be something in the 304/308 adv, 256/260 with .664/.678 on a 108 lsa by looking at his lobes. That will get you near 575hp on motor, possibly more. Close to 500whp but my gosh is that car gonna be a beast on the street...

intake has to be single plane, ported to ensure it flows more than the heads so you dont bottle neck it.

Else sell that block, go 400+ LSX and copy Stage20's build. 510whp thru auto high stall tranny with a 408 LSX and its not a solid roller and its driveable

 

Sonix - No offense taken. I plan on taking my time with the build so that hopefully I don't take a huge hit financially with the parts. I don't necessarily have a set budget, but similar to yourself, I'd like to get the most HP out of the least amount of money possible and still have a car I can drive on the street. The HP I'm looking to achieve is not set in stone. Gas mileage isn't a huge concern because it's not a daily driver. I'd certainly like to be able to keep up or beat my friends (and others) LS1's and run 10's or 11's at the strip.

1989GTA- Thanks for your input, if I can go with the AFR heads and still be streetable I will definitely call Tony. Thanks

Orr89- I like your idea of keeping the bottom end stout. I lot of torque would be ideal. Thanks

 

I made 400whp thru my 383 and it was a tame baby on the street even tho it sounded like it wanted to rip your head off. Just the way it was. 150 shot later put me over 500whp. Thats what i wanted at the time.

To do it at the wheels you need a pretty stout setup. LSX do it all the time but then again i dont see why a big 400" sbc cant do with with todays good 23 degree heads

Now that i think about it, i may have gone abit excessive with my above post.

My buddy 87 TA has an all motor 406 that goes about as fast as my nitrous 383 does.
His is an old AFR 195 headed 406 with miniram efi with a mild 242/242 solid roller. Thats got to be 450whp+. I estimated my 383 at 520whp with spray but it could have been anywhere between 475-520. His car makes that power and is very driveable.

So abit more head like AFR comp port 210's, good compression and close to a 250 duration solid roller should make darn near 500whp i'd hope. I bet it could be somewhat tolerable on the street. Depends on how well the cam/heads/intake work and how good the tune is.

I've also seen results from Joe Sherman, an engine builder who makes some stout combinations and i believe has won Engine builders contests before. He made a solid roller AFR 195 headed 383 that made near 600hp on motor. SO i think it could be possible
For a street car i'd consider EFI for better driveability.

 

I think with todays parts it is doable. A few years ago I would have said no but with the cam and head improvements along with the affordable Dart SHP block I think it is doable.

I forgot to say but Orr covered it, you will need to keep the compression up with 11:1 or better. With the higher overlap cam you maybe running you might be able to squeeze more compression out of it.

Orr is correct as I have seen some 383's listed with over 550hp at the crankshaft. With a 400 + cubic inch motor you should come very close but you will have to pay attention to the small details.

Call Tony regarding the heads and Mike Jones would also be good on the camshaft.

 

Theres a streetable 398 build that went 10.5's at 129 in a C4 vette. Would be another mid high 400's whp build. He was shootin for 580 crank hp. 12.0 to 1 seems high for a non LT1 car tho but keep it cool, run a colder plug and it should be ok on a good chamber aluminum head on good gas

 

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

 

Three thoughts. Heads, heads, heads. By the best you can afford as that is where the power is.