now i have decided to keep the L69 and attempt to put 400 hp to the flywheel and around 300 or so to the wheels. dont bother asking "why just not swap it?" theres just something in me that says its wrong to do that to a perfectly good l69. Im deffinatly going to get some cams and heads on there, but my question is what heads do you think would be best for this? im liking the vortec heads but if anybody thinks theres anything better, please let me know. what cam should i get and what lift/duration would be ideal? im thinking the lunati 50124 looks nice. what other things ON THE ENGINE should i consider upgrading. valve springs? lifters? ect. should i bore/ port it?

basically im just asking if you were doing this, how would you go about it and what specific products would you use?

has a 400 hp l69 ever been done before?

 

It won't be an l69 anymore after the cam and heads swap.

 

400 to the flywheel is possible, 400 to the wheels highly doubtful. Even at 1.5 HP/CID you are going to be hard pressed to make 305 or so CID make the nearly 485 HP that is required.

 

correction------ i actually did mean 400 at the fly. i want around 300-315 at the wheels. thats a hell of a diffrence. haha

 

technically true but you get what I mean right? why trade something thats perfectly good and useable for something that everyone else is doing? id rather keep the 5.0 and upgrade the crap out of it.

1. i think the same amount of hp, if not more, can be made from an l69 for about the same cost of an lsx/ltx and since i enjoy this type of stuff, it will be a lot more fun to build it up
2. i want to tell people, "oh, its just a little ol 5.0L " then light 'em up

 

Don't get me wrong, I love the 305, but if you want to build a competitive 5.0L. 4.00" 1 piece rear seal roller cam 350 block. 1994-1996 Caprice L99 4.3 V8 Crankshaft and Rods. Use flattop pistons for a 350. Have the rotating assembly balanced. Use a mild hydraulic roller camshaft to bump open Vortec heads and a Performer RPM intake. That will be a running little 5.0.

 

sounds nice, but my goal is to keep the block. so with that in mind, what would YOU do in order to get it to 400 hp?

 

I would port the L-69 heads (#416 best) and supercharge it with a Weiand 144 blower.
750cfm holley carb Lunati 238-248-112 street mechanical cam.
long tube headers with 2.5" dual exhaust Y'ed into 3.5" main exhaust pipe over axle.
Then, I would hang on for dear life.

 

notice how i said without power adder. supercharger= power adder.

the rest sounds good. perhaps if i took diffrent parts from each post and added them together it would work out? haha

i was planning on a new, slightly bigger carb and exhaust, (not to mention a t-56 swap and new rear end) but thats besides the point

COME ON GUYS!! I WANT ENGINE MODS!!!!!!!!

 

look up mw66nova, he had a fast 305, now he's ls1 though...

also, i know "say i have a 305..." well a 383 looks IDENTICAL to a 305.... sooo u could always say its a 305. also:

 

You could build that Lil motor up, you just have to get a good combo of parts that work together for the motor size thats all. Port the heads get a nice roller cam good cr, intake, tb, fuel, ign and other supporting mods and it'll run good and strong.

 

yeah i know and thats what im trying to get at with this thread.

what parts will work together the best and give the most power?

 

You can get 400hp out of an L69 - you just need to swap out the 305 and replace with a 350 (or 383) - I did it with an LG4 (and some L69 parts).

This is the easiest route as a 350 has a 15% advantage in cubes, plus it is a larger bore block, allowing the use of better flowing heads vs. a 305.

 

replaceing it is not using the l69 so i dont see how you still consider yours an lg4

""engine is small, and has a particularly small bore at 3.736-inches, while the stroke is the same as a 350 at 3.48-inches. The small bore is an immediate red flag to most guys; but is it really when things are looked at in proportion to the engine's size? In fact, the factory 305 bore/stoke ratio is actually slightly better than a stock 454 Chevy, and way better than any of the 4.030x4.000-inch strokers. Conjuring the Power Pack Actually, with the right heads, there is nothing inherent in the bore to stroke ratio of an engine of this displacement that will cripple cylinder filling, especially in the street rpm range of under 6,500 rpm.""

thats a quote from the Popular Hotrodding magazine website.

 

Come on guys, he's asking for help with building up the 305 not an engine swap. We all know a 350, 383 or a 406 would make it easier to get the numbers he's looking for but he wants to do it with his 305 so let's give him some ideas.
I've built some 305s carbed TBI and TPI. The motor responds to changes just like any other motor. This is what I would do, ported Vortec heads with good valves, spings and valve job, 10 to 1 CR, 1-5/8th headers long or short tubes, Lt1 cam or Comps 12-423-8 on a 112 LSA, 3 inch cat-back or true duals, and enough TB and intake that can support the hp. Now tunning the motor is a huge factor in the output. All of those parts are useless if the tune is crap.

 

now thats what im looking for!

ok, so heres what im thinking:
vortec heads- mill to keep CR up, upgrade valves and springs

comp cams- the 12-423-8 does seem like a good idea, i may try to find something with a lower duration thats more streetable, not really sure yet.
upgrade lifters, push rods, and rockers.

carb/ intake- probably get a holly carb around 700 cfm and a nice air intake like the edlebrock preformer.

high flow exhaust and headers.

what kind of hp do you think i would see out of this?

im mostly basing this on a build that Popular Hot Rodding did and on an engine dyno they were at 375hp @6000 rpm!!!

also, do you think this set up could handle the weiand mini supercharger if i wanted to do that later?

thanks for the input everybody.

 

Yea, that ad for popular hot rodding has inspired many botched threads on this forum. We can count on one hand how many people have come even remotely close to their results (Read; Mwnova66).
His results are great mostly due to how well he set up the CAR, not just the engine.

I'll say this - you WILL NOT get 400HP out of your 305. It is incredibly difficult, makes it virtually un-drivable, and the chances of you actually making it happen are so slim, that I have complete faith in saying it just won't happen.

You can go for something realistic. Put good heads and a cam in it, and shoot for 300HP at the flywheel. Or do what f-bird suggested and use a blower, since that's your only chance of getting 400HP out of it.

 

That is going to be the question of the day. Can you use the large-valve high-flow heads on your 305 block? I don't think you can, the bore is not big enough. To make more power with a smaller engine, you just spin it higher, that is why most people eschew the 305 and go for a 302 style with short stroke and big bore, it allows the easy use of large valve heads and it just loves to rev. The bore/stroke relationship will not hold you back per se, but the smaller bore shrouds the valves badly and will not allow the super high-flow heads.

So, since it actually costs the same or less to do a 383 than to rebuild a 305, you can see why everyone takes that route.

TA

 

yeah, ill probably just end up getting an lt1 or ls1 and putting it in and just get a cam and upgrade some head components. i just think this would be a cool thing to do because hardly anybody does it.

but in the end ill probably just go the cheaper route...

which engine swaps over easier? i can probably get an lt1 fairly cheap with everything included. does the rear end from a caprice fit on a camaro? if so i may just buy the whole car. my dad will sell me his for 2000.

 

The PHR article is oft quoted. Funny how people forget to mention "the rest of the story" - yes, they did get to 400 GFWHP, and then it puked a rod.

In order to make up for the lack of cubic inches, you need to spin the guts out of it (no pun intended, but it's appropriate, anyway). That means better than stock rods and valve train. Figure on designing it for 7000 RPMs. The 305 is further handicapped by the small bore shrouding the valves, impeding the air flow that is essential for those RPMs - double whammy.

And, as mentioned, streetability is pretty much shot.

I ran a hopped up 305 for 4 years. In that time, although it would move smartly, exactly 2 people asked me if it was a 350. 2, no more. The difference between souped up 305 and nearly identical 350 was greater than the difference between stock 305 and souped up 305.

Is it worth it for that "It's only a 305" moment? Not hardly.

Not saying you shouldn't soup up a 305. Just forget the dreams of 400 HP.

350 easier than 383 easier than LT1 easier than LS1 easier than 400 HP 305.

The Caprice rear end will not fit in a 3rd gen without extensive modifications.

 

thanks for ruining my dreams. lol.

yeah, im pretty much over the keeping it a 305 thing. Im just going to do some kind of swap i think.

i want to keep it carbed. i know that much, and i really dont want to pay more than 1500-2000 for an engine so what would be a good option?

 

LT1.

And keep it LT1, not carb'd. Take-out f-body engine and transmission can be had for that. 400 HP with minor upgrades, good street manners, very respectable gas mileage, no rods ventilating the crankcase.

 

does a stock lt1 need to have the comp programed in order to work in my camaro or will it work fine as is?

also, whats does "Take-out f-body engine and transmission can be had for that." mean? you mean i can get the set up from some where like a junk yard for around 1500?

 

Sorry to hear about you giving up on that lil 305 but the LT1 sounds like a good idea for you. It's funny how people can have a strong influence on other folks dreams. Like I said before you can get most any engine to perform with the right combo of parts and to prove it about the 305 I have a few laying around my shop, soooo I'm going to build one of these on a budjet with the intentions of makin some good hp/trq just to see what happens.

 

WTF does Popular Hot Rodding know... Answer - not as much as the collective minds on this board do.

 

yeah, in the end it just seems like the better way to go. im deffinatley going to keep the 305 around though seeing as how it only has 82,000 miles on it. after my car is done i would like to work on the 305 casually for awhile and build it mildly. then throw that bad boy in a nice rs or something like that. that do you think?

 

i bet they know more than you.

 

That would be a cool RS. Any motor that's in rebuildable shape or is still running is a good motor to me. lol

 

In my opinion you can reach 400 HP with the 305. Here is my estimate of what it will take.

-E-Tec 170 heads, TFS 305 heads, or AFR 180 heads
-11 to 1 compression (This will be needed to keep the dymanic compression high enough to work with the cam)
-Mini ram intake or Performer RPM intake and 650 CFM carb
-ZZ-409 cam or similar cam. (tighter lobe seperation if carb is used)
-1-5/8 headers or 1-3/4 headers
-Good lower end parts that will allow 6500 RPM peak power

 

LOL - they are journalists first, then car people...

 

since you wanna keep it carb'd then why not build a 383 with a rpm air gap and some afrs heads?
much easier swap than a lt1, no wiring necessary and for the lt1 you have to have the pcm tuned unless you can do it yourself itll run you a couple hundred bux.

 

I guess It would be a matter of dollars and cents spending lots of dollers on a 305 does not make sense ........... With that said I DID IT BECAUSE I Wanted to.... look me up back around 2004- 2005 I got to find the link ...........
I had a l69 built - ported the crap out of the heads Lunati cam etc etc .. with a mis tuned 454 TBI on top it made 240 hp on the tires 14.7 in the quarter -- I could have put the car in the 13 second range with a 350 but I did my way and had fun .... soo there .... hell I still have that engine in storage

 

ok found it check this old stuff out !!!!!!!!!!

CG




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