My 1989 5.0L camaro takes 6 sec of solid cranking and throttle play to start (cold start) and about 3 to 4 on a warm start. Has a tbi unit on it. Was wondering if this is normal? Would timing to far advanced cause long cranking to start.

 

Let the fuel system prime and see if that helps... Also, purge your fuel line... It should have what looks like the end of a valve stem on the line

 

ok. I normally do let it prime through.. purging the system would help with air in the lines, right? but would that build up every time? Where would the valve be at, cant remember seeing one on the lines in engine bay.

 

It wouldn't build ever time but it will stay there if there is some

 

where is this purging valve?

 

Any air will self bleed out of a recirculating system, the valve is not a purge valve but a shrader valve for hooking up a fuel pressure gauge.

Does the pump prime? if the relay is dead or not activated for some reason it will start on the oil pressure switch, which takes a couple of secs to build pressure and close the contact

 

Twin Turbo just spoke my mind. It sounds like a problem with the fuel pump relay or circuit. at least I would start by testing for power to and from the relay, both at key on(2 second prime) and while cranking.

 

The car does prime. I can hear it when I turn the key, I normally let that Prime then Ill start it. After it has ran for a bit start up is better. Would to far advanced timing cause that? or a plug issue?

 

Timing too advanced will cause hard starting. So will poor ignition tune. You need to check your state of tune and timing. Be aware also that the condition of your injectors may be an issue. Does the car run well once it starts? If not, think about having your injectors tested and serviced.

 

Car seems to run fine when its running. After warm up idles around 900rpms (normal?). Just the cold starts are what get me.

 

I had this problem for the last 3 years, finally about 2 months ago I had an injector crap out on me so I replaced them and after that it starts at the bumb of a key. Try lpoking at the injectors

 

ok will look into that. ( have the vats bypass decoder.. that would have anything to do with it since it starts fine once warmed up?)

 

You might want to look at your coolant temp sensor. It's the one located in the front of the intake manifold. It has two wires connect to it. One yellow and one black. It should test at 3,400 ohms at 70 degrees(cold), and 180 ohms at 220 degrees(hot). The engine relies heavily on this information for its cold start fuel correction. In range sensor failures(no trouble code set) are fairly common.

 

how to I test across the sensor like that?? Not sure on electrics, but I do have a multimeter. lol. That is a great new response too, thank you!

 

That sensor is known for corrosion making it's way into the sensor plug area, if you really get digging into this, I had the same problem and I dropped my ecu on the pass side and tested from the engine bay to the ecu on those two wires to diagnose one of my problems on my 88 bird. may be a bit extreme, but between replacing the sensor (which broke), the plug (which was corroded), and a piece of the wire that had been grounded from rubbing outside of the wire loom, I got my car back to a turn key, immediate starting vehicle. of course I pulled the engine 3 months later, but thats a whole other story.

and you need to set your multimeter to ohms to measure the two pins in the sensor plug.

 

Awesome guys thank you. Ill get a pic just to make sure its the right thing, and look corroded

 

Here is the plug and sensor. Can see alittle rust coloring on the plug, could this be an issue? proper plug right?

 

That discoloration is not good. Test the sensor with your ohmmeter by touching the leads to the pins in the sensor itself. You can go one step further by disconnecting the ECM and testing resistance at the ECM connector as 84redTA mentioned. However, just the appearance of the connector is enough for me to say it needs to be replaced. You may be able to clean and re-tension the connector but this is a somewhat touchy process as the connector is easy to destroy if you're not careful. The connectors are available as repair parts that can be spliced into the harness. If you go this route, be sure to use heat shrink crimp connectors, or better yet if you know how to solder, solder and heat shrink the splices. This is a low voltage sensor circuit so clean, weather tight connections are mandatory. If the pins in the sensor are as bad as the connector looks, replace it regardless of whether it tests okay.

 

ok, cool. An actual solution. Nice. I will check it out and replace. Is it a pain in the a** to pull that sensor? Doesn't look corroded on the outside so it may unscrew with ease. Can I get a new pigtail sensor at local auto parts? I can solder, so the re connection will be good.

 

the issue with that plug as what's probably already been said, but a little further explained is that this sensor operates off of pure resistance, of which different temperatures of the engine yeild different resistance values. long story short, every wire on your car has a little bit of resistance, plus the resistance of the sensor itself will give the computer a value to work with and operate. when rust or corrosion get in the mix, it will change the resistance of the wire and or connection, and send the values out of proportion.

i got my pigtail at car quest, not sure what stores you have around you, advance auto or autozone may have what you need, just have to ask them. you can solder if you have the patience, but i've become partial to solderless terminals with the water tight shrink wrapping all in one unit. crimp em and heat em up and they are sealed for life, very efficient and easy, but it's really what every you choose.

 

84redta stated it well. Added resistance in this circuit causes the ECM to read an engine temperature value lower than the actual value. Do not try to solder the connections at the sensor itself. Simply replace the damaged connector and the sensor. This is a GM Weatherpack connector and is moisture resistant. Obviously, this isn't a perfect world and even these weathertight connectors can become corroded over time. This is worse when a vehicle is parked outside in moist climates. Especially if the engine is left for long periods of time without being warmed up. That connector is a common replacement part and should be available anywhere that Standard Motor Products are sold, which is just about anywhere. This includes NAPA(NAPA electrical parts are made by SMP).

 

The cts acdelco 213-928 gm#15326386



you could repair this with a gm 12101899

 

cool, found part for like 17 bucks but the pigtail is like 23 lol. Will replace both.

 

you can get more part numbers off rock auto.com like standard auto or use packard delphi 12162193 and 12160223

http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine....yword=12160223


http://www.ebay.com/itm/ACDELCO-ENGI...#ht_5198wt_829

http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-GM-Coola...#ht_2322wt_829

 

right right, thanks. Was looking for immediate fix, but has been driven this way for months now. So i think I could wait on shipped parts. lol.

 

you can get the cts at any parts store under standard motors TX3, the pig tail can be picked up at a junk yard most older tbi trucks and cars use this connection. just solder back the leads and use shrink tubing.

 

Sounds Good! Thanks for all the help!