Im thinking about doing a 383 on my 350 block. But Im not sure if this 383 rotating assembly kit is good or not.. Any suggestions?

http://skipwhiteperformance.com/deta...tem=3831PCFT30

 

Here is the actual connecting rods.

 

This is a good example of why I don't like package deals.There always have to be lower dollar parts included in them to make them "a deal". Here is some feedback:

1)cast steel crank
2)Probe pistons.Not a big fan of them.
3)H-Bean rods with 7/16's bolts,but I would bet they are not ARP's.
4)No need for free floating pins on the street
5)Prostreet damper??. Who's is that??.

 

First off what is your goal of the motor (street, track, power expectations)?

Here's my opinions:

Which heads are you planning on using? Sure they say 10.7:1 is save on 64cc aluminum heads. If you're using stock heads or iron aftermarket it may be a little too much depending on head chambers and where you live (different pump gas octane available all over). Aluminum dissipates heat better than iron. That's why it also says if you have Iron heads use the dished pistons.

H beams are kind of overkill it's added weight over a good forged I beam if you aren't planning on making 650-700 HP+.

Okay so they give you rods that good to over 700 HP in durability match it with forged floating pistons but then match it with a cast nodular crank that is probably good to 500-550 HP to save some money? At this point I got confused are they building a high end rotating assembly or just throwing whatever crankshaft they have in stock into the combo? Sure a forged crankshaft might add another $300 or $400 to the cost but why skimp when you get to that piece that is holding everything together.

I like the idea of floaters. It will make it a heck of a lot easier to assemble at home if you plan on doing the work. What snap rings do they provide? Is it the rounded type or the square edges?

Do they include the weight card for the balancing? You're going to find that very handy later if you need to swap out a piece. Is it internal or external balanced? Knowing could be critical later when you need to replace a flexplate.

I do like the idea of cap screws on the rods. Like stated above are they ARP or some off brand knock off?

I've never used Hastings plasma moly rings or King bearings so I can't comment on that area.

 

Here is some feedback:

1)cast steel crank
Does the OP need a forged crank?

2)Probe pistons.Not a big fan of them.
Personal opinion

3)H-Bean rods with 7/16's bolts,but I would bet they are not ARP's.
Scat 7/16" rods have ARP bolts
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SCA-6570021/

4)No need for free floating pins on the street
Does anyone make a H beam rod for pressed pins ?

5)Prostreet damper??. Who's is that??.
Professional Products

 

Ok guys. Keep all the opinions coming. I have no knowledge in this area so fire away!!! Here is what I have. I have a new set of AFR 1040 (195) alum. heads, a EDL TES header with modified lower ypipe collector(cut out pinch and welded both ends together to make it free flow) summit aluminum 1.6 Roller Rockers, ported plenum (Siamese), Siamese SLP Runners, Ported EDL TPI high flow base and a LT1 cam. The block is a 350 4 bolt main 1 rear main piece.

 

And it's a street car.

 

I'd say for your expected power levels and application that cast nodular crank should be fine as long as you're not planning on spraying it or going boosted later and reusing it.

 

Look don't get me started with these "DEALS". I HATE it when customer comes to me with one to find out he got screwed. Probe pistons measure all over the map. Fact. Full floaters add nothing to the output of the engines and if in use correctly are used for race applications to be able to swap pistons easily.Fact. Show me anywhere in the ad it states those are Scat rods.It implies it but it isn't stated.Fact.These 383's like a good damper.Fact.Not some cheap knock-off.

WAKE UP PEOPLE.These parts do not have a big profit margin. When your trying for a deal,you get what you pay for.

 

My opinion on strokers: If you don't go straight to a forged crank, forget it and stay with the stock GM crank. Anything else is a downgrade in reliability. I'm totally with 1Gary on this one; aftermarket cast cranks are a complete crap shoot; they're junk. I could only understand using one in a low rpm truck engine if you have no crank to start with.

A fact: Most people that build strokers end up producing less power than if they had put that money in rebuilding the stock shortblock + quality heads, cam, and valvetrain. The top end is where the power is made. The bottom end only needs to provide the durable platform and the cylinder sealing.
What are your performance goals, OP? You can put your money into "I have a stroker" or you can put it toward making power
Just to give you an idea, I've run 10's NA with a rebuilt stock bottom 350 in a 3900 lb car. Stock reconditioned rods w/ARP, stock pistons, hydraulic cam, and a killer set of ported LT1 heads. Turning it to 7000+ for 3 years now.

If I'd had $8k to dump on an engine, I'd have a forged stroker, but I didn't and I don't. No regrets.

 

Forget boost!!! I see spray as a last resort. It's like pulling out brass knuckles when your getting your rear end whooped. Take the loss like a man. Good info guys. Keep em coming.

 

Boost? Spray? What are you talking about now?

 

Scat makes some descent cast cranks. Never had any issues with probe pistons, seems more like an opinion then anything else. I am not aware how well h-beams will clear with a stroker crank though. Never had issues with floating pins.
I can say King bearings are relatively cheap but they are better than any of the bearings in their price range and I have ran them without issues.

 

My probe pistons mic'd closer to each other than the cylinder bores measured after I got my block back from a highly recommended machinist. I agree with vetteoz, that's a big personal opinion.

.0002" is not "all over the map."

Also, I hate when people try to talk other people into going way bigger than they need. For a mild 383, theres absolutely no need for a forged crank.


OP, try RPM machine. That's where I bought my rotating assembly. You can call and verify every part that comes with with the kit. Even swap out parts from any of their suppliers. And for the record, my Scat Rods did come with ARP 2000 series 7/16" cap screws.

 

Aaaaaa.Ya see when I voice the facts it isn't from a "personal" point of view.It's from business operating for yrs. 10 sets of Probe junk for starters.

Read the ad boys.No Scat rod in that ad..............

 

Scat H-Beams with the 12 point head bolts cleared my stock base circle cam fine,
Minimal clearancing of the block ( as per usual ) near pan rail required

 

H-beam rods will help with clearance with a 3.75 stroke, so I can see the advantage of those. They would have to have ARP bolts, though, that's a dealbreaker to me.

It's a cheap 383 rotating assembly with cheap entry level parts... but cheap entry level bottom end parts are good to pretty ridiculous power levels. If you're planning on hitting 500+ hp at 6500+ RPM, then spend more on bottom end. But if you're gonna cap it at 6k RPM and 400-450hp you'll be fine with a cast crank and regular I-beam rods and so forth.

I do like the idea of forged pistons, but cast hypereutectics do have a few advantages, 1. They expand less with temperature changes so they can fit tighter in the bore 2. They are lighter. You just have to be REAL careful about compression levels and spark detonation... If you get under load and it starts pinging they will blow holes into themselves or lift the ring lands... ugly ugly ugly. Also pay close attention to ring gaps with them. They're VERY particular about that on some brands. Forged IS better, but they're not better at everything. These Probe forged pistons make me suspicious of the quality of their forgings though. They seem a little too cheap. But maybe they're better than hypers? They seem to be well-regarded in Gen III/IV circles, so Im curious to hear 1gary's take on it fleshed out a little more.

Remember, expensive, heavy duty bottom end parts are often heavier and will make LESS power than the more standard stuff, and the standard stuff is surprisingly decent as long as you're not running nitrous/turbo/superchargers on it. Even then, consider how many people throw turbos/nitrous/superchargers on stock L98s/LT1's etc without any problems. (At least for a while. )

I even run a factory L98 crank in my car... Im not making enough power for it to be a problem. No need to spend $1000 on a crankshaft if you're making 1 hp per cubic inch or less.

I feel that way about a lot of this stuff, the cheap bottom end parts are perfectly fine for the vast majority of builds as long as they were made properly and tolerances are in spec. But if you're planning on any kind of forced induction or nitrous or high RPMs and 500hp+ power levels, bottom end investments are a good idea. But if you're building a street car, rarely is that worth the extra investment.

mw66nova ran King bearings in his cobbled together 12 second 305 that had a 350 crank (wrong counterweights). He spun that thing to nearly 7k RPM on a regular basis and it just kept on going. It's still running today. Based on his experiences with King bearings I went ahead and threw them into my 350 too. Maybe Clevite is better... maybe not. I dont know. But I do know the King bearings have worked fine in my car and matt's car. (For the record my King bearings were sold as "Summit" brand, but not sure if that's still their supplier) But my car is only pushing 300ish crank hp, nothing crazy.


Definitely something that needs to be stated more often. Forged cranks dont make more power than stock. Even cubic inches dont necessarily make more power by themselves. You have to have the top end to help it breathe the extra cubes.

 

Fireturd350 mentioned spray and boost. So I stated my opinion. That's all.

 

Here is my suggestion.You select your own component parts putting together your own package.Is going to cost you more??. Sure.But your getting more. Does it have to include a $1,000 crank??. Well that would have to consider your intended use. Be aware there are stages of costs for cranks and some very good quality cranks at $400 to $600 bucks. There buy one step above what you think you need for the expanded use over time. Ya do know we all get bored with what we have and always end up wanting to get more out of it.

 

Very very true. In 2009, all I wanted is to get my IROC running. Now I'm looking to keep up with the current mustangs. But other than that, I'm going for the "sleeper" type. My IROC will be a street car. I don't intend to hit the drag strips every weekend. But I appreciate your feedback 1gary. Will consider your recommendations. Thanks.

 

Lets say everything measured and balanced out correctly (have it balanced again anyway! And measure it all)

It will be more than enough for your TPI if thats what youre aksing.
So they are mismatched so what youll never ever notice a lighter rod.

ive found they measure more accurately than SRP just my experience. IMO probe is decent stuff.
No issues with them.
There will be some that slip through the cracks no matter what the brand though

 

I am going to say that I have been sick now for the better part of a week. So I am not in the best of moods.

LOOK you just keep insisting about a brand name your loyal to. OK already we get that. And I am "trying" to teach you from yrs of being directly involved in the industry. Please don't compare SRP,TRW,or anything else to the lower dollar Probe. There are reasons why you pay more for the better pistons. It is just the way it is. Period.

Ya just DON'T get something for nothing. Big boy pants now.

 

1gary making his rounds....

 

Like I and others have said up above. This assembly kit should do everything you're currently looking for.

If you're wanting a stroker kit that should work.

You're the one paying for the kit and it's easy for the rest of us to say sure it's not a 4340 forged or billet assembly so it's not the best. But for the application currently this should work fine. Everyone's idea of motor building differs you need to just pick the right parts for what you want to do it.

 

Fireturd350, I truly appreciate your advice. Really. But I may just bite the dust and purchase quality parts individually. I wanted to convert in one session but I'll just have to go in pieces. Thanks though. And thans to everyone who provided their thoughts and opinions.

 

Not all stroker kits are as questionable as this one seems to be!

And there certainly is a chance to save a couple bucks by buying a kit!

Talk to Damon at RPMMachine.com. He will tell you exactly what parts are included with his kits, and will substitute any part of it for a different part from any one of his suppliers.

 

Speak to your machinist prior to purchasing.
he can probably get you a better matched asy for less than you can buy it.
He will have to measure everything anyway so if any brand anything is bad it can go back.
He can also tell you which parts will balance out better.

Lots of mismatched kits being sold out there cause they got the parts cheap and are a bitch to balance driving YOUR bill up. Never trust that they are done when advertised spend 100 and make sure its right. That will help it live a long life..a quality balancer goes a long way also stay away from the cheap stuff.

 

We for yrs in hot rodding mod'ed cars because we wanted more,faster cars. It was and still is in some circles a thought pattern of one mind. With that we built engines who's parts could handle anything we threw at it. The maybe not so recent changes that has happened is the bottom dollar questionable parts that certainly has a "rated" hp rating which in many cases is hard pressed to the limits just to cover that rating. That is you do get what you pay for and nothing,0,zilch,Nada,beyond that. This is a view point from a business involved in the high performance industry.

That advise I make no money from it and get nothing back for it. It doesn't matter much to me if you choose not to follow what I am telling you. My customers benefit from our business knowledge and us not using those parts. I personally benefit from all those yrs as well and not only talk about what to do,but actually follow and do what I say you guys should do. Yepper the money on the table and spent on the parts that haven't had or doesn't currently have any history of QC problems or failures. A proven fact.
So the advise is free...........what you do with it is your choice.The part that sucks is if you post later you now have a major loss because you didn't follow the advise. Yeah that would bother me big time. LOL-guess I care too much about ya.