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Tech / General EngineIs your car making a strange sound or won't start? Thinking of adding power with a new combination? Need other technical information or engine specific advice? Don't see another board for your problem? Post it here!
I have a 3970010 block which did not come with the dipstick tube provision (dipstick tube through the block). I didn't realize this when I put my engine together (I used a different block than what was in the car for reasons). I've been looking for a pan which has the dipstick provision through the side. Wondering if anyone has the part number for it by chance? For reference, the pan is the rear sump setup for the 1-piece rear oil seal. It should have the oil dipstick dimple (or whatever you want to call it) on the right (passenger) side even though there's not hole in the block for it ... this is the way the pan rail is setup, which is one of the reasons I didn't notice it not being there in the first place.
010 is a 60s - 70s casting. The dipstick goes on the left (driver's side). There's a hole all the way through the block for it; deck to oil pan rail.
Any pan and dipstick that will fit a 70s Camaro will fit in your situation. (assuming of course that this is going into a 82-92 Camaro/Firebird) The dipstick however will NOT fit, unless the car has headers. It has to go RIGHT DIRECTLY THROUGH THE MIDDLE of the stock exhaust manifold.
The 3970010 casting number was used up until 1980. You can verify that on Mortec. It can be a 2 or 4 bolt main. It can be 2-piece or 1-piece rear main. It can be flat tappet or roller provisioned. I know what you're saying, but the provision for the tube is not there. You can find this topic posted elsewhere on the interwebz (I've searched extensively) where others have ran into the same issue. Believe me, I'm not the only one.
I'm not here to argue semantics, though ... I was hoping to either find a part number for an in pan oil dipstick or a pan itself. I cannot find either and have no clue what cars might have used this type of oil pan to cross reference to.
Originally Posted by sofakingdom
That can't be right.
010 is a 60s - 70s casting. The dipstick goes on the left (driver's side). There's a hole all the way through the block for it; deck to oil pan rail.
Any pan and dipstick that will fit a 70s Camaro will fit in your situation. (assuming of course that this is going into a 82-92 Camaro/Firebird) The dipstick however will NOT fit, unless the car has headers. It has to go RIGHT DIRECTLY THROUGH THE MIDDLE of the stock exhaust manifold.
010 is a 2-pc rear main casting. Never came from the factory with either 1-pc rear main or roller cam; although I have personally provisioned more than one as such using the roller system we all had been using for all those decades before the factory came out with theirs.
Not a matter of "semantics" or for that matter "argue", unless you choose to do so. It would not be wise to do that though. The facts are the facts independent of "argue". Quite simply, there is no such thing as "features from the future". 010 is a 60s - 70s casting; 1-pc RMS was introduced in 86, and roller provisions in 87. Neither applies to this older casting that had been long since discontinued by the time either appeared.
The reason you can't find "where others have ran into the same issue" is because there are no others. The reason there are no others is because there is no issue.
Any pan and dipstick that will fit a 70s Camaro will fit in your situation. (assuming of course that this is going into a 82-92 Camaro/Firebird) The dipstick however will NOT fit, unless the car has headers. It has to go RIGHT DIRECTLY THROUGH THE MIDDLE of the stock exhaust manifold.
I would add, my personal favorite pan to use on motors built using that casting over the last 4 decades or more that I've been building them, is the old "Z28" pan. I've been using it on those since the 70s myself. It has the advantage of holding an extra quart over any of the stock pans you might use from cars such as Camaro, Nova, Chevelle, or Monte Carlo, from 70-1/2 up through about 78 for the Camaro and at least as far back as 73 for the other bodies. (be aware however that starting in about 77 or 78, some vehicles came with a similar pan that had the dipstick int he side of the pan instead of going through the block; I had a 78 El Camino 305 that was like that) It does have one down side though; it requires a windage tray, which requires different main bolts. The factory tray used 5 "studs", that were really sort of just bolts with an extra smaller stud sticking up off the end for the tray. But there's DOZENS, maybe even HUNDREDS, of aftermarket pans that will work, simply because it's the single most popular SBC oil pan configuration in existence.
You mention what I highlighted below, but don't give me any useful information to find one (which is my original question). It is what I need and I'm still looking. Yes there are hundreds of examples of pans setup for left/right dipstick going through the block ... I don't need those. I need one where it goes through the side of the pan (unfortunately). Believe me when when I say, I was completely surprised to find out my block doesn't have a hole for one. When I pull the engine out to change the pan (argh), I'll post a pic of both the block casting number as well as the one piece rear main seal.
Originally Posted by sofakingdom
I would add, my personal favorite pan to use on motors built using that casting over the last 4 decades or more that I've been building them, is the old "Z28" pan. I've been using it on those since the 70s myself. It has the advantage of holding an extra quart over any of the stock pans you might use from cars such as Camaro, Nova, Chevelle, or Monte Carlo, from 70-1/2 up through about 78 for the Camaro and at least as far back as 73 for the other bodies. (be aware however that starting in about 77 or 78, some vehicles came with a similar pan that had the dipstick int he side of the pan instead of going through the block; I had a 78 El Camino 305 that was like that) It does have one down side though; it requires a windage tray, which requires different main bolts. The factory tray used 5 "studs", that were really sort of just bolts with an extra smaller stud sticking up off the end for the tray. But there's DOZENS, maybe even HUNDREDS, of aftermarket pans that will work, simply because it's the single most popular SBC oil pan configuration in existence.
I would have to see al this to believe it; and of course, some sort of test to verify that the casting # hasn't been ground off of some other block and the 010 epoxied back, like some other people at tracks where people that I built motors for ran at back in the day would... in certain classes The Rules required head castings from a list (say, 624, 993, or 882) and people would get 186 or 041 or 492 or even 292 and grind em off and epoxy back on one of the legal ones. A Krylon rebuild will cover many such sins if the inspector happens to get unavoidably distracted (like, somebody's girlfriend just accidentally has an eye-catching "wardrobe malfunction" right close by) at a critical moment.
Meanwhile, unless the space aliens got bored one night in like 1976 and decided to find some new excitement besides creating crop circles and looking like Elvis in random C-stores late at night out in the woods in "deep red" states where they like banjo music, and instead decided to break into a casting plant after 2nd shift went home and put 1986-up "features from the future" on JUST ONE of the blocks that was laying around, and somehow nobody that was building the motor noticed it but also JUST HAPPENED to find EXACTLY ONE 1-pc RMS housing and seal for it on the shelf and installed it, and somehow you JUST HAPPENED to come up with it, it's gonna take some MIGHTY POWERFUL proof.
I know of "kits" to put a 2-pc crank into a 1-pc block, so that people could use their accumulated cranks and flywheels and whatnot in new blocks, but I'm not aware of any "kit" to go the other way (convert a 2-pc block to 1-pc).
I suppose you could look for a pan for a 78 El Camino 305 in the meantime. Except of course it will be for 2-pc RMS like a pan for every other block cast before the 86 model year (which for castings started probably around Apr 85). If you've got what you say you've got, you have a mutt like nothing I've ever seen or heard of.
I did happen to find some information about what the op is talking about. However, I can't find a passenger side dimple on any pan with a dipstick. I have however found a pan that is exactly like what is picture in the picture below. I am also stumped by the one piece rear main seal dilemma. I would have to make the assumption that this pan fits a two piece because its suggest applications are all before 86. https://www.summitracing.com/parts/rnb-264-118
Thanks Logan for the link. Unfortunately I agree with you. I don't believe that pan would work.
Another option is to pull this pan off (or buy a separate one) and weld a tube provision to it ... that doesn't sound like much fun either, but it is what it is. I'll still end up pulling the engine to make it happen. I guess I should get it running and broke in before I pull the engine. Still, if anyone has any further suggestions, I'm all ears.
The obvious easy answer is to install a sight glass tube in the side of the pan. Pull the pan off (yes it is possible to do it in the car), and weld in a couple of 1/4"x18 nuts for this guy:
That's not a bad idea, General. I did see a Canton (I think) 8-quart oval track pan (again, I think that's what it was) which comes with a sight glass in it. It was like over $300 for it ... not really wanting to spend that kind of money to fix this issue. I've spent way too much money on this car as it is, lol. Really ... not a bad idea, though.. It's going to be a hassle no matter how I go about it, no doubt. I could just as easily do it the "cool kids way"
Originally Posted by GeneralDisorder
The obvious easy answer is to install a sight glass tube in the side of the pan. Pull the pan off (yes it is possible to do it in the car), and weld in a couple of 1/4"x18 nuts for this guy:
I took the "Z28" pan mentioned above, cut the dipstick tube think off of it (was much like the one in Logan's pic), cut a window in the pan, and welded (riveted and then brazed actually) the tube entry piece to it. Then used the dipstick tube for a (wait for it ...) 78 El Camino 305 ... was at a time when that vehicle was still new enough you could get one at the GM store ... in it. Worked like a charm.
Note also in Logan's pic, the hole in the deck between and below the 2 spark plugs. That's where the dipstick goes in a 010 block. (or any other 50s - 60s - 70s casting) It goes all the way through the block, into that little kicked-out place on the pan rail, and into the pan.
Come to think of it, I might even still have that pan around. If it's still on the motor I made it for, and I still have that motor, it might just still be.
Well, I've called off the hounds. I've decided I'm going to put a sight window into the side of the pan. Thanks, General, for the idea. I didn't like the type you had showed me, only because it would stick out from the pan a little bit. Instead, I'm going to get one which is more/less flush mount (sticks out maybe 1/4" from the pan). It has a 1/2" NPT thread on it. I'll drill the hole to fit, screw it in, then I've bought a coupler which I'll trim down to fit onto the back of it (inside the pan). I also plan on using some red Loctite on it to keep it in place. While a little bit more of a PITB to check your oil level, a heck of a lot easier than finding the right pan. Great fun. Anyway, I'll post up some picks when I get it installed, but I don't plan on doing it until after I get the thing fired and first oil change.
I'll be using some "The Right Stuff" Permatex sealant at the back of the sight glass where it connects to the pan. I'll be using the red Loctite to keep the coupler firmly attached to the sight glass ... it wouldn't be a big hole, but it surely would leak a bunch )
Originally Posted by GeneralDisorder
Nice! For thread sealant I like Loctite 545. Excited to see the pics!
I have a 3970010 block which did not come with the dipstick tube provision (dipstick tube through the block). I didn't realize this when I put my engine together (I used a different block than what was in the car for reasons). I've been looking for a pan which has the dipstick provision through the side. Wondering if anyone has the part number for it by chance? For reference, the pan is the rear sump setup for the 1-piece rear oil seal. It should have the oil dipstick dimple (or whatever you want to call it) on the right (passenger) side even though there's not hole in the block for it ... this is the way the pan rail is setup, which is one of the reasons I didn't notice it not being there in the first place.
I think some early 283's and early 305's installed in Monzas had pans with tubes. I don't think it will fit your block (as you describe) because the "bump" is on the wrong side.
05-28-2020, 10:32 AM
Thanks! 
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