Greg Kuhlmann

why is my 87 trans am carburated, while almost every other 87 trans am 305 is F I ?

zippy

because who ever ordered it was cheap. what kind of answer were you looking for? plain and simple, some cheap *** ordered it.

Blackened

Ummm... you were the one that bought it ! Should have looked under the hood first !! LOL

Greg Kuhlmann

no i knew it was carb when i bought it. i was just wondering why werent all the 87 ta's with a 305 carbed or F I?

Chronos_Titan

Check your VIN if the i believe the 8 digit is the H then it should be carbed. If it is have fun with your 150 hp. So either sell it or start upgrading right away.

zippy

if you wanted to know why F.I. wasn't standard you should have just asked that. it wasn't standard due to costs. the carb engine kept the base price of it down. leaving the others optional also made it appear to have more options than just two engines.

Greg Kuhlmann

well i guess my T A is a base model. but who ever bought it brand new didnt get it with out any opitons. its t tops power everything and everything works. the int is perfect and the ext has no rust with a new paint job brand new tires, ball joints, and much more. so i really didnt get screwed on buying it for 2,200. it has near 130 with no smoking and starts everytime even in -10 degree weather. so to me, all and all i didnt get screwed on the car just the motor some... but once i get my settlement from the stealth i had im buying a new 350. and you say its rated at 150 horsepower then a mello 350 rated at 330 horse power ought'a be a world of difference. thats what im probally going to be buying from jegs with en 2 monthes.

brharris27370

www.sdpc2000.com is probably the cheapest place to buy that 350HO motor from. Would be a relatively painless upgrade and more than double the HP for $2k.

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

dont expect to get that while using the stock intake manifold and the stock exaust. My bro upgraded to a modded 350 but left everything else stock. It was so damn slow I could kill it with my '90 cutlass cierra

Greg Kuhlmann

i already got a cat back system. i will be putting on some headmen headers. with the headmen Y pipe. i thinking around a 600cfm carb. i want a big cam and i dont think i will be getting that with a crate motor. but for double the horse power and a good price i dont know how i can go wrong. and have a solid bottom end for future mods.

rocky383

You could just put a 4 cylinder in and save on gas money. Just a ($hitty) thought.

:hail:IROC-Z

Greg Kuhlmann

thanks for that smart *** reply. i was 16 when i bought the car and im 17 now. not too bad for my real first car. plus i dont know hardly anything about motors. i have a 4 bolt main block in the basement. thought about building that up. but after reading there is way more to building a motor then just putting some nuts and bolts together. so im going to either have this local guy build me one or just buy a crate motor. all im waiting on is a settlement from my old car (was going to buy it from my mom, dodge stealth ES) really cheap but then this guy hit me... so they paid the car off and now they have to settle with me.

rocky383

No problem. Yeah, building a motor entails a lot of knowledge. You can get a good crate motor for $2000 - $2500.

Good luck,
Smart ***

:hail:IROC-Z

Greg Kuhlmann

thanks rocky. thats gonig to be about my budget. 2500. i just hope i cant get it all in for that and have it running right. im just afraid once i get the motor there will be lots of hidden cost. 20 bucks here and there...

SSC

Interesting, I was hitting 13's in my 76 pu with stock exh manifolds/ inatake and a qjet. Upgrading all of these to higher end components only brought my E.T down 1.3 seconds and mph up 9 although real tires helped the most.
Sounds like your brother had some major tuning issues.


Greg, Take that 4 bolt in your basement to a reputable shop or engine builder in your area and have them build it. If you have the complete bottem end (the useable part) you could have a better than crate engine built for less than $1000 including cam and gaskets and still have money to through at a good set of heads, carb and intake. Why let a good engine go to waste? Thank GM for the carbed car, its alot easyer to make power with it than the F.I ones.

Greg Kuhlmann

yeah, well the only thing i could possibly use is the crank. if that i dont know. the motor was out of a late 70's early 80's cargo van. he said that something in the feul lines broke, and it set in a feild for nearly 8 years. then they took it out and it was just laying next to a barn for a year or so. there is major rust on everything. the cyl's can be bored out. but if i have to ill end up buying a crank, connecting rods, pistons. i found a kit in summit for nearly 400 bucks for all 3 of those and all the gaskets. then i figure a cam is a good 130 bucks. heads are nearly a grand, and then the intake manifold and carb is going to run near 400 to 500. i heard i could use my same dist, alt, starter... if so that would save me some till i got new. and then you figure its going to cost 10 bucks a cyl to bore it. 80 to bore, 400 bottom end, 1000 heads, 130 cam, 450 intake, headers with y pipe 200. plus anything else i would need... so i figure thats going to run close to 2k or more.

dimented24x7

iTrader: (2)

that and a stock bed type cat really choaked things down.

SSC

If the heads were on that engine theres probably no unfixable damage, a hot tank can cure alot of problems. Rods can be resized and refurbished cranks (if you had to go that route) can be purchased for under $200, JCW has pink rods fairly cheap. The last crank I bought for my truck was under $200. The engine build for the firebird, bored out, new pistons, bearings and the rest of the engine components with cam were under $700, including magnafluxing everything, having the rotating assembly ballanced which was extra work not usually included in a rebuild also including a valve job.
Just seems alot more friendly this way $$$ and power wise.
I would pull that engine down and have a machine shop take a look at it, cant hurt.

mcconahay37

iTrader: (3)

I second www.sdpc2000.com as the cheapest place to get a crate engine. Also they give free shipping as long as you pick it up at their terminal.

five7kid

iTrader: (14)

Back to the original question - why?

It was probably ordered that way by the dealer as a "loss leader". You know the ad: "New V8 Camaro, loaded, only $xx,xxx!" When the guy goes in and wants to see it, he's also shown the TPI model, "210 horses for only y-dollars more," the salesman says. At the end of the model year, after they've used it to put dozens of people in the more expensive cars, they dump it in their "Year End Blow-out Sale!"

I also find it interesting they kept carbs that long. Fall of '85, I interviewed with GM Rochester, they told me they had made their last carb. Glad they didn't offer me a job, since they were willing to lie about that.

On another note, think twice before going for that 350 HO. Those Vortec heads can produce some "challenges", especially if you have emissions, or if you want to upgrade power via cam change, etc., later on. You need to add ~$200 for an intake manifold & hardware to that attractive $2222.80 price, for instance.

Danno

Greg, I am the old fart here. My first car was a 65 Impala with a 396 and a powerglide two speed auto. Don't fret, a carb. engine poses all kinds of possibilities. My suggestion is to look at the GM performance catalogue-more specifically at the zz4 motor. The WHOLE package is under five grand and you will turn a faster quarter than most of the clowns with FI. My 67 Nova with a 396 turned a 13.2 quarter stock. Hot Rod mag. called it the 13 second grocery getter. With a Accel coil and different dist. weights I broke into the 12 range. You have a great first car, and if you are patient it will soon be want you want. Guys, was all the sarcasm really necessary-my daughter just got her first car this week. Cavalier with a 2.2- give the kid a break!

Drew

iTrader: (58)

It's amazing how quickly people jump on the LG4... Considering that its the easiest to modify of all the 305's offered in the thirdgens. The stock intake manifold and carb will feed most any 350, as will the ignition setup... GM sells the ZZ4 conversion package which includes every piece needed to convert the car into a thirdgen that runs mid 13's and passes emissions. 14's are fairly easy as well. Unlike the TPI 305 that requires expensive aftermarket parts, and the TBI 305 that needs practically every piece of the car replaced for more power, or the CFI 305 that requires special parts and pretty much everything replaced.

Get the Lg4 in good tune, change the aircleaner to an HO aircleaner or open element, bolt on an aftermarket intake manifold, headers, hi flow cat, catback, cam, gears, some porting and watch it fly.

You can read up on the ZZ4 package in the GM performance parts catalog, and if you decide to buy it you can order it at just about any GM dealer.

Z28DJP1987

$796.00 for the TPI engine option, big bucks in 1987.

1991tealRSt-topGuy

i love my LG4

RedFirebird

The LG4 gets an unfair wrap. Just look at how much GM bottled it up, you almost become surprised it could make 145-165 HP.
Thats why they respond VERY well to mods and all the guys with LG4's are dropping tenths like mad with simple bolt-ons. There's 40-50 hp waiting to be released in the POS stock exhaust right there. Continuing down the line, replacing that restrictive single snorkel air cleaner and getting a GOOD ignition system will help appriciably as well. Throw in a good set of heads and a cam to go with them, and toss an intake into the mix, and all the sudden you have a 13 second machine that'll make most of us wish we had an LG4. :hail:

Check this out. 325 HP LG4

Vader

Kuhl, Mann!

Don't sweat all the criticizm. Yes, your powerplant may leave something to be desired, but who has one that doesn't? We all want "just that little bit more", right? A 305TPI is nothing to get all woody over, either.

If your car is sitting on a tight suspension with solid steering components, that's already better than a lot of "faster" cars. If the body and interior are in very good condition, you're WAY ahead of a lot of other cars of that age. I'd hate to think of how many "fast" cars I've seen with clapped-out bodies. Yeah - really nice ride, dude. I love that stealthy primer gray... And if everything works, you have some options and 'T'-tops, all you have left is an engine - the easiest thing to change about your car.

Beyond that, you're almost lucky to have the carbed engine from the factory. That means you can still run a carburetor and be emissions legal anywhere you go. And we all know the potential for carburetors and the wide variety of inexpensive intakes available for them. Try to find a short-runner intake for a TPI - it's called a Mini-Ram and will cost a lot more than the $120.00 Performer, $99.00 Torker, or $160.00 Victor intakes, for sure.

As for your spare engine, any time you don't want it just let me know. I'd be glad to help you clear out your basement. If it was a factory 4-bolt from a light or medium truck it likely had at least a cast nodular crank, or better yet, forged. Check the casting numbers on the case and heads to see exactly what you have. I'll bet you have a solid case and bottom end with some really lame-flowing heads with huge chambers for lower compression. The better heads are much easier and cheaper to come by, for sure.

And the fact that is sat in the yard for years only means that the case casting is a lot more stable and normalized than a newly cast case. There used to be a heavy equipment manufacturer in Tiffin, Ohio that would cast machine frames, then let them sit outside unmachined for 6-8 years before starting to build them, just to stabilize the castings over the winters/summers. Soem of their machines built in the 1930's are still running.

You should recalculate your engine build cost. You already have a cat-back, and the headers you were planning will fit the 4-bolt very nicely. Yes, nothing is free, but if you build the one you have in your stand, you can spread out the cost over as long as you want to make the project as painless (economically) as possible. It also gives you a lot of time to research every component you select to install. You'd be surprised at how well the crank, rod, and pistons will survive all that sitting in the field.

But if you decide to get rid of that "spare", just drop me an email. I'd even help you carry it out and load it into my truck.

zippy

one important way to look at having the LG4 is the starting point. first of all a beginner shouldn't start out with alot of hp. another point here is if you can make your LG4 run you've accomplished something and it's something to be proud of. by the time your happy with it you'll probably sell it but you'll be more prepared to go to bigger and better things with a knowlage about how something works and what really helps. whether someone starts with modifying a LG4, LN2, L35, honda 4 cylineder, etc. they are the best place for a beginner to start since he'll get credit for going fast. give a beginner a 4th gen Z28 or SS and the only credit to give him is he spent alot and it's going t be fairly fast reguardless.

Greg Kuhlmann

Thanks, the ext of my car is 100% perfect with only minor rust under the rear fender weels (just a spec or 2) the int is in very good condition too. i have put some nice seat covers on the front seats due to some tears. the back seats are like brand new. the only flaw on the inside is my passenger sail panel has a crack. the dash is perfect with no signs of any cracks. i have just put a whole new susp. on it last summer with some ball joints. i had some problems with the steering colum being loose. that cost 200 bucks but is very tight and firm now. my friend and his dad rebuild saturn's and they came across some gold GTA wheels, they just sat in there garage for a few years. then when i got the trans am they gave them to me for free. i had the gold painted black to go with my silver and gray car. it has new tires. just about anything that was going bad or did go bad has been replaced or fixed. i sunk near 2 grand in it just fixing it up. bought it for 2700. now the old 305 doesnt seem as "fast". so i want a 350. my friend has a 350 pushing 390 horsepower. with less then 12,xxx miles on it. withen the next 2 monthes im going to most likly buy that from him for 1,800$ the duration on the cam is .488". with that power im going to tear about everything in part from the transmission back. so over the summer my plans are to get a new 3.73 rear end with my 700r4 trans rebuilt (just incase, has 130,000 miles on it still shifts frim though). im hoping to have one of the badest hot rods for a kid my age in town. my dad loves the car. he wishes he would have just saved some of his old cars, im for sure going to have this car for the rest of my life. in another 10 years it will be considerd a classic. im going to rebuild the 305 withen the next few years and hopefully put that in a s10. my plans are big, but if i just keep working at it i know it will all come soon enough.