What would it take to beat a 2000 trans am with an auto trans. What do the run in the 1/4 ???

 

i have ridden in an auto 2000 trans am and all i have to say is oh my G O D they are fast when i took a ride in one i told the drivere to punch it and we were doing about 50 at teh time he put it to the floor and left it there and it got up too 130 mph with out any hesitation at all and he had to let off because we ran out of road those cars are way fast they will do like 155MPH in stock form all i have to say is watch out for those just because they are auto doesnt mean anything i actualy hear that autos are faster off the line then standards are.

 

and arent manuals usually only faster because they are usually better geared

 

yes the autos are faster off the line especially with a stall converter and a pair of slicks and you better hold on

 

Actually I have been in and driven a few LS1s and they feel slow, but they move fast. The cars are so smooth you can hardly tell how fast you are going until you look at the speedometer. Your average LS1 is going to run from 13.3-13.6 with the faster ones going 12.9-13.3 and the slower ones running 13.6-14.0. An auto will be much easier to make fast also, because the driver has less affect on the performance.

 

Easy Answer that everyone always says, but with the mods you have a 100hp shot of the juice would probably put you out front .

I agree with the comment about how smooth the LS1 f-bodies are and how they don't feel as fast as they really are.

Later, Garrett

 

I have to agree also, my friend has a 99 TA, manual, and that baby can book it! It's amazing how fast they accelerate. You can hit 100 so fast. But I guess its just the way that they are made, you just dont feel the punch as much as you would in other things.

 

You're gonna need heads, a decent cam, and some intake mods to beat them consistently unless you go the supercharger or nitrous route...

[EDIT] Oh yeah, I don't know what you're talking about not being able to feel the power, my best friend had a 98Z and a 01 Vette for awhile, they felt damn fast to me. Spent alot of time in the passenger seat of that 98Z, pulled like hell. Too bad I didn't get to race either in my 87Z. I've pulled on a few random LS1s I've run into but they were chance encounters so I don't know if they had sucky drivers, weren't expecting a good race until too late, etc.

 

i dunno about anyone else but i can definitely feel the ls1 power, that baby throws me back in the seat literally and its not even a comparison between me and my friend's 97 lt1 camaro. Maybe the LS1's you guys rode in werent floored?

 

I would work on helping that tpi breathe up top with maybe some large tube runners and base. Nitrous will always do the trick too, lol. You're on the right path with ure mods so far though, keep it up.

 

You're going to need some serious help to keep up with one from a roll.. TPI's have good torque so they can hold their own in the 1/8th mile, but after that they just don't flow the air that LS1's do. FWIW, I ran 13.1@109 with an intake(couldn't tell any difference, probably 5-10hp) and lca's with street tires. I just got my car back from being tuned after a header/cam install, and am now putting 370hp to the wheels. I don't like to speculate too much, but I'm shooting for around 12.7's@ ~114.

 

With cam and headers you'll be well into the 12's. 12.7 is very conservative.

 

well, with street tires I think it's a fair time to shoot for.. on the other hand I don't like to be that guy who claims he will run some outrageous time and then not back it up.. we'll see soon enough.

what f body do you own, modded at all?

 

I own 2. a 2000 z28 with bolt ons and a 92 rs stock. Read my post about the camaro vs lightning.

 

I am pretty sure they were. I was driving two of them and the others were either racing, checking a G-tech time, or on a back road testing the car out. I have been in a few and although they are extremely fast they just don't throw you in the seat like other cars I have been in.

 

i never got to drive in a ls1 or lt1 fourth gen yet, maybe its time for some test driving

 

is what i did. best decision yet

 

i test drove a 94 Formula, and i actually bought that car for my girlfriend. while the LT1 FELT faster than my TPI Vette, the Vette is faster. feeling fast means nothing, its the track numbers that count.
speakin of #s, this LS1 was making 315 RWHP when it ran this time. my Corvette was running the same times with about 75 less RWHP. seems like LS1s are dyno queens. with trap speeds like those, you should be in the mid - high 12 sec range

 

Seems like they're dyno queens? I've got a graph, two actually, right here and they are hardly dyno queens.

On the stock graph, I made 200rwhp@3500rpm, 250rwhp@4k, and 300 from 5k and up.

With a longer duration cam and headers, I'm now making 200rwhp@3200, 250rwhp@3800, and 300rwhp from 4500.

Not only did a cam with more duration make more power higher like it's supposed to, it added a significant amount of hp and torque lower in the rpm band ( 300+rwtq from 2500-6200, when the run stopped).

As for track times, of course your TPI vette is going to run similar TIMES to my car. torque is what gets you that. Yes, it is a widely known fact that TPI setups make gobs of torque where it is useful, down low. What exactly are your bolt ons?? Don't try to make it out like your car is running those times stock.. which is how it is comming across right now. I find it hard to believe that a basically stock TPI car is running 104mph. And yes, there is a difference between a car that traps 104 and 109. If you beg to differ, racing from a roll will show you the difference between a torque motor and a hp motor. $50 says you get raped by ls1's on the highway.

Your downplaying of ls1's is amusing though.. I didn't catch where you asked about my 13.1 run. But yes, it was extremely traction limited as my 2.2 60' would allude to. Also, auto's are nice to have when going for max et. If your vette is as amazing as you think, i'd like to see you rip off a mid 12 sec time on street tires when you have equivalent power that I do, which isn't too much more than you have now.

Before you make ignorant statments about cars or engines that clearly have an advantage over yours, do some reading and find out about what you're talking about. If you want to see a dyno queen, look at supras, rx7s, or other small displacement imports, not ls1s.

 

hehehe... looks like i touched a nerve, huh dont get all bent out of shape man, its just the internet.

what i was trying to say is that LS1s seem to need alot more hp to put down certain numbers than, say, a similar LT1 or L98. thats because GM moved the peak torque numbers a little too high. but im sure you already know that, so i wont get into it.

a few statement you made confused me, first you said this:
then you typed this:
so which is it? a decent difference, or not too much?actually, my car stock made 340 ftlbs at 3200rpms. not a high reving car, but certainly not all low end like you implied. hmmm, looks like YOURE the one who needs to do some reading before making ignorant statements
now youre sounding like a r1cer! race from a roll, race from a roll! sorry, but the standard measure of speed is the 1/4 mile.
ill be pretty close when the track reopens in a few weeks. keep checking up on my sig for improvements. i can tell you this: if i had 109 trap speeds i certainly wouldnt be running low 13s!
sure you do. thats cause youve dismissed all other cars/motors except the ones sporting LS1s. theres NO WAY a basically stock TPI car can keep up with a LS1, right? since you know so much, ill let you guess what ive done to this car to make it run 104mph, and well see how informed you really are.

 

I dont think a stock L98 could keep up with an LS1 either unless it is modded. There is no way you ran a 13.1 completely stock. Yes you make a lot of torque, but that still doesnt make up for the almost 100 hp the ls1 has on an L98.

 

dont bring your **** up here

 

huh?

 

Yea, in one way of looking at it, LS1's do generate more hp for how much torque they produce compared to other engines. But, (personal opinion) this shouldn't be put in a negative light. It really depends what you want. If you want a car that will give you satanic launches but not give quite as much top end pull, then go with a torque monster like GN's.. When they run low 12's, they're still only pulling like 105 in the 1/4. This is because they can make, for example, 450rwtq but only 300rwhp(talked to a guy a short while back who pulled those numbers). They are just setup to really be a drag car. On the other hand, if you want a car that still has a considerable amount of torque, but is more aimed towards pulling continually through the gears and rpms) you should look at an engine that never seems to run out of breath like an ls1. In the middle there are of course engines like the TPI and LT1 setups.. The TPI is obviously more of midrange torque setup while the lt1s made a move to flow more air in order to produce more hp. Again, IMO, there are no 'bad' setups.. but depending what an individual wants, they will inherently have relative views that another is not as good. As for me, I like ls1s because they are balanced. They (intake and heads) flow a ton of air to generate lots of hp especially from 4k rpms and up, but still are large displacement motors and don't have anything to apologize for in the way of torque.

To flip your statement around, it could be said that TPI's and LT1s need modifications in breathing (especially in the upper rpms) to generate the same power and ability to pull once rolling. Either way, they both have their own advantages.

As for being too high in the power band, I don't think that's a valid statement at all. It's not good to have peaky power anywhere in the range. What's key is area under the curve. Take ZR1's for example. They redline at 7500 and will of course make the majority of power in the upper range, but they have such a fat power band that they can still get up and go with the best of them.


There is a difference trap speed wise because it takes that much more hp to pull 109 than 104, as our hp ratings show.

Our torque, which I imagine is virtually equal, would point to why the et's are the same.

What I was saying about the second quote, which was taken slightly out of context, was that you were implying I should be somewhere in the mid-high 12 range with my trap speed. Do you mean with an optimal drag suspension setup and/or tires? Show me what STOCK ls1 has pulled that et with that mph and I'll admit I'm a sorry driver. Short of that, I still maintain that my 13.1@109 is right along average for what ls1's do, stock. What a corvette will trap at xx et and what a 98-02 fbody trap for whatever et are not comparable, they are different cars with different suspension setups. That's the same reason why the NHRA has GN's and civics in different classes.



Oops, I was speaking relatively low. Not diesel engine low. So 'low in the rpm range where it is useful' was meant to imply the middle.. i misworded it



By your original post you made it out to be as if your vette and ls1's are equal. They are not. Your car is faster off the line and I'm guessing to the 1/8th mile because of it's suspension setup(again, guessing, it could be tires? but i believe corvettes have a better suspension for launching than f bodies). However, as soon as both cars get rolling, it's the ls1s race. I didn't say from 70mph, or 90mph(like some very large single turbo supras like to do), but from virtually any speed since the ls1 has a significant amount of hp over the TPI engine, it will pull harder.

I would definately not lose a race to you off the line, then win from a roll and claim I am faster.. That would be stupid and *****-like. I was pointing out they are basically equal(my time vs your time) but had different trap speeds, so there is obviously a hp difference between the two.



What can I say.. by all means, if you can drive a 6spd ls1 to mid-high 12's while being stock, you'll have the fastest known time period. No one else has done it, should I have?


I by no means think ls1's are faster than other engines regardless. From the hundreds of times I've read about on the internet, mainly this site, of stock TPI f bodies and less so, corvettes, generally they run 14.0s-14.3s @97-99mph when in good tune. From my 'extensive' knowledge of your car, I'd guess it would take more than an air filter and free mods(my interpretation of 'basically stock') to bring these times down to 13.2's@104. But hell, I just met a guy the other day that ran 13.2@105 in his bone stock lt1 C4, so I do learn something new just about every day.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by mtx28
but i believe corvettes have a better suspension for launching than f bodys

Just about everything you said there is true except for that. The independant rear suspension of the vettes is actually worse for launching than the solid rear axle of the f bodys.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by 25THRSS

Quote:

Originally posted by mtx28
but i believe corvettes have a better suspension for launching than f bodys

Just about everything you said there is true except for that. The independant rear suspension of the vettes is actually worse for launching than the solid rear axle of the f bodys.

Ah, it's often debated at ls1.com(where I'm at mostly) and I'm no suspension expert so I assumed it would be better.. guess not.

In that case, 1.89, if done on street tires and stock converter, is impressive.. good job

 

... Then, you must cut down the tallest tree, with..., a hairing!

Enough of this sillyness

 

one of my buddies has a 97 TA LT1 6-speed and he let me drive it a couple of months ago...all i can say is damn, that thing is fast as hell...it pulls like a bat out of hell. i havent ever driven an LS1, but i can imagine. how much faster is an LS1 compared to an LT1?

 

Never driven an LT1. But my mostly stock LS1 pulls better up top than my IROC. The best my IROC has G-teched is 114.4 MPH, it ran 109.5 MPH at the track. My LS1 G-Teched 116.3 MPH, albeit with about a 1 second slower ET. But my IROC does have suspension mods and drag radials, the TA has the crappy stock tires and no suspension work done yet.