me and my brother are fbody boys for life we love them he has a 93 v-6 right now, because his other one got impounded a 86 camaro. with a 305. that was a long while back
ok
but now he has his camaro and he has this 03 cavalier, which he loves to death cause its his baby. now which would win, he has nothing done, bone stock, execpt a k&n filter

like i have said before, shoot i should just copy and paste.
flowtech headers.
2 1/4 inch duals to rear axle, no cat, no muffler(very loud indeed)
accel plugg wires,
K&N air filter
stock cowl induction
i took off the smog, and a/c belts, and such.
and some new spark plugs i think they are autolights, not sure
i wanted bosch but napa didnt have them last time i ever go to them for pluggs...
and on the way is a accell distruibuter, and possibly some new heads and intake manifold. im thinking edelbrock
2.02/1.60 heads. im trying to get some of these corvette heads from a friend that are 2.02 1.60 double humped heads but hes still sticky to them, smart boy.

tell me what you think guys, i dont think my bro and i are going to runnem ever, we usally dick around on the freeway but thats anyones game..

 

So are you asking which would win between the 93 and the 03?

 

i already raced the 93 and beat him
hard to believe not.. his car has about almost the same power but is low on the tq level (93)

i wanna know about the cavy

 

You know you sure do ask a lot of questions and never race a d*mn thing. How about just go outside race them and then tell us about it!

 

He's talking about his camaro vs. the cavy. otherwise he wouldn't be saying he took of the smog and a/c and that he wants to put double hump heads on it (They are for V-8's)

 

Accel wires are garbage, just like Bosch plugs. Stick with AC Delco. The missing belts probably didnt do anything measureable as far as HP goes, but only made the car miserable to drive in the summer months. Also, I would like to know how your going to fit 2.02" intake valves inside a 3.74" bore of a 305? Not to mention the 64cc chambers will totally kill the already pathetic compression ratio of the LG4.

 

no im talking about my 84 trans am..


my bad about the 2.02 1.60 thanks for info on it.

i dont have a 93 v-6 why the hell would i have asked about 2.02 1.60's good lord.

 

You have a 305, why the hell would you have asked about 2.02 1.60s (before anyone complains, I'm just giving him **** back for giving **** ). Good 305 valve sizes are 1.94, 1.55 or so.

Which motor is in the Cavalier? I believe in '03 there were still a few different options. Is he a 5spd or auto? Some of those cars run mid 15s from the factory and would probably beat you decently, especially from a roll.

 

'03 was the first year for the 140hp Ecotec.

Is the cavy a coupe? A4 or M5? My '05 M5 coupe will beat stock LO3 and LG4 cars. From a dig the advantage goes to the f-body but from a roll 2600lbs and 140hp makes the f-body go bye bye. They can run mid 15's in stock trim. The four door autos will run 16's. www.j-body.org. A K&N filter won't add any power.


You don't want double hump heads. Your stockers are fine.

 

friends don't let friends build 305

i know that is a little mean and there are a few fast 305's but the parts cost the same and you don't get near the improvement

look at most of the fast 305 guys they switched to a 350

 

At the same time, how many people do you know that drop a 350 in car that has LG4 (or other 305) components have cars that run 13s or lower? Probably none, since the extra cubes alone won't make a two/three second quarter mile difference in power output. It's all the parts that go into the engine that determine how much power that engine will make. The 305, although at a disavantage because of it's small bore size, has plenty of potential to make power. It's those crappy 305 components that make it slow, not just the fact that it's a 305.

The best method of making the most power for the least amount of money is to choose parts that will increase the power of the 305, but can also be transferred over to a 350 when the 305 is done with. Examples: Exhaust, heads, intake, and even a cam if so desired. That way, you're not paying for more parts when you do decide to make the switch to a 350 (since all of them are transferrable), and you're still increasing the power output of the 305 that's already in there.

Furthermore, things that don't even go on the engine limit the potential of these cars as well... just bolting a 350 in them won't fix that. Rear end gears, tranny stall convertor, and suspension components all come to mind.

Am I trying to say that the 305 is a great engine, or a 350 is not a better engine? No... I'm just trying to point out the flaw in logic of just bolting in a 350 and expecting way better power output through the 305's parts.

 

i am not saying the 305 is a bad engine ether i am saying don't pull the 305 out rebuild it with high performance parts like forged pistons and such

what i would do is a complete header back exhaust witch he has done then a rpm air gap a good carb then it is time to determine whether you want to throw money into a 305 or do the motor swap

 

When the track opens up in your area, go run your car there and memorize what it runs. That will be a lot more helpful to our estimates than a list of mods.

If the Cavy is a 5 speed, I think you're probably toast. If he's an auto, you should take it from a dig by a car or so.

 

"At the same time, how many people do you know that drop a 350 in car that has LG4 (or other 305) components have cars that run 13s or lower? Probably none, since the extra cubes alone won't make a two/three second quarter mile difference in power output."



i could see a 350 makeing that much of a differnce.it would have to be a good one like a lt1,lsx,l48, (the one that has 300hp and 380ft.lbs,l46 corvette motor.with any of those motors you would see about 3 or more secs drop of those 15-16 sec lg4 cars.

 

Remember the ZZ4 motor?

 

Thank you for proving my point. Not only do those motors have much better supporting parts, all of them have been redesigned to some extend where it would require a lot of modification to drop those in. They are completely different engines with completely different parts.

I am only talking about a SBC Gen I 350

 

Nate86:

Simply dropping a block in there with the 305 heads/cam/intake will give you a slight jump in hp, and alot more tq, but who the hell just dumps a block in there??

At least port/cut the heads, get a bigger cam and use a good intake.

 

i never said i was going to put forge pistons in why the hell would i do that, by the way,my car is running oh 15.5-7 pending on how i hook up, my brothers car is a auto, its a 2 door tho, it has some get up and go for a 4 cyl.. but it lacks the tq that mine has, but who would expect the same tq from that kinda motor which is bone stock... intresting combo on the heads that you gave me i'll look into it. im not sure whether im going to place money into this or just have fun with money and enjoy my car as it stands...

 

Slight, but surely not enough to warrant a ~150 HP boost. That's about what it would take an LG4 car to run high 13 with the right supporting mods.

 

Anyone have an lg4 running high 13's? Be pretty tough dont you think.

 

"I am only talking about a SBC Gen I 350"


the l48 and the l46 drop wright in and go. there both late 60s power house 350s. they dont need anything to work that the stock 305 donst need.

 

a 305 and a 350 are identical on the outside it is nothing for a competent mechanic to swap the motor in a weekend and if you proficient 3-4 hours

 

Alright, apparently you guys are just going to find technicalities in my arguements, so I'm going to address this one final time, and if you still want to argue over it, then I give up.

z28z34man made the comment that anyone looking to build a 305 shouldn't, due to the fact that the 350 would cost the same for parts, but you would get more of an improvement. This is true, but it wasn't the point I was trying to make.

Sure, you could find a 350 block for a cheap price, but then you would have to have it machined and setup by a machine shop (if you wanted the peice of mind of a good, stable block to start your performance build with), and then you would need to find a new set of heads, a better cam, an intake, exhaust, ect. All of this could be added to the 305 while it's in the car, for the same price and you'll improve the 305's power while you're at it. At least then, you'll have a drivable car which can put out some relatively decent power without having to save up money for all new parts to put on the 350 and having your car out of commission till then.

Now let's assume to save some cash, you decide to just throw all the parts from the LG4 at the 350 to have a running car. Sure, your car will run just like before, but you just took on a huge task of swapping over parts, making sure everything works correctly, probably replacing stuff that breaks as you go (I know I usually can't untake a huge project like that without breaking at least one or two things), and you gained what? Maybe a tenth or two in the quarter mile? Pretty unimpressive if you ask me, considering all the work that you just did.

Now you could buy a 350 that's got all kinds of goodies already attached to it. But that 350 is probably also going to cost you more than $50, considering the fact that you are buying an entire working engine, not just a block for the foundation.

The best solution to me seems like the one where I just add go-fast parts to the 305 that can be transferred to the 350 when the 305 either blows up or you decide you need something faster.

And seriously man, how often do you see late 60s model Corvette 350s being sold, especially at a cheap price? What are you going to do about emissions (if you have to worry about that sort of thing)? Let's be realistic here.

 

This thread sucks

 

Only the thing is, the original poster is from Iowa, and in Iowa there is no emissions testing. All this work swapping the parts from the 305 to the 350 would be just as much work as building the 350 and swapping in the car to begin with.

There's nothing wrong with an intake and exhaust mods on a 305, because those are easy to swap, but i wouldnt go into the point of putting a cam into it since 305's generally run smaller cams than 350's. Sure the cam will work in both engines, but once you swap it into the 350, your big 305 cam will only be mild in the 350.

 

i am not looking to make my car a damn 13 second car, if i want that which i do im going to buy a 4th gen LS1 t/a i like my car but i dont want the hassle of building a 350, do you guys realize i have high school, i have work, then on one weekend a month i have national guard drill, i have litteraly 1 day off in the week, there is no way i could put a 350 in on one day, esspically durring the weekend, then when am i sopposed to put it in the summer? i cant i have to go to AIT this summer. we put the headders on in a school night, there was no problem with that, and granted no emmission laws hence the reason why i have dual 2 1/4 inch exhaust comming to the rear axle ZZ28 guy if you see a rusty black trans am that is really ****in loud in the des moines area, then you know who i am!. im seriously not looking to make the damn car a 12-13 second car. thats why they build faster t/a's then mine, i like just dickin around and having some fun parts to do it with, not a whole motor. to all that have stuck up with me on the 305 thanks, and besides HOW MANY 305's Build ups do you see in the world? not many infact its entierly rare to find one of these bad boys? exactly... mine is going to be unique it goes with the body, unique besides the damn thing sat for 6 years. so i have some serious rust issues. and besides, if i wanted a V-8 i would just go and buy one from the guy i know in grimes who has offerd me one for 150 bucks out of a 74 monte carlo. THANKS BUT IM GOING TO KEEP THE ORIGANAL MOTOR IN THE CAR. I HATE PEOPLE THAT GO, i can change the motor in the car, thats like taking the heart and soul out of a person and putting in a new heart and soul, they act completly different.

 

Deep.

 

Ok, so what are you saying here, that everyone should keep they're original motors? I mean you its your car, do what you want. You asked the question, people gave their opinions. Whats the problem, if you want to keep throwing money at your original motor then do it. I have a LO3. It blows. I work full-time, College, Boom there goes 3/4 of my day right there. If your as busy as you say you are, then you should be thankful that your vehicle cranks and gets you to work and back everyday. I'm trying to save up for a built, dependable motor, thats going to make decent power. But for now, I bite the bullet, drive the LO3 and am happy because I have a great looking car, that runs and doesn't give me anything that I can't handle.

 

Yeah, that's pretty much the most stupid thing I've ever heard. If you couldn't change the motor out of a Third gen so easily, no one would ever buy one, even brand new.

Cars don't have heart and soul. They have bolts and oil, nothing more.

 

GREAT point, I applaude you. Im also in Colorado. Steamboat, where u from?

 

.

 

Well, I'll agree that they act different. For example, when I swapped the Oldsmobile 307 out of my Cutlass and put a Chevy 350 in, it magically grew a pair of ***** and was then able to do things like burnouts and sub 20-second quarter mile passes. Considering it's current "heart and soul" came out of a totalled 1985 Suburban, it no doubt has some sort of identity crises.

Somehow, I think you'd find the "heart and soul" of a well built 383 to be much more fun than the "heart and soul" of a built 305. Think of it this way: You've got the bottom of the barrel V8, so there's only one way to go. UP!

I'm not super opposed to building a 305. Tim Burgess and MwNova have some pretty quick cars powered by well built 305s. But I wouldn't rule out a swap in the future. Buying a 4th gen isn't the most economical way into the 12s/13s, given that you already have a thirdgen to build.

 

Well I lived in Golden all my life until about 5 months ago. Now I live in Aurora.


Not taking the motor out of an old POS car is like leaving all the old paint, furniture, carpet, stains, smells of your grandparents house because you don't want to mess with the heart and soul of the house.

 

i was not trying to start **** .im just saying you can pick a good l48 around these parts for $500 running driveing not smokeing ( i did).as a matter a fact i payed $200 for my 1970 c10 it needed a new trans and brakes its factory motor was a 300hp and 380 ft.lbs L48 350 that ran perfect for 5 years of daily driveing .then got a oil leak in the same week my oil pressure gauge went out and that motor spun a bearing.witch when replaced the motor ran fine again and still does.so unless you can get a lg4 305 running 300hp and 380 ft.lbs for $500 then its better to put in a good tree fiddy



sorry for going off-topic everyone .

 

i Am NOT say don't ever put a cam in a 305 i AM saying that if you have intentions of swapping in a 350 like 75% of the people who mod 305 don't bother putting in a cam in the 305

 

you can hit 300 HP with an LG4. Check the member "SittingBull" I think. He has ported heads/cam/intake and bolt ons.

 

did you miss the part where i said. if you can get a lg4 to 300hp and 380 ft.lbs for $500 bucks (with out spray)

$500 bucks being the key number here because if you cant. you can buy a better running longer lasting far better motor like a L48.i was not saying that a lg4 cant have 300hp hell my moms rav 4 with the right ammont of cash can have 300hp




"i Am NOT say don't ever put a cam in a 305 i AM saying that if you have intentions of swapping in a 350 like 75% of the people who mod 305 don't bother putting in a cam in the 305"

y not its a small block cam he can just toss it in th 350

 

Uh yeah you could probably buy another motor but ur statement is rediculous.

Besides, intake = $150 bucks, home port heads, buy new cam and associated small parts. Not much over $500.

 

whats so bad about my staement also.those modds might get a lg4 300hp but it wont have the 380ft.lbs and it wont have the awsome low-end power band and its already modded at this point .when you can put the 350 and modd it later and wow look at the 450hp.


$150 bucks what intake a eldabroke prefromer is like 180 + tax and its not real good the preformer rpm is like 200+ tax what are you buying a used stock intake ?

 

Or you could just get something that comes stock with 300 hp. LG4's only come with 130 hp at the wheels. Thats not much to build on.

 

does anyone else think this is going to get ?

 

 

There was a used performer rpm on ebay a few days ago with a buy it now of $149. I was looking at good deals myself.

You're suggesting that someone go find a rather rare motor (L48) and install it in their car, assuming they can get it for a price of $500 and after all these years it still actually works. That's rediculous. And yes with the right mods a 305 could have very close to 380 ftlbs. I think it would fall a little short but it would be close.

What isn't rediculous is finding a good deal on a 350 short block and investing another $1000 into it to make it fly.