I've been doing some research on what things could be removed from the engine bay to make things simpler and to make some room in there.
Well, some people says this is good, this is bad, and so on...
I thought it might be a good idea to gather all this on one post to see what everyone thinks.
A lot of you guys might say: well that depends on emissions, So let's keep it legal for now, ok? I live in NC and we are one of those places where emissions are still an issue.
So, what stuff can be removed from the engine bay as far as emissions stuff, useless wires, cables, crap, and all those things in our rides that don't even know what they are for???
I've seen also a lot of you who are running upgrades like superram, miniram, HSR. And got a pretty cleaned up engine bay, what did you take off and how did you manage to make it work properly????
By the way I'm running a stock 350 TPI on my 89 GTA
Allright people, time to give feedback!
Thanks for your time on my post.

 

No problem. Federal law prohibits the tampering with or removal of ANY emmissions equipment. Simple and in a nutsell.
Everything in the engine bay has a purpose. About the only thing you might not really need is the cruise control.

 

exactly... if you want to clean it up, its pretty much illegal..

im in SC... no inspections....



about the only really cool cleanup you can do underhood is remove the AC and cruise........ thats about it....


you could clean everything off and make it look all nice... but you arnt going to get that empty but the bare engine look...



does NC have a visual inspection or is it just emmisions?

 

I'm pretty sure we have visuals over here.
I've seen people that have taken out their maf and put a K&N air filter right after the TB, how can this be done and keep it emissions legal??

 

well..

first you would have to convert to SD so that you dont need the MAF...


then you would have to accept the power LOSS during daily driving........ its picking up all the hot air thats coming out of the radaitor, and the underhood hot air....



so not only is it not really a option that makes sence with a MAF car, its also kinda stupid.

 

I'm going to upgrade my engine with AFR 190', LPE cam, SLP headers, and fully ported intake/SLP runners/edelbrock base.
So If I want to keep it emissions legal, can I get rid of the tubes that goon the headers out of each exhaust port?? how about the EGR?? I know it would'nt pass visual, but what if I leave it in place and just unplug it??
This is the kind of deleted things I'm asking for. I know they have to be there, but how are the 18 year old guys at jiffy lube going to know that my EGR isn't plugged?? I've read that even if my EGR isn't plugged, the sniffer test should go just fine.

 

if you have emissions and visual, you cant remove more then AC and power stearing.

 

OK, I get the point on removing the things is illegal.
What I just said on my last post is to just unplug the stuff and leave it there to pass the visual, even though it's unplugged.

 

illegal beleagla... who cares?!?! people do it allt he time so dont worry about it. You can remove all of it if you know someone that can do an "inspection" on the side.

 

Well, if you have to leave it there, you might as well leave it plugged in. You could umplug your egr, but all that would do is throw a code in the ecm, not really a performance improvement. Really, the only performance you could get is by taking your AIR pump belt off.

 

and even then its minimal.....


not to mention.... your cat needs it to operate properly, so you would still fail...... the type of cat you have needs fresh air to workk thats what the air pump does.




so do you want to remain legal? or make it look nice?



the other solution is to make it appear to be dead stock.... you'll notice alot of the resto people that like the car to look like it came from the factory, also live in inspection/emmisions areas...

 

what about vaccum lines? is that illegal, which ones can i remove or plug to clean up the engine ?

 

you're pretty much using all of them already...

its not like there are things stuck under there for no reason.


once more, WHY do you want to do this? for looks? if it is looks, and you make it looks nice, it wont pass visual.

there isnt anyway to "clean up the engine" and still retain 100% legal status.

you could put non emission headers on, a non EGR intake, ditch the cat, ditch the smog pump, use the correct bracket to make it look like the pump was never there, ect.. and then make it all appear stock.... but you wont be "legal"..




whats your point? if its because you think its a PITA to work on, theres ways to work around everything.... theres nothign you cant do to the car with everything on.

 

removing emissions is illegal eh... BAH!






my car is emisions legal for one day a year, can ya guess what day that is? lol

 

If you just start removing items from the engine compartment,
expect the car to start acting up. Most of the parts are required for engine performance.

 

there are things to remve and things tha are obviously meant to be left int he engine bay.

 

If you really want it to look clean, do what you can.

1. paint wheel wells and firewall
2. get new antifreeze catch can and washer bottle
3. re loom all the wire harnesses
4. new vacuum lines
5. Polish everything aluminum under the hood
6 remove A/C
7. Remove P/S. It's really not all that bad unless you do ALOT of city driving
8. Replace your hoses and keep them cleaned up with rubber conditioner
9. prep and paint everything on the engine that you can take off
10. spend alot of time detailing. You'd be surprised what a difference it can make getting all the little crap out of cracks and crevaces.

 

Allright...we dont have any inspection/smog or anything here in Oklahoma.....NOW what can I remove to clean up the bay.......

One catch though - my 350 is going in a '72 Nova.

 

All you really need is the Alt. You can scrap the AC, PS, air pump...*thinking*.... thats it. Crank pulley, WP pulley and Alt.
Now if you want AC, keep it. If you want PS, keep it. You dont need the air pump.

 

carbed?

electrical:
you need the power to the distrib
engine ground strap
tach wire
alt hookup.. for ultra clean, use a 1 wire alt.
if elec fans, you need fan turn on switch wires
elec senders.

vac lines:
vac accessories(air doors ect if equipped)
brakes (if power brakes)
vac advance
EGR (if equipped)

fuel
fuel line. (simple eh?)
you need a filter inline of course, but for the clean look, dont put it underhood.

accessories
alt.
waterpump
PS pump (if equipped)
AC compressor (if equipped)

other then the basic motor itsself, tahts what ya need

 

oh and PCV... you need that.

 

If you live in a state where they do not give visual inspections but do give sniffer tests and you have an RS/firebird then you are in luck. From the factory RS' came with one catalytic converter. If I remember correctly the Z/28 and Trans Am's came with two. You can put real true dual exhaust on the car with two cats. One on each pipe. Get a high flow converter with a good diameter. It has been said that for our cars the catalytic converter will take care of 90-95% of emissions. You can now remove anything you want and still be totally legal. People have done exactly this and passed, time and time again. Your cat. will be needing replaced alot sooner though, say every three years. Because as "Mr.Dude" said our cars cats need some fresh air. Keeping the PCV connected for recircullation without just venting it does not look bad either, it will help out a tiny bit.

 

!EGR
!AIR
!Canister Purge
!Cats
!AC
!PCV
!TB Fresh Air to Valve Cover
!TB Coolant
!Washer Fluid Reservoir
!Cruise Control

Currently !Heat but I have - and will be installing - a non-AC heater box because I like heat

I ran with !PS using an S10 box and hated it. I reinstalled my Power Steering because I like a car that corners easily too.

I just wish that somebody would come out with a way to completely replace the passenger side bracket with just a tensioner. That would clear things up a bit more. Yes, I've seen what people here have done regarding moving the alternator over to the passenger side and chopping the driver's side bracket in half.

Tim

 

i dont want to get into another debate about this, but removing the PCV on anything other then a pure race car is a bad idea.

 

Unless someone offers me an unbeatable deal on my TPI system, I plan on keeping it.

Won't have AC, power steering probably, power brakes maybe, and that's about it. Do I need the coolant overflow tank? Is there a way to remove the EGR and plug the manifold?

 

Mr.Dude... did you swap a honda motor into your vert?

sweet mother of ***.....

and yes, they make EGR block off plates. You can even get them all chromed out for the extra "bling bling" factor.

 

its a acura motor.:lala:

 

I don't care. I did it a long time ago and my motor is still fine ... better in fact than almost all L98's out there.

Tim

 

Acura=Honda.... just thoes gerbals are bigger.

 

When you say "remove," do you mean block off or just vent out into the engine bay?

 

Both. You need to cap the port on the intake manifold and you then install a breather on the valve cover.

Tim

 

Accomplishes the same thing, except it is no longer "positive crankcase ventilation" Just a crankcase vent. The "positive" part was to stop the crankcase fumes from going into the atmosphere.

 

Not to start a debate here..... but......

It was my understanding that PCV also had the added benefit of applying a slight vacuum to the crank case, that promoted better ring seal..........

Seems to me that PCV does not take any hp to run, and actually adds some benefit. Why would you WANT to remove it??????

 

PCV is a good thing. It does NOT cost any horsepower. However, you want to either remove it or put a catch can in-line in situations where oil will get by the PCV and thus be injected into a fresh intake charge. Oil decreases the octane rating of gas DRAMATICALLY. Can you say 'ping city'? My combination demands breathers and not a PCV. AFR heads have horrible oil drainback so oil pools in the valve covers. My motor spins higher PRMs. Put 2 and 2 together and it is easy to see why oil gets by the PCV and into my intake manifold. Ever pull your intake and see the inside of the intake coated with oil? Ja. PCV.

Tim

 

yea... but then i relize that it took my car over 12 years to build up that much... i clean it off and am cool....




btw, if you're running that close on timing on the street, you'er askin for trouble.... i realize you tweek your car alot and can get away with it, but i wouldnt go around reccomending it.

 

That comment makes no sense with regard to what I stated. At high RPMs the heads fill up with oil on the topend due to AFRs crappy oil drainback. Oil seriously changes the octane rating of the intake charge. We are not talking a couple points here. We are talking a lot. Remember what I said about the AFR heads. For my setup several degrees of timing wouldn't make a difference. What you said applies if I only got as much oil as you do. But, I have much more chance of getting oil into the intake AND when I do it is A LOT more than what you would get. Totally different situations ... and I didn't recommend anything so stop twisting my words.

Tim

 

Here in Illinois we dont have a visual. I took off the air pump along along with everything hooked to it. Air tubes, got my headers when I did this, and converter. I also got a A/C delete pully and now have nothing on the passanger side of the engine. Dont have a converter and only put one on hours before I go take emissions. This is off the subject but does anyone know if anywhere makes a supercharger system thats located on the passanger side?

 

What are you talking about? Really now? Illinois as a state does not have emisions checking period. It is not something that the state of Illinois enforces. Are you trying to imply that there is emisions checking in your city/town. If so, I would move to the outskirts of that town. I don't even see how they would be able to do it. By the way, I live in Illinois.

 

Does it go by county then. I live in Dupage county and we have emmisions testing. Your right though because down by Sicamore they dont have emmisions testing. Is it by city or by county?

 

It goes by city population. My town doesnt have it, but all the surrounding ones do. I'm in channahon, Il.

EDIT: It's also by air quality. If you have a plant or something that pollutes a bunch, then you will likely have emissions too.

 

There are currently 10 counties in Illinois that have emissions testing link Here :"Inspection area" means Cook County, DuPage County, Lake County and those portions of Kane, Kendall, Madison, McHenry, Monroe, Will, and St. Clair Counties included in the definition of "affected counties".

I did some research over the past couple of days on the EPA site for the Clean Air Act from what I understand it is a "violation" to remove any emission equipment from your car or to sell one that has had it removed, however it is not a "violation" to buy own or operate a car with the emissions removed unless you have state emissions laws in the area you live in. My conclusion from this is if you live where there is no testing and have a 15 to 20 yr old car it would be next to impossible to tell who or when the emissions were removed so if you have no state laws in effect you are ok.
Clean Air Act Link

 

That expains why all the towns around here have it then. I'm right in the corner of Will. I'll have to tell my buddies they were wrong about the population thing