I took my "Highly Modified TPI" to the dyno today for a dyno tune. Here are the results as promised good, bad or otherwise. The base line was 283RWHP at 5000rpm and 311 RWTQ @ 4600RPM. I now have 304 RWHP at 5000RPM and 334RWTQ @ 4600RPM. That is an increase of 21 RWHP and 23 RWTQ. At the motor that is an increase of 26+HP and 29TQ.

A number of interesting things. I have virtually turned my L98 TPI engine into an LS1. My torque graph is virtually flat just like an LS1. I no longer have the big bell shaped torque graph like on a normal TPI.

The air/fuel ratio started out at 14:1 on the first run and was at one point down in the low 12's:1 as Kevin was dialing in the A/F ratio. The amazing thing was the power never changed more than 5HP or torque through all 10 dyno pulls while adjusting the fuel air ratio. With the 12:1 ratio it got as low as 299+HP. So from this I would gather that the increase in the peak power above was virtually from the runner mods alone. What the tuning did do was improve the graph below the peak by smoothing things out so there were no dips in power. This raised the average power across the band. The airfuel ratio is also now smooth all the way across at about 13.3:1.

After about 10 dyno pulls the engine was getting pretty heat soaked so there may have been a little more power in it than shown. It did hold up well though.

I have an MSD 6A ignition module and we wanted to see how much power was generated by it. It was disconnected for one pull with nothing else changed. The power dropped from 302 to 300 from the previous pull. Then went back up on the next pull. So I would have to say it is worth around 2RWHP. Now one thing that did happen was my graph got a little choppy again with dips with the MSD disconnected. So it did smooth things out across the graph and I would have to say helped the average power somewhat.

Figuring a 20% power loss for the 700R4 transmission I'm now at 380 HP and and 417 ft/lbs torque at the motor. This is with a TPI system allthough modified and a 350 engine. Now where to find 20 more HP to get to 400HP. By the way I'm running a ZZ9 style cam and it idles very nicely at 700RPM with great street manners. I want to thank Kevin and Dyno Don Lorentzen for the tuning and help today. Dyno Don built the motor for me. Allen

Edit: I forgot to say that the dyno pulls were with the airfilter and everything in place just as I drove it in off the street.

 

Wow, that'e really very impressive with a TPI-style intake. Could you list all your engine specs, for those of us who may not be familiar with your combination?

 

Hi Damon

I will post the big items and work my way back starting with the airfilter.

1. K&N RE-0920 Air Filter.
2. Custom Cold air intake with 3.5 inch tubing and an LT1 elbow. With a MAF stuck in the middle. Screens and fins removed on MAF.
3. 52MM throttle body which actually measures 50.8MM.
4. Modified factory TPI plenum. See pictures in other post.
5. Modified SLP TPI runners. See pictures in other post.
6. Edelbrock TPI manifold, Extrude Honed, 1.70" runners.
7. Trickflow 23 degree heads.
8. ZZ9 style cam and 1.6 roller rockers.
9. SLP 1 5/8" Tri-Y headers.
10. Dyno Don custom exhaust mandrel bent with dual cats. 2 1/2 inch to the cats from the headers. 2 1/2 inch to the custom Y pipe from the cats. Then 3 inch back to the SLP muffler from the Y pipe.
11. 700R4 transmission with a B&M governor kit. Set up to shift at 6000RPM in the 1-2 shift and 5600 in the 2-3 shift.
12. Nine bolt rear end with 3.70 gears.

Edit: I have 10.5:1 compression with Kieth Black Hyper Eutectic pistons. Otherwise stock lower end. Completely smog legal for California as tested.
Edit: I forgot to add the SLP 2400rpm torque converter.

 

You are my hero.

 

Nice

Not a bad setup at all.

Do u have some more pictures of your runners and any in process as u cut and welded them to shape?

 

thats pertty damn good with the TPI, ever think about looking into a LT1 type intake? that should get you up the 400+ like you wanted, you can keep a nice flat TQ line too

 

Link to the modded runner page:
https://www.thirdgen.org/techbb2/sho...14#post2216114

 

Nice numbers you are putting down ls1 power! IM surprised your torque peak was at that high of an rpm. Can you post a pic of the graph?

What kinda timing numbers are you running with those heads? At wot and cruise areas?

 

Wow! I have been following this from the other thread. Those are some great numbers from a LTR system with TFS heads.

How do the earlier SLP runners differ from the later versions? Would it make a difference if one planned a similar modification?

 

Hi All

I'm trying to reach 400HP "at the motor" with the TPI setup. I do not have any pictures of the runners in progress.

Basically what I did was mill out 1.5 inches between the two runners using the top bolt as the center point. In install a piece of 1.5"x2"x2" piece of 60-61 aluminum block in that spot. I also made up a spacer for the lower center bolt hole that was around 5/8" in diameter and 2 1/2 inches long. I drilled out the center with a "P" drill bit. I believe I had to enlarge it slightly later. All this was welded in place. I also made up some squares to weld on top of the plenum and runners to relocate the top center bolt.

I have a table mill and I hogged out the aluminum to the shape you see in the picture. Be sure to leave the mounting holes for the gaskets. Makes it so much easier to install. Also leave the contours on the plenum side to match the gasket mounting holes.

I will try to post the graph. I will also post pictures of the finished product installed in the car.

 

Here is a picture of the TPI installed in the car.

 

The Dyno graphs that I have are to large to post. I don't know how to down size them. I have the baseline graph, the one with the highest numbers and then the last one with the best overall. I will email them to someone who knows how to down size them and then post. By the way these are SAE corrected. The uncorrected show higher numbers. Allen

 

I would down size them but I have trouble with that myself.

Allen..so what are you running as far as total timing goes? At wot and cruise?

 

We played with the timing some along the way and went up to around 33 degrees total. Low was 29.2. It did not make a bit of difference to the power. At the final run it was 31 degrees and that is where it was left. Probably should have dropped it back a degree as nothing was changing. Do that next time.

At 70MPH just cruising along its at 28.1 reading off the datamaster during the dyno run. I would have to do a scan going down the freeway to get a more accurate reading.

Same with the airfuel ratio. There was only 5 HP difference between the low 12's:1 and 14:1. Strangest thing. The first reading and the highest recorded power output was at 14:1. We thought that we would gain HP as we got closer to 13:1. Not so, as it hardly changed. Allen

 

You can Email the graphs to me, I'll resize 'em.

c28@triad.rr.com

 

Here's Allen first pull. It's the baseline.

 

Here's the 6th pull.

 

...and the final pull.

I'll let Allen give you the play by play!

 

Thanks Abubaca for posting my dyno pulls.

The first one 001 is the base line before I highly modified my runners and was done on 12/23/04. I did 3 pulls that day and lost a horsepower with each pull as the engine warmed up.

Pull number 006 is actually the 3rd pull of the day 3/5/05 with the airfuel ratio at 14:1. We were trying to go as low in the rpm range as posible without the transmission downshifting into 2nd gear but you can see the results. It also had the highest numbers but peaky. It was at this point that we started the tune.

Run number 014 was the last pull of the day and the eleventh for the day. The motor was getting pretty warm at this point and I suspect a few more HP would have shown up if the motor had been cooler. We decided to call it a day after this pull as not much if anything was happening with the airfuel ratio change or timing changes. Also my wallet was getting lighter as time went by.

If you compare pull 001 with pull 014 you can see power was way up across the rpm band. Run 014 is what is now in the car. Looking for high 12's next time out at California Raceway on April 8. Then the Yank SS3600 Torque Converter will be installed and we will see what happens. This will occur in time for the May races. Allen

 

Having used SLP runners several times myself and having also matched the plenum to them (I found they don't work well without that modification) I THOUGHT I was going to be prepared to see your intake runner setup and I THOUGHT it was going to look like mine used to. My eyeballs almost fell out of my head after seeing the pictures until I read that quote above. Certainly explains a lot.

I agree that part of the "magic" of your combo is that you have effectively shortened the runners and increased plenum volume vs. a "stock" or "near stock" setup.

 

NICE!! anybody know the specs on the ZZ9 cam?

 

Here are the specs on my cam. It was ground by Chet Herbert cams around 1991. It is very close to the ZZ9 and that is why I call it that.


212 on the intake and 224 on the exhaust at .050". Lift is .486" and .495" with 1.5 rockers. With the 1.6 rockers I'm using the lift is .518" and .528". LSA is 112 degrees.

It idles quite nicely with very good street manners and there is nothing wild about it. Allen

 

I think you may be giving too much credit to the 700 and DT losses...I'd say you're at or above 400 on the motor right now.

 

Hi 8Mike9

You may have something there as I forgot to mention that I have an SLP 2400RPM torque converter. I don't know how efficient it is but say its 2% less than a stock one then I'm loosing a few horsepower compared to a stock converter at the rear wheels. I added that fact about the converter to my engine setup chart in my above post. Allen

 

damn i forgot about Chet Herbert and his shop..

his family and my parents are good friends.. i should have called him for a cam..

oh well.. guess i'll have to deal with my LT4 Hot Cam and 1.6rr


good results Allen.. is that the ballpark you were expecting? or were you hoping for higher?

 

Hi Killjoy

The results are a little more than I expected especially on the torque side. The rise in the torque across the board was a lot more than I expected. I was hoping for maybe 15 on the HP with luck and thought there was a posibility I might loose some bottom end on the torque or just stay even.

I was willing to loose a little on the bottom because of the traction problems I have anyways. When I install the Yank SS3600 torque converter for the May runs at Fontana I will really have to light up the MT ET Streets to get them to hook good.

I will be looking forward to you and your car being out there again. Maybe Brandon will make it this time. Allen

 

Very impressive... I hope my engine does as well or a tad better. I have a cam very simular to yours ( 212/224 .483/.510 ) AFR 195cc heads, edelbrock base and runners, 10.6:1 compression...
Now the kicker is, I have more cubes, since my engine is a 383.

I am hoping I can make a little over 400 at the crank, then I can go from there.

So you passed smog with it? How was it? Did it pass easily? I'm in Cali also, so that's why I'm asking... Do you guys do the dyno/SMOG2 thing too?

 

Howdy

You should have be able to get 400hp at the crank with your setup. BrandonCali dyno'd 352RWHP on his 383 with Vortec heads and a ZZ4 cam but with the Accel Superram and Speed Density. That works out to 414hp at the crank as he has a 700R4. He has tons of torque but I don't remember the figures.

Mine was dyno'd fully smog legal and with the air filter in place. No tricks and SAE numbers just as I drove it in off the street. By the way your cam is a dead ringer for mine. The compression is virtually the same and your heads may be a tad better.

No problem passing smog. I have made a few mods since my last smog check but nothing that would make me fail. One thing I did do that will help the smog test is I had a heated O2 sensor installed. If you run headers your O2 sensor may or may not be running at the optimum. A heated sensor will guarantee it. Allen

 

you should consider yourself an inovator in tpi setups. hail. my question is what is done to the bottem end of the intake. did you siamese the manifold? i heard this creates turbulance. what about the lower end of the slp runners? i'd love to see some pics if possible, thanks brandon

 

Nothing was done to the manifold except to open it up to 1.70 inches. In about a week Dyno Don will be installing my new long block and that will give me a chance to tidy things up a bit. I will then gasket match the openings. There may be a little turbulance but I will fix that this time around. I did not remove the intake on the last go around when I modified the runners and plenum.

Here is a link to some pictures. By the way I will modify the SLP runners even more when I mate them up to the First TPI intake manifold. https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/tpi/...ml#post2216114