chucks_net

I'm converting the 305 fuel system to handle the crate 350

Plenum and tubes must be removes completely





Got these injectors from southbayfuelinjectors.com for under $250



Ultrasonic cleaning for the TB




Old injectors clean and ready for the next person who needs a set of 19lb



Intake tubes ultrasonically cleaned





And powder coated RED -not sure why it came out orange in the pic



RED!

chucks_net

Done -runs so much better... running the stock map + changed the engine size to 350/ 713 cc and injector size to 27lb.

I also cleaned/ powdercoated the intake tubes and plenum

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Looking good , glad your making progress on the tuning as well.

chucks_net

Brian you were an amazing help. Thank you very much. I look forward to the chance to return the favor!

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Thanks chuck, feel free to pm me as you go. Sounds like you have made great progress in this last week

GreenieG

how much was the intake kit thing you got on there? and do you have to do anything to the car to be able to use it?

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Tuned port speed density will allow the use of a cone style air filter on the throttle body.
This is k&n rc5000.

GreenieG

oh okay, so since i have MAF theres no way i can do what you have? I want an intake kit but not one of those bigger ones cuz i wanna try to clear up the engine bay or am i just gonna have to suck it up and get the bigger ones?

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

You might be able to modify a kit like this or relocate your battery to the rear of the car.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/PONTIAC-FIRE...-/220755728103

GreenieG

are there kits for mine that don't involve any relocating or anything like that?

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Im not sure that there is, do a google search or start a thread. This doesnt have anything related to the op.

http://www.hawksthirdgenparts.com/pr...Air-Boxes.html

chucks_net

I'll be studying speed density and MAF systems this week

from moates.net


MAF theory: http://support.moates.net/theory-mass-air-flow/

Speed density theory: http://support.moates.net/theory-speed-density/

chucks_net

the K&N cone was not put on by me. I don't like how warm air can get into my intake from the line. Probably because of the big 6" induction hood and the former owner thinking that cool air will be induced somehow????

cant see **** with this hood but it looks cool :/

ASE doc

The factory air filter lid that I see in your pic can be modified to flow alot more air. Enough to support alot of motor. Since your SD, you don't worry about the MAF and use a 4" hose to connect the modified lid to the TB. There is a thread on this forum titled "high flow air lid" that details the process. I did it along with ram air boxes and the difference is very noticable.

chucks_net

SD/ MAP doesnt deal with air temp changes as readily as MAF. Just having that cone filter makes it difficult to set up my fuel ratio/ BLM as speed drastically effects the air temp.

That intake is in FRONT of the radiator for a reason

ASE doc

There is an intake air temp fuel correction table in the factory ECM. My ACCEL DFI also has that. Even with my extensively modified engine, I don't have any problem with air temp/speed. My engine loves the extra air supplied by the ram air and high flow lid. If you look at my photo and read my sig, you'll see that mine is SD also. My engine is built about as far as TPI can go.

chucks_net

I'm finding that the engine bay temps are messing with my tune

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Time to buy a 90-92 camaro tipi bellows.

VincentZ28

iTrader: (2)

Why did you use 27lbs injectors in a stock 350?

chucks_net

Its not stock

rods, pistons, cams, heads, headers -all done

Johnny Blaze

iTrader: (15)

What compression/cam/heads are you running?

chucks_net

The 27lb were the same price as the 24lb. With the 27lb I have more control over the spray and can turn down the pulse width and use 43.5psi on my fuel rail.


9.1:1

Installed camshafts are hydraulic flat tappet with .435 in. intake lift and .460 in exhaust lift with 212 degree open duration intake and 222 degree open duration exhaust lobes at .050 in. ground with a 112.5 lobe centerline. Cylinder heads are Vortec cast iron style with 64cc chambers; 170cc intake runners with 1.94 in. intake valves and 1.50 in. exhaust valves.

ASE doc

It's that hot, oxygen poor, underhood air. The air filter lid mod isn't easy but after having done it, I definitely recommend it. Do a search and you'll find lots of information. One member did a very good job and even offered modified boxes for sale. I just did my own, following his method. It took several hours and the two part cement is pricey but I am very happy that I did it.

I ran my extensively modified 355 TPI through the stock lid with a 2.75" id pipe in place of the MAF, for years. I had removed the baffles from the filter boxes for increased air flow but it was still not nearly enough. I resisted using a filter like yours because I know from years of building carbed engines with open air filters that they don't work very well. Maybe if you built a box around it to isolate it from the hot air and route in cool air from the hood somehow?

I finally went ahead and built the high flow air lid. I found I could increase height through the thinnest area(over the radiator support) by 5/8". That and the 4" outlet make for a huge improvement in airflow. I have watched for any leaning out of the AFR at high speeds on my wide band O2 AFR gauge, both in cold air and hot air. I have not seen any real issue. (this morning it's cool out and the motor ran like a very happy beast on one full throttle trip through the gears to 100mph). If there is a difference it's less than one percent. As you study tuning, you'll learn that engines are quite forgiving of a few tenths rich from the ideal of about 12.5:1. I just run mine at the high 11s to low 12s and this leaves room for error.

chucks_net

Completely agree.

Today its cool and I'm throwing MAP high, TPS high, and O2 Rich. But only while driving above 50mph low RPM. On a 60 degree day she throws no codes. My tune is on a warm day rolling around at 40mph. I'm sure I can tune around these codes but I want my ECU to perform as few calculations as possible.

My first step is to get cool air in. I'm shopping for intakes and researching mods.

I'm curious to see how the stock intake effects the changes to manifold pressure and overall fuel ratio.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

The cold air will not affect the map reading but will greatly effect the mat reading.

chucks_net

Just drove it in the warmer afternoon air and all is good!

Just ordered new tires for her


All the GM TPI documentation I have found points to air temp fluctuations being hard to manage.

chucks_net

I want to see if the air dams along with the stock intake have a "RAM Air" effect

ASE doc

I dont see how the stock air intake system would produce any positive pressure, or "ram air" effect without ducts to force air into the filter housings. The openings where the factory fog lights are mounted are well placed for this purpose. It took a few hours to fabricate ducts from aluminum sheet that seal between these openings and the air filter frames. There is a good deal of pressure at these openings which is routed to the air filters through the ram air ducts. 1Bad91Z, who's design I borrowed from, measured .3 bar at 100mph. That's not huge pressure, but certainly better than sucking air from behind the front fascia.

As far as MAT correction is concerned, I see you have your MAT sensor mounted in the rear of the plenum just like mine is. GM did this in order to include the effect of underhood heat on plenum air temp in MAT correction. I have seen later models with the MAT sensor mounted in the air filter lid where it would do a much better job of measuring actual inlet air temp.

As far as underhood heat and its effect on plenum temp. I did two things to help this. First, I installed a 160f thermostat. It works well for me since I can set fan on temp and program around the lower operating temp in my ACCEL DFI ECM. With tunerpro, you should be able to do the same. My fan on temp, dual fans, is 179f. Then, I turned the fake factory hood louvers into functional hood louvers by carefully drilling the plastic pieces with progressively larger drills to match the size of each louver. I cut openings in the hood beneath the louvers in a pattern that actually looks pretty clean. On a hot day with the engine idling and fans on, you can feel the warm air venting from the louvers. I can lay my hands on the plenum, with the engine at operating temp and it is just warm, not hot.

The next thing I should do is move the MAT sensor to the filter lid. So far though, I haven't seen that much of an issue, maybe keeping the plenum cool makes the difference.

chucks_net

ASE doc -good stuff!

I really appreciate all the advice and sharing your experience. That puts me way ahead from an R&D perspective.

ASE doc

I apologize for spreading misinformation. I was concerned because I couldn't remember the exact number from 1Bad91's test, so I looked it up. It was 107Kpa. 100Kpa is atmosphere, or neutral pressure. 107Kpa means 7Kpa positive pressure, which is right at 1psi. Like I said, not alot of pressure but definitely better than nothing.

Just for the sake of being thorough, atmosphere is 14.3 psi. This is stated a few different ways such as 1 BAR, or 100Kilopaskils(Kpa). Anything below 14.3 psi, 100Kpa, 1 BAR is considered vacuum, or negative pressure. Anything above this point is positive pressure.

2012sergen11

iTrader: (1)

Hey sorry to jump in on this thread but I am looking for a set of injectors for my 87 tpi and was wondering if you were selling those 19lb injectors
thanks

chucks_net

Yep $50

2012sergen11

iTrader: (1)

How much would it cost for shipping to 44256?

chucks_net

$6

2012sergen11

iTrader: (1)

I have only purchased items through ebay so I am not sure how payment would work for these, let me know how I would send you payment or if you work with ebay at all to list them as buyitnow just let me know
also you said you did clean these injectors after taking them out correct?

chucks_net

yes, freshly cleaned

If you have a paypal account them message me and we will arrange payment/ delivery via paypal