The Service Engine Soon light comes on at low rpms then goes away at higher rpms. The car is very sluggish and bogs down badly if left in Drive on the trans. To get it moving so-so have to shift from 1st, to 2nd, etc. Trans was rebuilt last year. Not sure that is problem. Just lately, cool weather?, the car is bogging down. Seems to be running rich. We changed the fuel filter recently so that should be ok too. I have not checked the codes yet on the diagnostic (paper clip method). The only mods to this car is the catback system - which is not new.

Never has seemed to have real good get up and go but this is even worse! Hope to share this with those out there who may be the Guru's of this type of beast. :hail:

Suggestions are welcome. Not expecting Big Power but just a decent running vehicle. Engine seems to rev well...... For some reason though it wants to idle high. Have not found any vacuum leaks (yet) but definately hear a "hissing" inside around the heater control area. This has been going on for a while.

Appreciate your helpful suggestions.

Oh, one other thing - there is a serpentine belt that goes around the alternator, idler, etc. It is a Goodyear brand. It squeals a lot but seems to work ok otherwise. I have bought other belts, general economy type and premium type (from Kragen) but the sides of the belt get torn up. Eventually a "rib" usually comes off say within a week!. Everyone at the Kragen says that 1) I don't know how to put on a belt, or 2) there are burrs on the pully/idler. I haven't found any burrs and I have been putting belts on engines for at least 20 years. So far so good with belt replacement. If there are burrs or my lack of installation smarts it would seem to have to affect the "old" Goodyear belt as well. It doesn't seem to. Need help!

 

You need to go to a parts store and have them see what code it is throwing. Check to make sure the Oxy sensor is making a good connection. I think that if this goes out it causes our engines to run rich. As far as transmissions goes I dont like automatics and therefore do not own one. Just my preference. There are so many sensors on this little 2.8 it is crazy and I cant remember which ones do what without my book in front of me.

-Buck

 

Used the paper clip diagnostic and found out that it was/is showing a code 22 fault. "low voltage at throttle position sensor OR Fuel cutoff relay circuit open or shorted to ground.

Ok... That is only code that came up.

Any comments on repair?

 

So, then you need to check the TPS sensor, (passenger side of the Throttle Body) with a voltmeter. You stick the "nodes" into the plug of the TPS sensor, top two IIRC. Then monitor the voltage as you slowly and steadily open the TB. the numbers should increase at a steady rate. A search on here can show you the exact numbers, but I think it is supposed to start at something like .74v and rise to 4.5 or higher. (Check that though to make sure)

You can adjust it by loosening the screws that hold the TPS onto the throttle body, and rotating the sensor itself until it reads the correct numbers.

Also, if it doesn't increase in voltage steadily I think thats an indicator that the sensor is bad.

One more thing, DON"T DO THIS WITH THE CAR RUNNING, while I suppose it could be done, I don't know if it is such a good idea. Just turn the key forward and you can do it with no problem

 

It needs to be set at 0.55 volts give or take 0.005 volts. ( Per my Haynes manual ) And this is with it in the resting postion. And just like Damien said do it with the key on, engine off.

You do this by making three jumper wires that will go from the TPS to the harness and you are going to be testing the top two. Once you have this set at 0.55 volts and you open the butterfly, the voltage should increase steadily until about 4.5 or 5 volts. If it stays at one voltage and you are still opening the butterfly and then jumps all of a sudden ( and test it many times to make sure ) then maybe the TPS is bad. But it sounds like the TPS may just be out of adjustment. Good Luck. And give us updates on your progress.

-Buck

 

My voltmeter has long pointed ends, so it was easier for me to leave it connected and squeze the probes through the backside of the plug. It seemed far more stable than with the jumper wires, but that was me. Do whatever is easier for you

 

I just said that to use the jumper wires cause i have alligator clips, sorry, forgot to mention that. Good call Damien.

-Buck

 

First of all I want to thank everyone for your shared information. I really appreciate your help! Thanks for your patience as well to my meager descriptions on what the troubles were.



I checked the resistence first on the TPS. I read somewhere that the correct amount is supposed to be around 10k ohms. I am assuming this amount is in the open(?) position. 1 probe in the middle socket and the other probe in either the top or bottom socket...it didn't matter.

In any case here is what I came up with in testing the TPS:
closed resistence - 1.96 kilo-ohms
WOT resistence - 4.87 kilo-ohms

Ok - On to voltage.

Probes in the top two slots, tps connected to the harness, ignition on, engine not running:

Originally: Closed - 0.46 volts
WOT - 4.41 volts

Adjusted to: Closed - 0.78 volts
WOT - 4.79 volts

In all cases of moving the throttle, slowly, from closed to WOT the readings were gradual with no "jumps". I know that the Haynes manual indicated that 0.54/0.55 volts is correct but I wasn't able to get much past 4.5 volts on the WOT. So, perhaps it is set a bit high. I did not have any codes pop up though. I noticed when sitting at idle prior to adjustment the SES light would come on and the Code 22 is shown. We did not clear the codes, however, when idling with the new adjustment the light did not or has not come on. Did it work? maybe.

Will run it for a while and see if any codes pop up.

While we are here, anyone given any further thought to the other portion of my original question(s) as to the belt dilimma?

Thanks again for your help.

 

I assume you checked to make sure it isn't rubbing on anything? I've heard of using belt dressing, crayon, or soap to stop the squealing. Kind of a band-aid though...

 

Just take the belt off and make sure all the pulleys are even and make sure everything is bolted on correctly and tight. Other than that I would not know what to check without being there to look at it. And by the way make sure that the two small coolant lines that are coming out of the TB into the intake tube, make sure that they are not bent. Just maybe they are getting into your belt when you are driving down the road and taking that rib off your belt.

-Buck

 

No Damien,
I have not found any place where the belt seems to be rubbing. I took off the original Goodyear belt because it was squealing and thought that a standard (Kragen) serpentine belt would be fine. In two days I had one of the edges peal the cord/rib. So, I put the original belt on. Noisy - but no rips or tears. Went back down to Kragen - bought a premium belt. I put it on. It lasted about 4 days. Same problem. I took it back to Kragen and told them. They said that I probably didn't put the belt on right or it's rubbing against something/pulley has a burr. I rn my hand over all of the pulleys, idlers, etc. No burrs. I figured that I put the belt on ok because the old "soap it as you need to" Goodyear belt " was working ok. Belt dressing works - for a little while as does soap. The thing about it is that in a normal day the car gets driven about 4 miles - home to school and back. That means that my son is going thru belts about every 15 miles. Yet the old Goodyear, original belt that came with the car two years ago has been ok - except it squeals some and the underside is beginning to crack. I don't know how long it was on the car prior to our purchase. I have not tried a Gates belt yet. I'm kinda stumped. Seems if there is a burr or rubbing that it would affect any belt high quality, low quality, brand A or brand B.

 

One other thing i just thought of, have you checked to see if the tensionor bearing is going out. It would make the belt wobble and squeal and it may not be noticeable until you get the belt off and get the pressure off of it, try to move it back and forth.

-Buck

 

Could it be that you are getting the wrong type of belt? I haven't bought too many belts, but could it have too many, or not enough ridges in it and be hitting the side of a pulley?

Although it would be wise to check the tensioner, I would think the belt has probably just lenghtened that much to where it is loose. However, if it is wobbling, with the wobble could it be hitting something?

 

You may be on to something here Damien. ( to the auther ) What pulleys are you running? Do you have the A.I.R. pump, if you dont and you are buying a belt for a car that does then yes the belt would be to long and the tensionor would not tighten it up enough.

-Buck