Well i got a ws6 parts car and i would like to upgrade the v6 suspension with the ws6 one which parts off the car should i use. People in the suspension board said sway bars and springs but i thought we shouldnt use v8 springs on a v6. I figured the v6 experts would kno better then them. This would be a perfect question for dean were has he been?

 

swap the rear springs, and the frnt/rear swaybar. u can use the fronts but ud have to cut the v8 springs down 1 coil i think.

 

Technically, you shouldnt use the v8 springs because not only will you have to cut them down to level the car. They are a stiffer rate and will not necessarly be matched to the rear.

However, everyones desire, needs, and driving style are different. You may find them v8 springs great, while others wouldnt. Same with the swaybars.


Swap over the wonderbar if it has one
I belive that should have the faster ratio gear box.
Does it have the 1le breaks? If so, swap them.

 

Yeah i dont wanna cut springs but i want a car that will handle good and take turns at high speeds so should i use the sway bars atleast and it doesnt have the 1le brakes or wonder bar just suspension.

 

green when i did my 1le conversion i droped in the rear springs/swaybar frnt swaybar and wonderbar, the car handled very good, but it worled alot better once i droped in the heavy dudty front struts and 3 way adj drag shocks in the rear, the ce enginering shocks are great for handling set to firm extra firm tends to lead the inside tire spinning on a turn unless u have a posi

 

i think im gonna just use the sway bars are the 87 performance suspension formulas have 36mm and 24mm bars? I wanna buy new sway bar bushings and links when i strip them.

 

do NOT use the v8 springs. i had some v8 springs on there by mistake. it was nuts. my skull damn near shattered everytime i went over a bump. it ruined the ride quality of my car. i ordered some TRW springs ment for the v6 to replce them. verry happy with those. as for the WS6 sway bars hell yes. my v6 had 34/24 combo. not quite as big as thw 36/24 WS6 combo, but it was pretty nice. body roll was not an issue. the handling of my V6 kicked so much ***. my GTA is not as good in comparison, and it is a WS6 car. there is somthing to be said of the balance of these 60*V6 equiped cars.

 

91Greenbird,
Dean here, I signed on temprarly to answer you question and will be removed and banned soon- go figure- just for helping.

Anyways, you can NOT get a car to handle decent with "V6 "spring rates. So called V8 srpings (rates compatable to V8's) start to get you into the decent handling range to control weight transfer in transitioning fore & aft, and left & right.

What I would recommend (I have stiffer than this and my wife drives this car daily) is to buy the Eibach prokit which is about 1" lower on most V8 cars in the front, and IDENTICAL height at about 1" lower in the rear of V6 cars as well as V8 cars- there is vitually no difference in rear car weight.
NOIW- That prokit V8 spring will sit you at about stock height on a V6 engine weight where as a V8 engine weight will sit it at the intended 1" aprox drop- so, trim off about 3/4 of the top coil to begin with and reinstall. This will also slightly increase the front spring rate more than the prokit spring in original form (about 40lb aprox increase) YOU WILL NEED TO FIRST BUY VERY GOOD RAODRACE VALVING TYPE STRUTS AND SHOCKS FOR THE INCREASE SPRING RATES OF ANY PERFOMANCE SPRING ON ANY CAR< ESPECIALLY ON A LIGHTER WEIGHT V6 NOSE.(I highlighted this last phrase for emphisis of IMPORTANCE to control the rebound force of the higher spring frequency)

So now with the fronts and rears springs in place, if needed to taylor the ride height just a bit more, trim the rears just a tad off the tops (non-pigtail side) to desired ride height.(probably not necessary unless you are going into the weeds like my car- but I have very stiff rates and very firm valving for any thirdgen regardless of V6 or V8.

Here's the next important part to know. Since the nose of a V6 is lighter weight AND you are also now running slightly higher rate front spring in proportion to the rear since the prokit was trimmed, you can AND SHOULD now run a larger rear swaybar to compensate than what V8 cars can run. We can run larger rear bars because the engine weight in the front being less does not roll the front as much and thus does not lift the inside rear wheel as much as a heavier nosed V8 car will.

This is all in the realm of suspension modifications just baby steps in first modifications- much much more needs to be added after this point to get the geometry in tuned for all out handling- this is a very very good foundation of a starting point in a V6 car. I would recommend using a 34mm front bar and a 24mm rear bar (factory bars- hollow) I run solid bars which are much firmer and use a 34mm front and 25mm rear with SFC's which I would need a 23mm rear without "extensive" modifications to the chassis and suspension that I have done to allow it.

There is an old saying that I have actually seen someone else quote around here in their signiture that really applies to the aboe posts. That saying goes something like," You are only as knowledgeable as what you have tried, you do not know how good better can be until you actually experience it." Trust me, I know what a third gen can do in the handling department like nobody else here and have proven this a few times to a few different members that walked away scratching their heads.

See Ya, Dean
BANNNNNNED
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I dont kno what mm the sway bars are on the 87 formula but i heard that all formulas have ws6 and it does have a performance suspension badging but should i use the ws6 sway bars on my v6 bird??

 

I would use both the springs and the swaybars. Try trimming about one full top coil of the front springs to start with (depends hopw low you want to go. I would not recommend taking off any lower ride height than 1 1/2 -2 coils cut off, they are not stiff enough coils for running that low even though the rate increases with cutting- it just doesn't increase enough to keep suspension travel to a minimum to keep from grounding out), but again, you'll need better shocks and struts. may be able to get away with some KYB-2's but I would highly recommend Koni Yellows. If you want to handle? Save your money and spend if on Koni Yellows if you do nothing else-They are THAT important in handling.

By all means use the swaybars also, they are most likely the 36mm/24mm combo since the car is a WS6. Nothing else on the car is worth messing with, aftermarket products are far superior to anything factory except the swaybars- also chewck the steering box for a quick ratio 2 1/4 turn lock to lock.

Edit: also please note that ever car weight is different even from V8 to V8 comparison (see weight charts here: https://www.thirdgen.org/forums/suspension-chassis/352407-have-build-sheet-invoice.html ) I'm the 87 RS V6 on there with the factory nose weight of 1722#'s Those are my 'factory' bias %'s, not my current modified %'s. I have not ever had this car on scales, but I would guess it to be close to mid-53% range in the front currently.

WS6 Spings aren't really anything on a heavy WS6 car that weighed approx 3500lbs or close to about 2100Lbs on the nose, we are about 1700 range. They are fairly decent "street performance" springs for a non-WS6 V8 car weighing about 1950 range in the fronts, but still not good for autox. They are a good rate for our lightweight V6's for autox, but not high enough for roadracing even cut to slightly higher frequency and rate. In conclusion, just be patient and trim 1 full coil first then install and drive around the block- see where they sit ride height wise, then be prepared to take them back out and trim amybe another one or two times in 1/4 coil increments to get it to the exact desired ride height- then have the car aligned professionally.

If I recall, WS6 springs have a rate of about 650lbs uncut, and about nearing 700 cut down a bit. Prokits are in the 725 # range. I run 800 # springs cut slighlty and are probably around 825-840 range and some stiffer compression rate Koni Yellows. V8 cars stripped of interior weight (lightened for racing) run ranghes of 950- 1100# rates for road courses so you know for comparison sake what a true stiff racing spring is on these cars with V8's. V6 racing rates woulkd range from about 750-950 range from autox to roadracing setups(You'll need high rebound rate Koni Yellows)

 

Dean brings up a good point with that "only as knowledgable as what you have tried thing". the v8 springs i had were brand spanking new. so they had no sag. so my experiance would be different then yours. i was also doing them with "streetable daily driver / comfortable ride" being priority one, and "best handling thirdgen ever" being priority two. so my recomendation of "hell no" reflects that goal. if you are setting somthing up for a race application my advice does not realy qualify. i will however say that for a "comfortable ride" car.. my v6 bird was the best handling car i have ever driven. very predictable under loss-of-traction situations. easy to control. my mods were as follows:

new/better then stock bushings (all), balljoints (all), tie rods (complete), center link, idler arm, TDS wonderbar, new springs, realativly fresh (at the time) shock absorbers. 34/24 combo.

the car had a not too-stiff ride while at the same time having precise steering and what i (with my lack of any real proformance driving experiance) felt was damn good handling. i could maintain traction around a 90* corner as easy as i could slide it around the corner. i'll admit i often choose the sliding...

anyway i guess my round about point is "to each his own". if you are going to re-build your suspension from the ground up i have no input. however if you are just looking for a little more cornering out of your V6 i would shy away from WS6 V8 springs. once i got the car to sit right (-1.5 coils) the ride felt nasty as hell. WAY to hard. could have just been my lack of experiance, but i felt scared to take a corner quickly. it felt like my front wheels were hard mounted to my frame. when i hit a speed bump it felt like i "HIT" a speed bump, as in collided with it, rather then ran over it.

anyway, whatever you decide to do, have fun with your car and be safe.

 

I've got a set of Hotchkis V8 springs on my V6 RS. The front end sits lower like it should compared to the rear. The ride is a little harsh but you'll have that sometimes on a car that handles awesome.

 

im also getting a iroc z wonder bar from a friend