The port spacing is the same, but the stud location on the FWD heads (both gen 2 and 3) are wider than the gen 1 heads.

 

Ikr .. parts stores suck... I go to get plugs n they argue with me for 10 minutes asking what year car and what motor blah blah blah ... I HAVE AFTERMARKET HEADS U DUMB ***** ,!!! THE COMOUTER WILL NOT TELL U WHST PLUGS I NEED HEFE IS THE DAMN PART NUMBER GO GET THEM **** ! IDIOTS LOL

 

Yea its ridiculous around here.

On another note, while im waiting for plug wires, i decided to install my aftermarket tach, with the dip settings for a v6. I know its a 10,000rpm tach and im going to set the rev limiter in MS. The tach was a freebie so im using it.

The switch panel i have been working on i started another thread for "Another ashtray switch panel" in the fabrication section. Heres a pic of how its coming along. Its also completely reversible to stock.

 

nm mis read the post

 

Heres the leds and the el light on the tach

 

just so u know they make a color changer/dimmer for that el tach , think its only a few bucks

 

It is hooked up to the stock dimmer. I actually had to buy the cigarette lighter el power supply cause the person who gave me the tach didnt have the power supply. So I had to wire up and isolate a cigarette plug under the dash to plug it in to. I dont really mind the color, i like it actually. Itll be nice to have an accurate tach though, lol.

 

Heres an update.

I didnt get the wires yet. BUT, while i was looking under the hood for mounting locations for the coil, cause with the turbo headers theres no holes for the stock coil bracket, I look down at the starter, seems it wasnt the ground strap i forgot to tighten, it was the starter bolt. And hanging next to it is the ring terminal from the other side of the alternator 2 wire plug, not connected. Oops. I put the ring terminal on the starter and tightened it down. Cranks but no start, 11.07 volts on the battery so i took it out and put it on a slow charge.

Also of noting, i re-ran the spark plug wires at the same time. After all of that, the boost gauge doesnt turn off when i crank the car now, now the car cranks but just wont start. I think no spark but i threw the battery on the charger and ill give it a whirl in a little while. Ill also find out if its fuel or spark, but i smell fuel, which makes me think spark. Ill check them both anyway if this rain we have coming isnt too bad.

 

Quick question, will the IAT sensor work behind the throttle blade, with a bung welded to the egr plate flush? It'll put the sensor out into the airflow. Unless it needs to be in front of the throttle plate.

I see it as an easy mod, and easy fill for the egr tube once the turbo headers are on. Plus it locates the IAT in what my opinion is a good spot, unless there is a problem with putting it there..

 

I always place my IAT sensors in the plenum when I can.

 

Do you use an O-ring to seal in boosted applications? Or should I just go for a new metal egr gasket?

 

u can put it there but the sensor can heat soak faster in that spot

 

What? O-ring, Gasket?

I just thread it into the whole that is either there or I create.

Complete myth. The open element IAT/MAT sensors will read the temperature of the air passing by it, not the temperature of the metal it is threaded into.

 

I was talking about reusing the flange from the egr pipe, but come to think of it I have 2 steel and 2 aluminum 1/2npt bungs, ill just open up the hole in the plenum, and countersink the bung into it and weld it. So just the element will stick out in the plenum.

Tomorrow Im gonna test for spark, pull the plugs and check for fuel. ill datalog trying to crank it.

 

only true if it has a plastic cage arount the resitor/element the metal cage ones conduct heat from the body to the cage

when i first did ms piggy backed witht he stock ecm i had one in the plenum and one in the charge tube , the one in the plenum would heat up when cruising

 

Uh huh, as it does in every other vehicle with the IAT/MAT installed in the plenum, this the AIR being heated, NOT the sensor, and the reading is an indication of air temp.

 

Alright children, settle down. Lol JK.
Whatever the case my IAT sensor has the plastic cage around the thermocouple, so im gtg once i get everything.

Havent quite had the chance to mock things up, bl85c, if you welded those up on junk heads, then i would assume they are pretty close and the gaskets are off.

Couple questions.
The turbo flange on the headers looks like itll be awfully close to the idler pulley, unless I cut and reweld it, which I will probably do to bring the turbo up, and the oil drain on a better down angle, sound good?

I can rotate the compressor housing if I need to correct? For better location of the compressor outlet?

If I think of anything else ill post up.

 

Yes, you should be able to rotate the compressor housing. I have not seen a commonly available turbo that can not do this. However, on internally gated turbos, there will be a short amount of adjustment at each clocking point to keep the actuator inline with the wastegate flapper and function properly. If you are using an externally gated turbo, then you have infinite adjustment.

 

It's an internal wg, but it's not operated by a shaft. There is a single tube that runs to the compressor housing, but that's it. Plus the vacuum line to the recirculation valve on the compressor housing.

It's a Ta013 turbo off of a Mercedes diesel 3L, internal Wastegate and recirculation valve.

 

Let me know if you can see anything on the log while cranking. I think its fouled the plugs now, Pulling them and going to check spark.

 

Heres the plugs i pulled out, they are hotter than stock, i put stock rated boschs with low mileage in and we will see what happens.

 

next time u buy plugs get a set of ac delco r42's best plug ive found so far for an iron headed turbo motor

 

Have spark and fuel. Even tried reloading the tune, crank crank crank it just wont catch. PW and duty cycle stays at zero on MT, i dont remember whether or not it changed before.

Cranking shows the timing mark at 14* on the timing tab. Bypass or no bypass it doesnt start. The resets are gone completely, that was the loose starter bolt, and the boost gauge no longer shuts off while cranking.

Swapped all the plugs out, same.

Original coil or msd coil, no difference. The only thing i can possibly think of now would be to swap ICMs again cause it started before I swapped it. After I swapped it, it tried to start(ran for a split second), then nothing and here we are.

Anyone got any ideas?

 

swap the icm back and let me know what it does , if mt has no duty cycle it means its not reciving a rpm input

u can also datalog while cranking and post that for me to look at

 

There is a datalog a number of posts up of a couple cranking attempts.

I clipped the tach wire coming into the driverside for the aftermarket tach, but the ms gets its tach input from the passenger side so that wouldnt have anything to do with it.

Ill swap the icm and see what happens.

 

How much work is it to replace the pickup coil? The connector broke on it trying to pull it off the icm.

Acdelco d1987 or d1984?

Actually im about to bite the bullet and just get a cardone new distributor for 100 shipped. Then i just have to wait again.

 

make sure the clipped wire isnt grounded

 

its not hard to change out the pickup coil, the cardone unit is a nicepiece as well

 

I bought the cardone new dizzy. Tomorrow im gonna shrink wrap the connector wires for the pickup, and finish swapping out the icm to the original, and see if i cant at least get it started.

Ill update tomorrow.

I figure since i have to pull the dizzy to change the pickup, id just get a whole dizzy and rebuild the other as a standby. The acdelco pickup coils, is there a difference with the red plug compared to the white plug or are they both the same?

Im assuming that the "d1987" in the part number is a year marker? Like 1987 or later, is this correct?

 

Here is an update and another short datalog. I know megalogviewer isnt picking up the rpm but megatune is. I put the original ICM back in, shrinkwrapped the pickup coil connectors, did thermal paste and the whole nine yards.

It almost started, but it sounds like the engine is fighting itself trying to start. It tried to start twice when I put the new ICM in and that was it. Putting the original ICM back in it actually caught and almost started several times.

Let me know what you think.

 

i just got home, had a rough weekend so far ill look over the stuff in a lil while

 

it has an rpm signal , do urself a favor and check fuel presure , next time u crank it hold the throttle wide open, this shuts the injectors down

 

I swapped ICMs again, The base timing wound up being off 20*, how I have no idea, I never touched the dizzy bolt and it was tight, I never moved it. Had it running with the bypass unplugged, It WILL NOT START with MS controlling the timing, Sounds like its way off in MS somehow. Now as a matter of fact it wont start at all. But I had it running long enough to get out of warmup, completely forgot to plug the laptop in and datalog.

I think its the cap, the button for the rotor is worn pretty good, and Im not gonna buy a cap cause I have the whole new dizzy coming.

 

ok the reason it wont start with the ms controling the timing is because the base time is off

 

Thats what I am still trying to figure out, We had to move the dizzy 20* clockwise to get it to start. But I never moved the dizzy at all, so why would it be that far off without me touching it? unless the timing jumped, which I think is highly unlikely cause the timing set is rather new and single tooth.

I never touched the timing, the dizzy bolt was tight enough that even if it was bumped, it wouldnt have moved. And I never moved the dizzy either.

How was it 20* off base timing? I'm clueless lol

 

i really cant answer that , my first guess would be timing chain jumped , or the distributor did get moved some how

it may be possible the reluctor wheel spun on the dizzy shaft as well but iirc its pinned into place

 

If the leads from the reluctor are backwards issues like this can happen. The ICM needs the rising edge of the signal, try flipping those connections and find out if that helps

 

That was in the back of my head this whole time. Cause the connector broke off, so I shrink wrapped the connections and put everything back together.

Heres my question on that, will it throw the timing off and will it run 20* from where it was before if the wires were in the wrong spot?

 

Yes, the timing will change. The 20* sounds about right.

RBob.

 

Awesome. Learn something new every day. Thanks guys

 

So the rest of the stuff I ordered is sitting at my post office, but its a federal holiday so tomorrow. Hopefully Ill have it up and running tomorrow.

So take the cap off both dizzys, note rotor position at #1 TDC on dizzy in motor, set new dizzy to same postion on install, double check, start and set timing.

Sound right? Im also going to remove the new ICM, and put good thermal paste under it before I install the new dizzy.

Will update soon.

 

Without further ado, I give to you a datalog.

Swapping distributors was way easier then I thought it was, lol. Maybe 5 minutes I had them swapped out, And I didnt even have to time it, dead on *10.

Its a wonderful feeling to drive my car, Im also going to upload the current tune, as I tuned a little VE on my own while cruising. Soon as I find it, lol.

Let me know If you can see VE on the MSQ, if not Ill export the VE table and post it

 

ill take a look in a few my new 1080hd camera just got here im about to go mount it in the truck and see how well the video comes out

 

Awesome, let me know how that works out, i may need to pick one or two up.

Also let me know how the noise issue is in that datalog, havent had a chance to look at it. Working on a coil mount for the MSD coil, and spark plug wire holders for when I switch the wires out.

So thats with just a new dizzy, old wires(which Im sure are causing most of the resets and noise) and original coil with semi-new plugs.

So it was a combination of things, ICM on its way out, bad cap, and pickup coil on its way out. At least now I have a core to rebuild as a spare.

 

im on a new computer so downloading all the megasquirt stuff now

anyways my new camera works great glad i picked up 2 , for 80 bucks these things work great

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2rOIWCuJIA

 

camera looks sweet.. very nice

 

I like the quality of video on those, and for $80, sweet deal!

Onto other news, I swapped the coil and plug wires out, and went on a tuning run. Apparently my laptop does not like datalogging and tuning at the same time, megatune locks up If I try to do both.

Did more crusing VE tuning, I'll post my current VE table. Still getting a misfire, which appears to be spark, cause the AFR goes rich right after. So I started messing with the dwell, which I read to low will cause misfire as well as too high. So I tried going up with the running dwell and it got a little worse, so I think my best bet is to bring it down under 2.5mS and see what happens. I should be able to drop the cranking dwell down to 3.0 from 4.0 correct?

Other than that its mostly VE, AE, and DE that needs to be tuned, a quick crack of the throttle presents --- Lean on the AFR gauge.

Dave let me know how that last datalog looks when you get your stuff situated.

Ill upload the VE table soon.

 

will do i had to do alot of updates on my home computer last night , since i just did a fresh install of a customized version of xp

im on my work pc right now so once i get some paper work done in the office ill take a look

 

I know the feeling, I only have a 40gb hard drive on my laptop cause I wipe it and do a fresh install every 6 months, I have XP PRO SP3, but even installing that there are a million updates after service pack 3. I always pull my stuff off the laptop and put it on either my flash drive(doubles as a linux boot up drive for computer repairs) or my 500gb external.

Ill never use any other OS than XP, in my eyes, XP was the sweet spot.

 

I used to think that, until I used Win7, now I won't go back.

I'm putting off testing Win 8.1, just because I don't really have much time to tinker right now.