82-T/A [Work]

Hey guys... haven't been on here in a while, but one of the thread replies to one I made in 2004 pulled me back in, and it got me thinking...

I keep seeing all these amazing aftermarket ECM / computer systems for V8s. Essentially, allowing you to convert carb'ed V8s into fuel injection. They work -awesome- and allow the engine to take full advantage of any camshaft or modifications you may have. What's better, in most cases it eliminates MAP and allows you to use a MAF.

Problem is, I'm not seeing any for our generation of V6.

Most of you guys on here, I assume, have the basic MPFI system that all the mid-80s V6/60s got. It's a great system, but the wiring is getting old, and the communication between the ECM and the sensors is incredibly slow. What's more, in order to realize a change in performance, you have to actually burn a new ROM chip... that's not as easy as it sounds, and very few people have the necessarily tools to do it. Even half-assing it with an old 80s DOS laptop and the old GM software just seems like a crappy way of going about it. Furthermore, going with the newer 7700 or whatever ECM, doesn't sound like the best option for me either.


Does ANYONE... know of an aftermarket fuel injection system that I can buy, off the shelf, that will ACTUALLY WORK with my existing V6/60 distributor, and give me Sequential-Port Fuel Injection?


There is this...

http://www.fuelairspark.com/fas/mult...-base-kithtml/

not sure if it's changed in the 2 years since I've looked at it, but I remember the big problem was that there was no way for it to properly interface with the existing distributor. It assumed an aftermarket MSD distributor... but they only sell those for GM SBCs...


Thoughts, guys???

drdave88

iTrader: (3)

There's nothing out there that is just plug n play on these cars. The market is small for aftermarket tuning on these cars. The kit you listed is for TPI V8 cars, not the MPFI V6. The only thing that would work as a universal is a megasquirt system. You'd have to do some reading, I do remember some had something going w/ it, not sure how close to 100% they ever got with it. Long story short, you will have to do some kind of customizing, wire hacking, chip burning, etc in order to be able to tune these.
Someone with a bit more experience may chime in with additional details, but it sounds like you are looking for plug n play, which you won't find.

You can swap ECMs out of a 90-92 if you're looking to convert from MAF to MAP, that has been done on here before too.

82-T/A [Work]

The link I sent is actually for the MPFI cars, which is essentially the same as TPI. The system compensates for the lack of 2 cyls, it's part of the initial set-up and configuration.

This system is LITERALLY plug and play, about as perfect as you can get. With the exception of having to feed it a couple of things (fuel pump regulator, power, etc...) it already has all of the factory GM connectors. It's literally perfect...

... except, it doesn't do spark / timing advance. That was the biggest issue I had with it when I last looked at it. I have an e-mail in with them to see if that issue has been resolved since I last looked at it in ~2014.

MegaSquirt is out of the question for me... I just don't have the time to fiddle with stuff like that, or the 7730 ECM either.

Appreciate the response though...

scooter

iTrader: (11)

The Holley Terminator system can run a V6, but you'd probably have to buy the universal kit and wire it yourself. Configuring it is pretty easy once you connect a laptop though

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

What you're looking for doesn't exist, PERIOD.

You're looking for that magical box that just works perfectly as soon as it's powered up and that doesn't exist for any engine.

That system you linked to is NOT "plug and "play", at least not for a V6 car, because it would take modifying the harness a bit to make it actually work on an engine it's not designed for. It still requires some hand made connections, albeit about 3 or 4 of them, and still requires setup to work on the engines it's designed for.

To be blunt about this, if you're not willing do to some leg work to wire a harness and/or do some tuning you're never going to get the results that you want. There's no magic box, there's no plug n' play system that will just run an engine perfectly without some user input, and my experience with those "self tuning" systems is that they don't. They sometimes get kinda, sorta a bit close, and for most people they are happy with close, especially coming from carburetors that are mildly metered fuel leaks at best, so just about any EFI system will be better than that.

I tune OBD1 GM ECMs and never once have I had to use a DOS based computer to do so, in fact I use my Win7 computers to tune them and do so very easily and well. There's some great hardware and software available (and has been for many years) that makes tuning OBD1 GM ECMs quite easy.

I also tune Megasquirt systems and they too are fairly easy to tune, especially when it comes to being used on GM engines. With the right parts, this can be a directly plug-able system into the older two plug ECMs, which were used on the 2.8L cars.

I also don't agree that going to a MAF based system is any sort of "upgrade". Mostly it's just a different way to calculate airflow.

W.E.G.

If you run an emulator with your existing ECU you can make changes to all variable elements of your tuning without having to burn a new chip. You just make the changes in TunerPro and load those changes to the emulator with a few keystrokes. If you ever get completely satisfied with the tune, you can detach the emulator, and burn the "perfect" tune to a chip.

Its a little bit complicated. Probably about on-par with assembling a desktop PC from scratch. Plenty of info out there on how to get it done. Lot of experienced guys who are willing to help if you present yourself as a determined student.

At the end of the day, you really should be looking at your fuel tables and O2 sensor data. I'd be very leery of trusting some "turnkey" system with a custom motor. How much would it suck if the turnkey system assumed something that wasn't correct, and ran too lean and burned all the valves?

82-T/A [Work]

I've been taking apart and building computers from scratch since I was 7. I've renovated two houses, plumbing, tile, framing, drywall, electrical, whatever. I've been a software developer for the greater part of 15 years. Can rebuild a carburetor in less than 5 minutes, rebuilt 3 engines, and get paid to hack... not girly Kali Linux, but actual vulnerability exploitation. And yet... the idea of having to reprogram my ECM and manually set those variables, and wire my own Megasquirt sounds like such an insane pain in the ***.


Ugh... anyway, for the sake og argument, that kit DOES solve problems by itself, and it will work, with minimal effort and modification. Just requires 3-4 leads, and it already has all the GM connectors, which will already work for the engine I have. BUT... it doesn't control timing, which is a big downer for me. Seems they don't have anything that controls timing.

I really, really hate the idea of having to go piece-together a Megasquirt kit. Last time I checked, they gave you a blank breadboard, some resistors and capacitors, and said... "Here you go! Have fun!" and it was like $600 bucks for basic crap.

Shoot... it's really got to be easier than this.

Six_Shooter

iTrader: (2)

You need to look into what's available before spouting the "last time I looked" line, because it shows you haven't looked in about 10 or 12 years...

MikeP_82

What about putting a 4bbl intake manifold on it and using a Sniper EFI?

EDIT: They have a 2bbl one now too, just unsure if it'll work on our V6 intake manifold: https://www.holley.com/products/fuel.../parts/550-850