Hawk92z-TDZ

http://www.airaid.com/200-522_chevy.asp

Do these things actualy work? Does anyone here have one?

Quick_Trans_Am

iTrader: (2)

I imagine it works on the same principle as the carb spacers, and they add power... let me say this: I don't think it will hurt, but I haven't heard anything about them.

D Stroy H8

I'd expect it'll bump cfm a bit. Same idea as a TB Foil. 5 cfm here, 10 cfm there... it adds up.

CHRISMAN2000

iTrader: (1)

I've only got two problem with that product.
1. It doesn't look like it comes in 58mm throttle body bores.
2. It need's to have an air foil.
Other then then it's a fantastic idea. Looks real good.

Hawk92z-TDZ

Well i only got the stock TB right now and i did get a foil so i might just pick one up and see how it works.

Thanx guy's.

D Stroy H8

Yeah good idea. I'll bet with a foil & spacer you are looking at anywhere from 15-20 more CFM. That'll bump your numbers up throughout your whole rpm range. Let us know if you feel a diff, or if your et improved etc.

DannyT

Does the throttle cable have enough play for an extra 1" gap?
I thought someone swapped on an LT1 TB and now the throttle cable was too short.

Hawk92z-TDZ

It say's it comes with adaptors to compensate that.

palric

iTrader: (1)

Are you sure you can move your intake bellows forward an inch ? I think it would cause mine to rub against the rad ?

Be sure to post after you install it -- I'd like to hear what you think about it ?

RP.

Jim85IROC

iTrader: (2)

I highly doubt that spacer will do a damn thing. It works on a carb'ed car because the plenum volume on those is small. On a TPI car, the plenum volume is enormous... adding another inch behind the throttle blades won't even be a drop in the bucket.

Swapmaster

You have got to be kidding me. That thing will do nothing to help power. They say "As the intake air passes through the spacer, the Helix bore creates a vortex action that improves atomization creating a more complete combustion and an efficiently burning engine."

That is a load of crap. It may start a minimal vortec effect on the air as it passes but do you really think the vortec action is going to split into 8 little votecs and travel down each runner all the way to the intake valve and affect atomization? HOG WASH!!!

The "vortec effect" created will be minimal, when the "vortec effect" enters the plenum the first thing that is going to happen as the air velocity drops substantially is that the squared off area inside the plenum along with those 8 pesky holes that the runners feed from will STOP any and all "vortec effect" dead in it's tracks. The plenum is there to do one thing only, to reduce turbulance by slowing velocity to provide equal pressure to the runners. It acts as a buffer to calm the air before it enters the runners, thus killing the so called "vortec effect".

People who sell this kind of crap should be ashamed of themselves.

D Stroy H8

I don't buy the vortec nonsense. But I do think a spacer will compliment a foil. Basically, you have a slightly beefier 48mm TB. Nothing amazing just one of those edges.

Hawk92z-TDZ

hmmm.... Maybe i will hold back then and see if i can find some dyno results of the thing.

Swapmaster

A spacer will not compliment a foil, it will only compliment the sellers wallet.

D Stroy H8

Back that up then! Why wouldn't a device that makes the area behind the throttle body bigger not essentially increase plenum volume?

Swapmaster

Basically a larger plenum raises the rpm band. Here is a quote from Grape Ape Racing. He explains it alot better than I could.

"The plenum area is where the intake runners meet. There can be one plenum that all runners meet, or two smaller plenums with 1/2 the runners meeting in each. The plenum volume is a very importing tuning aid. As high velocity gasses flow through the carb or throttle body, the plenum give the gasses a chance to slow down, as the velocity is reduced the pressure rises. Higher pressure means that the air will be more dense, and of course that means more power. As rpm goes up you need a larger plenum, but a larger plenum will reduce throttle response and low-end power. A plenum also reduces peak air velocity through the carb (or throttle body). The induction pulses in an intake cause velocity to rise and fall with every pulse. The plenum helps to reduce them by acting as an air capacitor. Average velocity will remain the same, but the highs and lows will be closer together. Since you need a carb that will flow enough air at peak velocity, a larger plenum will allow you to run a slightly smaller carb, but it will also reduce the peak signal strength, which is why large plenums tend to reduce low-end power."

On the TPI system the plenum volume is more than adequate which is why nobody makes an aftermarket one. Adding volume to it will not increase performance.

Hawk92z-TDZ

Is the super ram not bigger??

D Stroy H8

Well ok then! I'll shut the **** up.

Thanks for the heads up Swapmaster. You learn something everyday.

Ed Maher

Hell, that thing doesn't even really increase plenum area that much. More like it's just an extension of the throttle bores. Sure it'll be a small increase in plenum volumen, but it also makes the TB bores longer, and thus more restrictive.

As for the 'vortex' crap, feel free to smack yourself in the head if you believed in it at all. Turbulence in the intake manifold is bad. Thats why we port the plenum, and port match openings, etc. The ONLY place you want to encourage mixture motion is in the combustion chamber. Doing so at any point in the intake tract is nothing more than a band aid and a restriction (see swirl port TBI heads for a real life example)

If you think it'll do something, feel free to buy one and give it a shot. If it worked though, we would have been doing it for a long time now. It's not like it's a new idea, i rememeber seeing junk like that way back when i forst got into these cars.

Jza

Have you ever looked at the intake bellows and wondered if a smooth one would work better? Same idea. How much of an increase in airspace is a half-inch dual 48mm TB spacer worth anyway? About 2.8 cubic inches? How about a carb spacer? Probably about 4 times as much for a squarebore.

Blah.. Just another of those mods for people who don't know better.

Swapmaster

Hawk, plenum volume is part of the intake design. Think of it as using a plenum volume equal to the displacement of the engine as a starting point. This is a volume which will provide optimum dampening while maintaining reversion in the runners. If you make the plenum smaller the pulses created by one runner will react with the pulses created by another runner which will create a cascade effect and disrupt the entire system. Making the plenum too big will over dampen the system and reduce the effect of the reversion wave heading back down the runner to the valve.. Aftermarket runners and bases work with the stock plenum because the basic design of the intake is unchanged. When you start changing runner lengths and cross sectional areas you need to readjust the plenum volume accordingly.

If you look at all the different intakes out there, you will see all kinds of plenum volumes and runner volumes, each combination designed for a specific RPM range. Ironically, most of them use different approaches to come to the same conclusion.

Jza, the intake elbows by far outflow the throttle body so their design is irrelevant. Now a spacer under a carburator is a whole different animal. The plenum in the average carburated intake is way too small to start with. They are from the days when the average Joe Blow didn't know any better. Stacking spacers under a carb will help to a point but I'm not going there, that's way more complicated than a dry intake and nobody really cares about carbs anyway.

Hawk92z-TDZ

Thanx for the input, thats y i posted here.

Jza

Yes, we both know this. I was making an analogy that I was sure most "noobs" have considered, which was "wouldn't a smooth one work better?".

Did those days ever end?

Swapmaster

No, those days haven't ended but were woring on it.

Arts89Iroc

so if the spacer dont work, what about the so called "tornado?"

Swapmaster

Same rip off, different artist.