My pump will make over 100psi if i pinch iff the fuel line. So thats good. But i have the 61 injectors. I dont have any others. And my regulator is maxed at about 16psi tightened all the way with a washer under it. Ive neen reading this thread and its making me wonder if i should find some 4.3 injectors from pick and pull and mod the regulator some more. My primary concern is low rpm power and economy. Its going in a 4x4 that spends most of ita time uner 15 mph except the drive to the trail.

 

Someone said earlier that you need to disable ccp and egr to do proper blm learns. How do you do that? That may be part of my problem. Also, what other learning is there besides blm, and what's the difference?

 

You dont want top crank the FPR spring to max. I did and blew the diaphragh many years back(TPI). Spring available at topdownsolutions . Give me the expected HP and I can offer a fuel pressure. 85% DC max.

 

EGR set coolant temp to max. Charcoal Canister I forget. May be in constants or may be a flag. a search will find answer.

 

Is it due to coil bind? I see the spring listed there for the VAFPR, Is that the spring to use? Expected HP is 200. My biggest question is should I source 45# injectors and run them at a higher pressure, or run the 61# ones I have a closer to stock pressure? Seems small injectors/more pressure help atomize the fuel? Is this correct.

 

Hey guys, I have been doing some VE Learns this afternoon and one thing i cant seem to get rid of is a popping/sputter when I am decelerating. This is a manual car with tpi. Running EBL Flash. It does it when I let off the gas at speed. Especially in the higher rpms. The thing I noticed on the WUD was that when it does it, the S/F light is on. I cant find any info on what S/F stands for??? The DE light would come sometimes and it didnt seem to sputter when it was on. So what does S/F stand for?

 

Single Fire??

 

Thats the only thing i can think of. But whenever I search for entries in tunerpro for single fire I only come up with INJ- Single Fire Mode PW(Port Only) but I dont know which way I should change the numbers.

 

Fast has it, single fire mode. The injector PW is getting small so the ECM doubles the PW and fires the injectors every other engine revolution. Or a single time per engine cycle.

DE is decel enleanment, which is a reduction in injector PW for a short period of time to allocate for the fuel evaporating off the runner walls.

INJ- Single Fire Mode PW(Port Only): this sets the injector PW to enter & exit S/F mode. It is based on the double fire injector PWs.

See the WUD help doc for what information is on the various displays. See the Calibration help doc for what the parameters are.

As far as the popping/sputtering, without a data log hard to say. If it is popping in the exhaust this is normally caused by an exhaust leak. Can also be pulling air into the exhaust via the A.I.R. system. Either a bad solenoid or improperly sealed after removal.

The popping/sputtering may also be caused by the injectors operating right on the edge of opening. The injector compensation tables help in this regard.

RBob.

 

Ok thanks for the info, I had checked the wud help document and I couldn't find what the s/f stood for where it has all the names of the green lights. Either way, I am running open headers so that is most likely the issue here. I'm hoping to get either a ypipe made or change the one I have for my headers.

On another note, going through the documents that come with ebl I noticed that there were other tunes beside the pt one that came with it. Most importantly there was a manual one. So I have changed to that tune. But carried over my raised bpc number and ve tables. Along with no evr, ccp, hiwy, and lower rev limit for my break in period of the motor.
When I was doing this I noticed there were entries that had numbers changed that I have never even touched in the tune I was running. I found several like this. How can they be getting changed if I was only doing changes to ve tables from my starter tune?

 

> I had checked the wud help document and I couldn't find what the
> s/f stood for where it has all the names of the green lights.

You are correct, I was looking at the EBL P4 doc. We need to update the EBL Flash doc for this.

> When I was doing this I noticed there were entries that had
> numbers changed that I have

They may be different from the original stick calibration.

RBob.

 

Hill billy: 61's at 13 lbs FP supports 230 HP BPC 136 (350 cid)
45's 25 236 133

Both are Ok choices but need a TPI pump for over 13 lbs FP

 

Ok. My pump is fine. Its a ford efi pump running about 40psi in normal aplication. But I tested it to over 100 if i pinch the return line. Ill try the 61s since i have them.

 

OK with a high pressure pump you may want to run like 16lbs. atomization may be better yet. If the pulsewidth is too small at idle or if idle is erratic as a result. Lock synch fueling as it may want to go asynch on you.

 

Hey guys, Im having a problem that just started today with my car. I think its either a fuel pump or an o2 sensor issue. Basicly whats happening is once the car goes into CL, the BLM's start climbing to 172. The tune was coming along great before this started and had pretty steady BLM's close to 128. When it starts to do this, the car starts running terribly. If i keep a steady throttle it will start to studder and feels like its missing. But before it goes to CL it runs fine. I took a datalog on my way home from work tonight. It was running fine until it went to CL and the BLM's started climbing.
One thing I noticed on the datalog is that the O2 voltage almost seemed like it was to steady, like it wasnt going up and down as much as it should.
I will try and attach the datalog...well it looks like the zip file is to big. (Its 2mbs) So I guess if anyone wants to see it I can email it to you. Unless theres another way of attaching them?

 

EXT manifold or manifold to ext pipe leak?

 

It's currently running open headers until I can get a ypipe made. But it was doing fine before this. I'm going to go check the o2 sensor wire to make sure nothin got to close to the headers. Then I'm going to go into oriellys to test the fuel pressure.

 

I suspect the NB02 is seeing air due to headers. It then adds more fuel resulting in high BLM..

steady voltage mean it is not in CL. you should see crosscounts ever 1-3 secs.

 

Well I think I found out my issue. I had lowered the closed loop temp, and with a combination of that and the outside temps bein alittle cooler the past couple days I think the O2 sensor wasn't getting warm enough to be accurate. I've raised the temp on CL to the normal temp and on my fans to about 200. I'm still shocked at how well this stock cooling system is doing with keeping the 400 cool.

 

OK. I test drove it for the first time today. It seems to run pretty good for no tuning yet. It is running async all the time. I read somewhere some of the 4.3bins did run async all the time? I think I understand the difference between sync and async. But is one better than the other? Ive been a mechanic for years and its amazing how much new stuff im learning diving into this tuning stuff!

 

My understanding is that it goes asynch when the need arises. Replated to pulsewidth needs. Yours may very well be asynch always. I guess I recall reading that .

 

Is there an advantage to locking it sync as you said earlier or not? The idle seems good right now though when i got back from a test drive it wouldent idle.down below 1200.

 

Very low pulse widths with large injectors high FP at idle causes idle issues when ity flips asynch. Or flops back-forth.

 

I have a big problem with my corvette '84 350/C4 5,7L v8 engine, 4+3 manual.

There was no .BIN file that was even close to this car, so I took one that had a similiar *L volume.

Now the car goes like sh*t and the tuning doesnt seem to work that good. I'm not using a WB, and it seems that the small one has problems to read since the values are outside the reading area.

Does anyone know what to do about this? And does anyone have a .BIN file for this car version or can recommend which file to use of the original .BIN files that follows???

Please help, im desperate... tried for 6 months with only bad resluts....


Regards,

Mike

 

I have a big problem with my corvette '84 350/C4 5,7L v8 engine, 4+3 manual.

There was no .BIN file that was even close to this car, so I took one that had a similiar *L volume.

Now the car goes like sh*t and the tuning doesnt seem to work that good. I'm not using a WB, and it seems that the small one has problems to read since the values are outside the reading area.

Does anyone know what to do about this? And does anyone have a .BIN file for this car version or can recommend which file to use of the original .BIN files that follows???

Please help, im desperate... tried for 6 months with only bad resluts....


Regards,

Mike




Mike,

IS the car stock or modded and how? What .bin are you using now?

 

Before this goes too much further, do you have an EBL Flash ECM in the car? If so where was it purchased from? And if so, is there a HAM board in it, or was the harness changed out?

RBob.

 

When to add AE, or do ve map correction?

I am getting a lean/cut out/bog situation at heavy tip-in to WOT. In reading my data log I am trying to figure out whether i need more AE or is it my VE map that needs fuel added at this particular moment. What markers in my data log should i be watching for.

The problem area is in the 3400 rpm, tps 90+%, afr goes extremely lean and knock sensor seems to kick in and start pulling timing. If I feather the throttle past this situation it pulls to 6500rpm with no issues.

thx

 

Yes I have an EBL Flash ECM (guess its the chip you install).

Pruchased it from an swedish retailer called creativefuleinjection.

I dont understand what an "HAM board" and if the harness was changed out I can't tell.. they said it was original and everything looks original when looking at Dynamic EFI's homepage.

Thanks,
Mike

 

With a TPI set up the 3400 RPM area is the peak torque, for a high VE. Whether this is an AE or a VE issues depends upon how the engine got to that area. If it is a throttle mash from a much lower RPM and the engine is climbing through that area then the VE needs to be increased.

If it is a throttle mash at or near that RPM, then the AE needs to be increased. If the AE is OK elsewhere then use the "AE - RPM Multiplier %" to add AE in and about that area.

RBob.

 

The update has been sent via your email request. If you don't see it please check any bulk or spam folders that may be in use.

A "'84 350/C4 5,7L v8 engine, 4+3 manual" here in the states would be a Crossfire set up. Knowing that elsewhere the model year doesn't always match up to how it is done here, along with the HAM board answer, what EFI set up is on the engine?

If it is a Crossfire and has the original iron heads the base TBI calibration is the best one to start with:

EBL_F_TB2.BIN

Don't use any of the car or truck TBI calibrations as the SA will be too low as they used swirl port heads.

To get started there are two Intro to Tuning pages on our web site. Part 1 dhows how to use Tuner Pro and the WUD, with part 2 showing how to set up the beginning calibration.

Let us know about the EFI set up on the engine, along with any modifications to it.

RBob.

 

Ok I messed with locking sync vs running async. Im seeing a much better idle async. Sync I was seening 2% duty cycle, 1.5ms idle. The idle was ok but a bit rougher than async. Test driving I saw a maximum DC of 60% at 4200RPM full throttle heavy load. I'm wondering If I do have more injector than I need, f I should drop back to 13psi from 16, or find some 305 55# injectors. Ive done a few VE learns. Its running really very well so far. Very happy and loving the computer. Love having a fast idle switch for running my compressor.
Here is a data log, if i did this right. I want to know if everything looks in line and I should keep running VE learns, or If anything looks way out of place.
scout3.zip

 

The car is a TPI, with original heads light ported. With Rollercam, no EFI setup. Is thats enough info or do you need any more?

thanks for the quick update!


Regards,
Mike

EDIT: I dont remember which file we used, probably one of the 5,7L engine files, all I know is that it dont work that very well, something is very wrong with the VE tables and the fuel injection at startup is so RICH that the car almost not start. We bought a analog fuel meter that shows if it is Lean/optimal or rich since we didn't get any good results from the EBL Flash VE learn.

Also, we don't do VE learn from logging just by driving, is this not a good way to do it?

 

OK, being TPI explains that the EBL Flash ECM plugs right into the harness connectors.

However, originally being a MAF set up stock, a MAP sensor needs to be added along with some re-pinning of the harness connectors. This may have been done, I'm just covering all the bases.

Was the original ECM the 1227165 or the 1226870?

The other item is the Port Mod. Was one installed into the EBL ECM? And to be sure, the EBL ECM has two connectors (EBL Flash), not three (EBL P4 Flash), correct?

We'll get this going, I just need to understand what ECM and changes have been made.

RBob.

 

MAF is disabled and MAP is enabled.

Where do I find the numbers about ECM? I can't seem to find them.

I have rewired from MAF to MAP using the manual called (wiring diagram) 1227747 changed the PINs from the manual.

I have the one that has 2 connectors.

I have something called WIN number on my car that is this number: ICIYY0780F5112406 maybe this can help out?

Regards,
Mike

 

There should be a paper label on the stock ECM with a "Service No." or "Service Number" on it. It will likely match one of the two I posted above.

As long as it is re-pinned correctly we don't need to worry about that.

The final piece to the puzzle is whether the EBL Flash ECM has the Port Mod. The Port Mod changes the injector firing rate to once per revolution for a MPFI (TPI) set up.

Can also check for the Port Mod by removing the top cover from the EBL ECM. Opposite side of the heat sink will be a small 2.5 cm X 2.5 cm PCB, traces up (chips down). That is the Port Mod.

RBob.

 

I have a question regarding EBL tuning for boost at extreme elevation.

I am currently tuning a 355 pushing very light boost via sc, 3 bat map installed and 3-bar flag selected. Anyway I am at 9400 ft baro starts off at 72. Without winding out the motor I am getting up to 85 as read by the baro and the map. Because of this I am not using any of the boost tables, and am concerned about not getting to a safe afr.

How can I let the EBL know that it is in boost even at altitude?

 

does the ebl do baro correction?? if it does it should take a baro readin when its first turned on to see what atmpospheric presure is. or if its liek some of the other aftermarket stuff it has a real time baro sensor and does constant updating..

im not familiar with the ebl so somone will have to chime in thats actually used it

and dam man 9400ft i thought i was way up there at 6,500 ft iirc my map is 81 with the engine off , if i get on the highway and drive south i drop down pretty quick it was playing havoc with my tunning until i got real time baro correction installed since the way my ecm was it only took the base reading when u first turned on the key.

so if my elveation changed say 1000ft up or down and i hadnt shut the motor off yet my fueling would go rich or lean until i shut the car off and restarted it

 

In the GM and EBL series of SD ECMs the barometric pressure only affects the exhaust back pressure. As such there is only a small correction for it. When boosted this is even less of an issue. When using a 2 or 3 bar MAP the barometric pressure is locked at 98 KPa for the EBL & EBL P4 Flash systems and 100 KPa on EBL SFI-6.

Please do use the boost tables. They work correctly. As always when tuning, go slow and give the engine what it wants.

RBob.

 

The repinning is correct, alltho we have a MALF code about IAT since there is not IAT ( i guess we need to disable that from the bin file?)

Now I have checked some of the things you wanted to know. On the original ECM stock there was a lable with a barcode that had the number: 255001103495016 (still can't find any of the numbers you posted anywhere)

There is a Port Mod 2.5x2.5 cm.

 

As far as I know all TPI systems have a MAT/IAT sensor. Dependent upon the original ECM it will be in either pin A11 or C12. On the EBL it is pin C12. Stock it is a MAT sensor and located in the bottom of the plenum.

With the Port Mod use the EBL Utility to calculate the "BPC - BPC vs VAC" table values. Be sure to check the MPFI box, then enter the remaining parameters. Copy & paste the BPC vs VAC values into the calibration. Be sure to start with an included calibration that is marked ("Port Mod)." There are several for TPI set ups.

The BPC vs VAC table sets the injector flow rate & engine displacement for the fueling calculations.

RBob.

 

We will have a look about the IAT/MAT sensor wiring. (MALF Code IAT LO 23, 3 orange squares)

Can you recommend any of the BIn files that follows? Since we can't remember which one we used, except that it is obviously not the right one.

EDIT: Not even sure if we are using a TPI Bin file at all... and since the "overdrive gear" don't work, it doesnt seem we have a 4+3 manual File...

I've updated the program now, and found out how to put the information BPC vs VAC into the file, now I only need a file that is similiar to what car I have.

 

Start with this calibration:

EBL_F_3005.BIN: 5.7l TPI, auto (Port Mod)

Then set up the TCC tables as done for a TH400 transmission. There is an explanation of how to do this at the end of our Intro to Tuning Part 2 page:

www.dynamicefi.com/Tune_Intro2.php

BobR.

 

I've emailed some files to your EFI mail adress, that may help out in this case.

The car goes alot smoother now with the new corrections and the "right" file.

Still the car is hard to start, high SA and Rich fuel @ startup...

 

Does anyone have a good SA table for Vortec heads? I'm just trying to see if I'm in the ballpark. Now hat the warmer months are here I do have a little bit of pinging at high load/medium rpm (2500-3500), and I've noticed I get a little bit of a shake/shimmy that feels engine speed related... is this usually too much advance? It's not pinging when it does this.

 

Have you tried the one included with the EBL system? Can also do a quick search, several have been posted. here on TGO.

RBob.

 

So if I am currently boosting to to 85 kpa and atm is 75 kpa how would the boost tables be used since I am not in the 100 kpa-300 kpa range?

My assumption is that it is still using the main tables and not the boost tables. If this is true then how could I possibly command an AFR of 12 during boost?

 

The engine cranks at the distributor base setting. This base timing setting also needs to be set correctly in the BIN/calibration (SA - Initial SA). If it has too much SA after startup, there is choke SA which is in affect for a short period of time. Then the CTS vs VAC compensation SA.

RBob.

 

Change the "PE - TPS% Enable Threshold" table to lower values. Adjust them so that PE is entered once at or above 75 - 80 KPa MAP.

One thing to keep in mind is that even through boost is coming in, being at 85 KPa @ 10K feet is not much different then being at 85 KPa at sea level on a N/A engine.

Once in PE mode the commanded AFR is from the "PE - AFR Commanded" table. And once over 98 KPa can use the boost tables to reduce SA and add or subtract fuel.

RBob.

 

Could you shed some more light on this (or point me in the right direction), i.e. what would be needed? I've just started researching on the whole thing, and I'm thinking of doing it on the Fiero until I put a s/c 3800 in it.

 

hey guys, got a question here:

what's the condition to determine a lazy o2 sensor? finally started tuning again on my L03 with the EBL and noticed the o2 cycling is a bit slow.. at which intervals should it cycle between high and low reading in closed loop?

also, what do you guys set your idle rpm at for an L03 (stock, safe for some exhaust and intake work) for P/N, D, w & w/o AC. also wondering what's an appropriate iac step reading for those scenarios. thanks!