You hinted (I think) to running the EBL system soon. Like Dave said, just run the bottom port on the wastegate from the turbo compressor housing, this way boost pressure will be based on whichever spring your running. When/if you get the EBL, you can hook up for wastegate control using the charcoal canister's connector, then tune in Tuner Pro. The wiring is easy to do...

 

That wasn't me. I'm running megasquirt. EBL is like a rotary phone where megasquirt is the latest android. Boost control, launch control, different injection strategies, progressive nitrous, etc. I also have an E85 sensor i've been meaning to use since megasquirt supports flexfuel.




One I'm actually happy with the engine configuration I'll play with the boost control. For now just an 8psi spring is my starting point.

What I love about megasquirt is no matter who's car, boat, or bike I'm tuning it's the same. I can select any combination of ignition settings, cylinders, engine firing type, cylinders, dozens of sensor types, MAP, MAF, hybrid MAF/MAP, fuel and ignition table switching, etc. If you are ever interested in switching over send me a PM. I've even got mine in a '165 case:

http://members.cisdi.com/~anesthes/p...om/megasquirt/

-- Joe

 

I thought about MegaSquirt once upon a time, but the EBL-P4 is where it's at for me. My DW300 fuel pump is E85 friendly, and it's only a matter of changing the stoich set point and getting larger injectors to run it regularly. My main concern was boost and alky control, but I do know what RBob is cooking up. Where do you run...?

 

If those ecm systems can do boost control as effectively as an AMS or BoostLeash, i'd be all for it. But its hard to beat ams or boostleash

 

I don't know anything about either product to do a comparison. If you want to start a thread about boost control we can probably contribute some useful info.

Regarding E85, having an actual flex-fuel sensor is quite a bit different than tuning to E85. With a flex fuel sensor you can run any combination of alcohol/gasoline and not worry about the tune, it adjusts your PW on the fly based on what it determines the fuel to be.

There is nothing wrong with the other way with EBL, and for most members that just want something that works I recommend EBL. But for me it's just too limited.

Anyhow back to topic. I won't have a trans in the car for a week or two now so I can't play turbo mockup right now. But I do have a dozen or so other things to do to the car. I'll report back my progress once my engine is back to it's correct position


-- Joe

 

I see a cut up and rewelded stock TPI exhaust manifold in your future. It will give you exactly what you want with about 1 days worth of work. Have you mocked up yet with a stock TPI manifold?

EBL is a decent for the person that doesn't know how to tune cryptic GM ECM calibration parameters. Lots of extra parameters in the code that people don't understand. So they pay $500 for a $20 ECM and $480 worth of teaching from the author.
Megasquirt is different. It uses straight forward code that most people can understand. Tuning start up pulsewidth involves a couple variables. Not so with the GM/EBL code.
Setting accel enrich with MS is straight forward. Not so with the GM/EBL code.
And on an on. Look at how long it takes to tune big injectors using MS vs EBL and how much tech support is needed during the process.

With a few minutes/hours of programming, you could take a $5 Arduino nano board to read in the MAP sensor (few lines of code) and output a PWM signal to a $5 Aduino MOSFET board to contol a solenoid (evap purge, egr) to gate the boost pressure to the wastegate.

 

Putting aside the various stories that get repeated online about Megasquirt success, I know of three people on this board that run Megasquirt on their boosted applications, just three, and all three have had or still have timing issues, and none of them run eight O2 sensors to maximize the one benefit (imo) that Megasquirt has to offer over the other manufacturer's, that being true VE tables per cylinder, which I would be the first to admit is a tremendous benefit, even over XFI. Not to mention, those same three members are running distributor's, so I don't really consider such setups needing to comprehend cryptic parameters. Also, those who apparently understand these cryptic parameters never seem to post up any videos of their engines dialed in. There is a reason why Megasquirt is "open source", and that is because it is essentially stripped down GM code, not to mention why it is for off road use only, no exemption orders. My EBL-P4 ECM is the same ECM that the vehicle came with, same harness, same memcal, and would control my smog equipment just fine if I ever chose to go that route. Megasquirt can't, and since I drive my car legally on the road, what good would a Megasquirt do me? Anyway, back on topic Joe...

 

Probably user error or failure to follow instructions. I'd be happy to help,who are they?

The only problem I've had with timing is my distributor clamp coming loose. That's happened a few times now

It actually is nothing like GM code. MS doesn't even offer fuel calc or fueling strategies like GM code, which is probably why so many people like it.

The benefits are faster processor, more memory, better written code, single cable tuning/datalogging, ACTUAL realtime tuning, ACTUAL on the fly self tuning, and a user interface that doesn't look like a high school coding project.

Your EBL is the same ECM that the vehicle came with, agreed, and it was made right around the same time I got my Commodore 64 for Christmas. That was a cool little computer and it came with a 160k floppy drive that was a HUGE upgrade from the tape recorder that my TI-99A used.


That's actually not correct. The Megasquirt can control all of your smog equipment because the Megasquirt has programmable outputs that are logic based.

I feel like I'm qualified to make these determinations because I am an engineer, I'm also the Director of Research & Development for a multi million dollar IT company, and I've been in this position for a number of years. Most of the proponents of EBL don't fully understand software, or are making money selling it. People that are in neither of those categories are using other things.

I'll split this thread

-- Joe

 

No, you misunderstood. It can't, meaning they are not licensed to do so. Lawsuit by General Motors would cripple them if they even tried to. I am a banker who has also studied law, and I feel that I am qualified to make such a statement...

http://www.megamanual.com/tamp.htm

 

The MS code looks nothing like GM code. MS can run all kinds of GM and other manufactur engines. Again, GM code looks nothing like MS code.

Are you saying the EBL meets the federal regulations? It modifies a stock GM ECM and therefore breaks the fed reg. Has it been tested and approved by the feds? It sounds like you are saying it has.

It is illegal to modify the ECM operation. Just the fact that you modified it breaks the rule regardless of what smog equip is installed and operational.
Megasquirt does the same thing as the ECM you are using now. No difference.

 

According to the link, The installation of the EBL hardware violates the tampering with the factory ECU.

So a purchased EBL installed module puts the blame on the installer. Either the person it was bought from or the end user who installed it.

 

Are you kidding? Megasquirt started as stripped down GM code, and now I hear they are waiting for some disgruntled ex-employee from Harley to share the Ion Sense Tuning code to add to Megasquirt as yet another feature of "theirs" lol...

It sounds way more like you have some sort of a beef with the writer of the code, and are ridiculously asking someone who has no access to the source code, nor of it's assembly, if it meets federal regulations and guidelines lol? Megasquirt does not, period, end of story...

Hmm, yet hand helds continue to sell. Try again...

 

Hmm, someone went to alleged tuning know how, to pointing fingers towards the EBL. Your so hollow it isn't even funny. Let's see your off road Megasquirt in action, got any vids...?

 

Come on, let's see those cryptic parameters of yours in action. Sounds good on paper, doesn't it everybody, as its easy to copy and paste from other forums, but lets visually see something of yours that essentially proves your theories. Got milk...?

 

No it didn't. The B&G code was written by B&G and is written in C. It's not even the same architecture or language as the GM code.

The newer code "ms extra" is written by Ken Kluver and a few other key people. It's written in C/C++.

I don't know where you heard such rumors, but it's just straight up silly.

Neither does EBL, in fact, since that code has been disassembled, modified, and reassembled it violates not only emissions tampering laws but federal copyright law. It's also software piracy. It's code owned by GM that has been modified and re-sold.

I actually like RBob, while I realize some other folks on here take issue with him. He's been a contributor for a number of years and if he makes a few bucks helping people who are not great with electronics good for him.

But I'm not going to sugar coat his product just because he's a well respected peer. I evaluated it, and I thought while a minor step up from a stock ECM and an emulator, it's just not even close to what I want.


P.s, I also have a legal education and a piece of paper on the wall to prove it

-- Joe

 

I was gonna say the same thing. My local friend also has a timing and fuel issue on his megasquirted watercooled beetle bug setup. Its keeping him from getting 9's in a manual car
Spark seems to be hard to setup right. Never messed with MS

Now my code$59 stock ecm setup was fine on 15 psi on my motor. Now it ran 9.4 at 145 on 15 psi with the ls1 computer i got now but no doubt it was making that power with the old 730 ecm and distributor.
No doubt ebl should be similar and from what i read, better to tune than $59

 

I don't know what he's doing wrong. It's basic math. Is he running a cam sensor, crank sensor, both ? There is hundreds of combinations under ignition settings and I guess it is easy to screw up.

What is the 'issue' he's having?

-- Joe

 

In respect to Flex Fuel, I haven't spoken to Bob in awhile, but I know it would be very easy for him to implement Flex Fuel capability in the EBL system. We would need to buy GM p/n 13577394 (flex fuel sensor), and the EBL would automatically adjust for fuel, spark and boost duty cycle dependent on the amount of ethanol being detected. But I am getting way ahead of myself, and maybe he will chime in if he see's this thread...

 

I have to admit, the Code 59 flat out works, and it works awesome. Fasteddi has been doing some incredible stuff with it too. So many options to go with. In case people reading this think I am knocking Megasquirt, I'm really not, I just haven't found a reason to go with it myself, and that is just through the experience that I am seeing from others. Code 59 would be awesome if they implemented the code that Eric Marshall and Bob Bailey have come up with in their new chip, and what's sick is that SD2 setup of theirs is still prom based. Rauscher's SFI-6 takes the cake though in my opinion, hands down. The CnP setup looks awesome and works flawlessly. Hopefully the EBL-P4 see's that soon Bob...

 

GM hardware with $59 is plenty capable.

WOT engine control via an ECM is the easiest function doing open loop control. Read some sensor inputs and spit out a pre-programmed injector pulsewidth and timing signal.

The LS series gains a WOT advantage of HP for two reasons:
The 24x/58x timing wheel allowing better timing resolution
The 8 coils allowing for a proper dwell time at high rpm.

In saying that, how many people can tune the engine to needing 0.1 degree resolution and know they need that? How many people need a coil better than a stock GM vortec coil that can be used to fire the plug correctly up to 7000 RPM?

At non-WOT..........well that is another story and where the LSx PCM shines. My favorite OBDI ECM is the 1995 '427. The one that people replace thier 1987 '747 with.

That 427 PCM can control both the 4L60E and 4L80E and has 16 times the memory.
How much does it cost to get the other ECMs to control an E-trans. Once you go E-trans ya don't wanna go back.

 

Once you go full manual valvebody you dont go back lol automatics are boring

 

That got old really quick. Plus anytime someone moved the car for me I had to make sure they started off in 1st gear so they wouldn't smoke the trans.

I have a 6L80E or some thing in my 2012 GMC. I don't know what controls the shifts in that thing but whatever it is needs to be recalled.

-- Joe

 

Lol love my gated turbo action shifter.

I also agree on the 6l80e. Hate my truck shifts

 

lol, I am too old for the manual stuff. Only like playing with a shifter in the big trucks.
The nice thing with the E-trans is you can program it so anyone can hop in the car and do a decent 1/4 mile time with a turbo engine. Drive to the track at 20+ mpg with the converter locked.

I am not saying it is for everyone but it has some nice features.

I'll take a 4L80E over the 6L80E until they get it figured out.

 

It's always a crapshoot if it's going to be a long soft or quick hard shift. I think my back and neck problems are due to GMC.

I'm done with manual transmissions as well.

I like the idea behind the e-trans. I might trade the convertible in for a new vette this spring and will get it with an automatic. I don't wanna spend the money on the firebird though.

-- Joe

 

Well he had ignition issues and fuel issues. Pulsewidth would drop to zero at times. Always seemed to happen in 3rd gear at 1/8 mile. Car would fall on its face for a moment then start pulling again

Not sure why. Not sure what the beetle bug motors ran.

He was seeing 6ms dwell and some other issues

He says
Cam signal is via single window dizzy/hall sensor. Crank signal is VR sensor 60-2 via factory internal wheel and sensor. It runs perfect after I power cycle the ignition.

 

Did he get this figured out?

So he's power cycling the MS unit? His cam signal and crank trigger are both wired to the MS ?

I'd like to hear more about what he's running. Any aftermarket ignition module/controller? This is a 4 cyl? Is it running Quadspark?

-- Joe

 

No idea where hes at with it. Car was apart for abit then back together for WOW show. I'll have to talk with him again but its winter so no tuning

All i know is its a water cooled turbo 4 cyl bug motor from a 50-60's beetle? 450whp