nFORM91

Hey, has anyone dropped their 3rd gen 1 1/4" and got the KYB GR2/Gas-A-Just strut/shock setup??

I'm about to and wanted to know how a 3rd gen rides (lowered). Someone please respond. Thanks!!

Pino91Formula

well i have the pro kit from ibach and monroe struts and shocks, the ride is a little rougher m but it handles much better

bbtaz97

iTrader: (3)

iive install edelbrock springs and kyb gr2 struts and shocks and it made the car lower by about an inch adn it was a dramitc improvement im handling. i highly recommend the setup. Also if your gonna lower your car i wouls also recommend spohn relocation brackets for your LCA espically if you have a pwoerful engine or else you wil get wheel hop from hell.

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91 camaro RS
- 305 TBI
Mods: Performer TBI intake, 1" TBI spacer, K+N, jet fan switch ,160 thermo,Accel control module, Jet Stage 2 chip, edelbrock TES headers, Compleate 3" Flowmaster exhaust, Edelbrock springs, KYB struts and shocks, 700R4 built by TSI, SLP tq converter, b+m trans cooler
Soon to come .SLP Posi 323,Spohn LCA's and panhard bar,Ascd ram air hood, Z28 spoiler and grille,white guage faces.

VortecZ

iTrader: (2)

I went down 2 inches. It handles great but rides terrible. It just depends what you want more. I would do it again in a heartbeat!

nFORM91

Thanks guys!

I think it'll be worth it after all. My car handles pretty good with stock shocks and struts, but I just want it to handle even better and be more low profile. I appreciate the comments and tips.

Anybody else with a lowered 3rd or 4th gen?

Firebird90

iTrader: (1)

I have lowered my car with cut springs, drop spindles (3") and have KYB all around. It drives rough (Very stiff). On a rough road (880) it feels like you're in the space shuttle on reentry. But at the same time it handles great. This is not my everyday car.

RoadRacin85Z

Wow... Didn't even know they made 3" drop spindles! I bet it looks awesome! I think 1.5" springs is the way to go for a good compromise for a daily driver, rougher ride, but handles much better. And anyway, a lot of times you have troubles with the front end geometry if you go a lot lower than 1.5 or 2".

-Joel Likness

------------------
- 84 Z28 In Progress (Road Racer)
- 85 S10 350/350 (Drag Racer)
- 85 Nissan 200SX Yes, it's Japanese (Circle Track Car)
- 91 Lumina 3.1 Euro (Daily Driver)
Carolina F-Body Club
NC Third Gen Association

Firebird90

iTrader: (1)

Well 2" for the drop 1" for the springs. Sorry for the confusion...

AT4 T/A

I've got the KYB GR-2 and Gas-a-Just with an Eibach Pro-Kit. I'm really happy with them, and that's all there is to it! The ride is not harsh, but firm. The disappearance of that nasty wheel well gap was also a really great appearance upgrade.

nFORM91

Cool!! Thanks AT4 T/A! I appreciate ALL the replies! One question, are lower control arm relocation brackets a must?? I'm only dropping my car 1.25". AT4 T/A, did you install relocation brackets on your car?

I'm asking 'cause some guys recommend doing this, but is it mandatory?

bhaas

Well, they highly recomend it for lowered cars, but mine isn't lowered and I still had that nasty wheel hop. I made some RLB's and the wheel hop was gone and it handled a lot better. It was VERY well worth it. You'll be glad you did it. Don't think about it, just do it. You'll see. Best bang for the buck.

Tadder

How far do the relocation brackets hang down? Does this cause a ground clearance problem with a 1.5 drop?

86Trans Am

How do the Bilstien Sports stand up to the kyb gr-2, gas-adjust that you all have? is the gr-2 the strut and then your running gas-adjust shocks in the rear?

the relocation brackets are welded to the bottom of the axle tube, so unless you decrease the size of the tire or rim, they arent affected by lowering the car

------------------
1986 Trans Am
305 TPI
"If it's not one thing, it's another!"
http://www2.hanover.edu/hierlmeier

Jza

My 89 is lowered a little over an inch with Eibach Pro-Kit springs, ES poly bushings, and some other mods. Along with the Koni reds (adjustable) the car rides only slightly (I mean slightly harsher than before at the stiffest setting. It's really nice on the soft setting for those city rides. Even going to 17" from 15" wheels didn't make a difference in ride harshness.

I can pretty much guarantee you'll like the car with a 1 1/4" drop.

nFORM91

Jza, thanks for the encouraging words! My car only has 34,550 miles on it currently and the suspension is nice and tight throughout. All bushings look good too. Would you recommend new bushings with the new lowering kit (anyway)?

Jza

If you're changing the springs, then definitely change the control arm bushings and lower ball joints, because that's gotta come mostly apart anyway, might as well do it now instead of again later. Since most of us don't have our own arbor press, and the bushings and ball joint need to be pressed in, you can just remove the control arm altogether and take it somewhere.

As far as the rear control arms and panhard bar bushings, I think you could wait on those if you're aspiring to put on aftermarket pieces (since they more often than not come with polyurethane bushings).

Wish my cars had such low mileage.

idrag2

Why in the he@# would you want to lower a 3rd gen. car anyway? Everytime you go over a good sized speed bump you rip something out. If someone can tell me a POSTIVE side to doing this. I may do it also


THANKS

ScreaminDeamin85Z

well i lowered mine because #1 it makes it handle better #2 because im putting 17's on and dont want a 3" gap between the wheel well and the tire and finally #3 because it looks better

------------------
Brandon
"ScreaminDeamin 360"
350 60 over, TRW forged 9.83:1 pistons,Hooker Comp headers, crane cam 216/228 .484/.512, crane 1.6 RR's, ported plenum, home made ram air, 24lb SVO injectors, crane AFPR, all going through 3 inch mandrel pipe and a flowmaster.
New project-89 IROC-Jamex Springs...and thats just about it till summer!
Soon- 6 speed, Pro 5.0 shifter and 4.10's
http://users.argolink.net/bvana

http://ScreaminDeamin.cz28.com

nFORM91

I must agree with ScreaminDeamin85Z,

Several of my friends have lowered their thirdgens and the Pros definately outweighed the Cons! That's why I'm getting it done and can't wait! BTW, from my experience, the ride is firmer, but not all that bad. Handling is greatly improved.

Jza

I scrape less since it's been lowered, most likely due to the reduced jounce in the springs.

And those fendergaps are unsightly.

AT4 T/A

I haven't installed them as of yet, but I also replaced the control arms with Spohn ones. I don't have any wheel hop yet, but when I get the ZZ4, I'm sure I'll need them. I wouldn't say they're mandatory, but I'm sure they help.

junkyarddog

you'll go through front tires more often b/c you'll always want to take hard corners,I haven't done this yet,I'm waiting on my PST front end rebuild kit & pro kit,so far I have KYB struts & camber plates,hotchkins adjustable pan-bar,LCAs...and IROC 16x8"s on my '84 Trans Am ,

my friend lowered both of his 'stangs ('86 GT hardtop & '96 GT ragtop) the '96 looks,handles and is just an all out animal on the twisties with 1" Eibachs and 17" rims. an inch will do the trick!

if you find that you are bottoming out more often, you need to :
a. see an optomitrist
b. take a cab home from the bar
c. re-install stock hieght springs,your towns unpaved roads aren't lowrider friendly.

nFORM91

My friends' lowered thirdgens ride firm but don't bottom out as much as I thought. Our thirdgen Firebirds and Camaros when lowered at least an inch, handle superbly! About as good as any C4 that I've been in! This is another reason why I'm going for it! (Eibach Pro Kit, KYB GR2s and Gas-a-justs).

IROC KID

I as we speak have a 2 inch drop from the very reputable moog racing company,a friend works there and hooked me up as they are hard to get,i cant wait,i also am using the monroe sensa track shocks and struts,i think this combo will be great in the handling and look area,i will let you know about the ride when its installed,my friends ricers and s10 xtremes are all dropped lower then mine will be and they are fine with the monroe sensa tracks,but all rear wheel drives suffer wheel hop when dropped so you need to get the relocation brackets for the lower control arms among other stuff to really get a nice ride,but the best way to drop a car is drop spindles as they dont give you as a rough ride.

Jza

If I wanted a soft ride, I'd drive a Caddie.

Jza

A Steinmetz if you really wanted to know which Caddie.

nFORM91

IROC KID, thanks for your response! Keep us posted on the results of your car. I'm sure it will be bad@ss!

Jza, a Seville STS is what I'm getting in the future. That'll do it for a plush ride, but let's stay on the subject of lowered thirdgens. Wed., May 2nd My '91 'Form gets dropped with the afformentioned gear.

I like the insite you guys are giving, lets me know I'm doing things the right way. Thanks.

FiReBReTHa

would always love to do a group purchase for shocks struts. kyb's
thatd be pretty sweet.

carparts on sale gave me some quotes for you guys:

"Per your pricing requests. Eibach #3801.140 $214.82 KYB #KG5562 33.88 each KYB #236001 51.81 each KYB #343211 18.68 each Thanks for your questions. "

but we cant GP the shocks there cause the way they get them. tell me whatcha think

------------------
91 FireBird 305 V-8
no true mods,
ghetto rigged cold air intake,
People dont have a soul, its just something parents made up to frighten little children, like the boogie man, or micheal jackson..."

GheTTo Riggers INC.
We Make Mcgyver look Like Crap

89GTA5spd

Back when carparts.com first came out and had their 30% off, i got KYB GR2's front and back for a little over $70. The back ones suck though. They are tiny, about half the size of stock. Maybe if I get some money, i'll put one some decent ones.

Fimbulvetr

If I was a moderator, Id move this to the '*****' forum!

Come on guys! Lower your cars????


Buy a toyata, but dont do it to third gens, you make us all look bad. Hell Ill buy your damn cars just so you dont it to them!



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Fimbulvetr

Whats next?

This?

http://www.transamgta.com/ubb/Forum5/HTML/000259.html

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Matt86Z

Ignorance begets ignorance.

Think before you post in the future. That's like asking somebody why they get better brakes, or a bigger engine.

It's definately not rice.

It's a performance enhancement meant to make your thirdgen handle better. We're not talking cliche mini-truck low, or the '63 impala with hydros and dayton 100 spokes.

Fimbulvetr

Some of the stuff in the forum sound cool, and some sound good, almost what Id like to do. But some sound pretty drastic.
You have a good point matt, and had I been you I would have probably done the same thing. I just wish some people would realize that some cars look like total pathetic look-at-me-Im-a-rich-boy pansy wagons.

For those who modify for handling please ignore, for those who do this because it 'gets the chics' or because your friend bob did it, please dont. Like I said Ill buy your cars beore you do it.



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FiReBReTHa

ok. EVERYONE THATS LOWERED YOUR FBODY ARE IDIOTS.
AND SAME WITH PEOPLE WHo DRIVE CORVETTES...
wait a second...... corvettes... lowered? better performance? RIce? no.. No dumb dubm...




------------------
91 FireBird 305 V-8
no true mods,
ghetto rigged cold air intake,
People dont have a soul, its just something parents made up to frighten little children, like the boogie man, or micheal jackson..."

GheTTo Riggers INC.
We Make Mcgyver look Like Crap

nFORM91

Dude, what the hell are you talking about?!?! ARE YOU COMPARING LOWERED THIRDGENS TO RICERS??!!If you are, then you definately need to take that BULLSH!T to some other message board!!! ...and you'll get reamed out there too for speaking suck freakin nonsense!!!

For your education, Fimbulvetr, most sportscars have a LOWER center of gravity than other cars for a f***ing reason! I think it ...uhhhhhh, enables a car to handle better at high speeds. That just might be a damn clue for you as to why so many of us thirdgen owners are lowering our cars.

More school for fools... First generation Firebirds came FROM THE FACTORY ONE INCH LOWER THAN CAMAROS!!! Did you know that ****!? I guess that was RICE thinking too huh!! How could anyone on this message board be so LAME to think that it's wrong to modify the suspension of our cars? How is it wrong to make an already good handling car handle better?

Just a word of advice for future reference... NEVER compare modified thirdgens or for that matter ANY f-bodies to RICE!!! You know, maybe you need to go to some all stock 4 door sedan message board where you can get your rocks off on cars that weren't made to handle! Cause whatever you've been smokin tonight you need to cut that **** out!

That car in the photo you posted was obviously given add-ons by someone who doesn't have a f***ing clue of what to do to a 4thgen. ...and NO, THAT AINT "what's next"!

p.s. Look, I aint pissed at you, just your lame thinking. Think about what you said man... really think about that **** a minute. Later



[This message has been edited by nFORM91 (edited April 29, 2001).]

CamaroMike

nFORM, if you would look a little closer you would realize that lowering a thirdgen is counter productive unless extensive suspension upgrades are performed. The panhard bar pulls the rear to the right, the lower control arm angle and the pinion angle get all messed up, the front end goes from a negative camber curve to a positive camber curve, and you bottom out on damn near everything! Not saying you are stupid just in need of more informed data. Most thirdgens are lowered for looks. I.E. ignorance. My car sits at maximum stock ride height and pulls over 1 continuous lateral G on a G-Tec. That's better than a Vette!

------------------
84 Camaro ZZ4 with HOT cam. 1.88 60' (12.98 @ 105MPH E.T.)
Recently Ported Heads, Installed Larger Race-Flo Valves and RPM Air Gap Intake (No new times)
Other Mods: You name it and I have probably changed it.

2001 Dodge Ram Quad Cab 5.9L 4*2

The Bowtie
ASE Certified Auto Tech
LIVE AND DIE BY THE ALMIGHTY BOWTIE!

RARE-ROC-Z

man i cant wait to lower my IROC. i know it will be awesome.
but if i do. should i get the adjustable struts/shocks..

i dont mind the cost since you get what you pay for.. but what do you think

and what is the BEST SETUP.. i dont want any lower than 2" front, and 1-1/2" back..
thanks

------------------
Jarrad
1990 IROC-Z L98 350 TPI
TH-700R4
G92- 7.5" 10 Bolt 3.23gears
Bright Red Hardtop/ Grey Custom Interior
5,507 IROC's Hardtops/Ttops; 2,415 5.7L IROC's Produced in 1990

DAILY DRIVER: 1991 S10 2.5L/5SPD WITH CAMARO RIMS

Fimbulvetr

Well nform, if you hadnt cooled down near the end, Id almost consider you trolling.

You want me to think logically and apply some common sense, then I can constructively point out some pure nonsense in your argument.

I did in no way imply that all people on this topic have 'riced' thier cars. What I meant ( and it was my fault for not clearly pointing it out) was that some people (possibly even on this topic)have gone a little too far with lowering. There is a point where lowering does make sense but there is also a point where it is so damn low that even if you did need that handling anywhere other than a perfect track, youd be slowing down so damn much for dips etc. that you would look like a complete fool doing it.

I can completely assure you I am well aware of this fact. But where is the line that divides reasoning and foolishness, I dont know. Let's race on a highway ok? You know a normal american highway that maintained by our US goverment, with railroad tracks that havnt been maintaned in 10 years and potholes that can hold an entire honda crx.

A. I dont want your advice
B. I can do anything I want
C. I gave you a link to a ***** 4th gen, if that pic can make me almost cry, I can certainly point that it comes pretty damn close to rice.

PS I dont care if your mad at me.

I have thought about what I have said, and don't take anything back, I will however more cleary point out what I mean next time. Although it is an intangible threshold of how low the car can go before it is considered wise, people should apply some common sense as well.

This post was not meant to flame anyone, nor to heaten the 'argument\discussion'.
I merely tried to reclarify my saying, and point out to nform that some of his advice was taken.

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[This message has been edited by Fimbulvetr (edited April 29, 2001).]

MikeDwhoROCZImports

iTrader: (1)

IROC's came from the factory "lowered."

Or, lower than a regular Z-28 at least. I think like half an inch.

[This message has been edited by MikeDwhoROCZImports (edited April 29, 2001).]

ChevyKen

iTrader: (1)

Funny how some people are pointed out to judge what others should or should not like/do.

Here is what I did:

1.Lowered my car 1.5" all around with Jamex springs
2.Upgraded front end with a PST polygraphite kit
3.Wheel alignment
4.Added a Lakewood Adjustable Panhard Rod
5.Added 17x9.5 Torque Trust II's with 275/40s all around

Why?
1.Because I don't care for the big fender gap
2.I enjoy that it corners nicely
3.I like the stance of it this way

Also,
*Nowhere in this area have I ever seen speed bumps
*I've NEVER scraped anything but the airdam/front - which is no worse after the lowering
*I don't race/auto-X, the car is a cruiser/daily driver
*The car goes straight as an arrow and does not rub!

Am I a horrible person..?

Thanks to the judges

< /sarcasm>

Some do it to strictly to handle better, some do it to handle/look better and some do it strictly to look better - whats the problem...?

Peace all,


Ken

------------------
Bright red 86 Iroc-Z Choo Choo Customs Convertible
17x9.5 TT II's w/ 275/40x17's, BMR stb, Lakewood APR, Jamex 1.5" Lowering Springs
ChevyKen's Cars (ALL new!!)

Administrator @ ChevyWorld.net (Now in a BRAND NEW Design)

[This message has been edited by ChevyKen (edited April 30, 2001).]

nFORM91

Ok, Fimbulvetr, your points are well taken!
just a little shocked at first by your statements, but hey, I guess I misunderstood your point, cool.

CamaroMike, I hear you too in that there should be some element of research involved when going about lowering your car (adjustable panhard rod, LCAs or their relocator brackets, new bushings, struts/shocks and possibly new ball joints if neccessary as well as a fresh alignment after mods among other things).

I'm not the smartest on this subject, and not the dumbest either. I just have my reasons why I want to enhance my cars handling capabilities.

Like ChevyKen, I like the increased cornering ability, aggresive stance and reduced wheelwell gap.

BTW, I've given it some thought lately and I might hold off dropping my 'Bird. The thought of getting mostly all new suspension components including swaybars, all new bushings in addition to my already purchased Eibach Pro kit and KYBs is awful tempting! Take care

IROC KID

I think that its a good idea but if you do then definately get the right shocks/struts as they are important,i have read in many mags for our cars that a 1-2 inch drop will GREATLY improve the handling so i am putting my moog 2 inch drop in soon with the sensa track shocks/struts,i agree that other suspension pieces should also be changed as when certain things are changed on your ride it affects other parts of the vehicle.as for the 4th gen *****,the guy has to live at taco bell,that is all i have to say,that thing would be a sweet ride across the border for sure but here in america it is one of the ugliest 4th gens i have seen,the hubcaps look really shiney,lol,what a joke,i actually respect a ***** because they look alot better then that THING!but back to the drop,the irocs came an inch lower then the z-28 for a reason,handling,i think that dropping the cars will put the height to where the 4th gens are,they are lower for a reason,i just think cutting the springs is always a bad idea.bottom line although is if you like it then its all good,but if you dont then no sweat,i will be pushing 90 through the turns while your still at 70.

firbird

I dont need to lower my car because i have a fat man. Best Mod Ever.

Dan W

Cutting springs if done w/o heating the spring is not necessarily a bad idea.

Heating springs to lower a vehicle is a bad idea.

Keep in mind that when you cut springs, you stiffen them. IE: a spring has 10 coils and it takes 500 lbs. to compress it one inch. If you cut one coil off that spring, it will compress 9/10's of an inch with that same 500lbs. Many people will go with a softer spring and then cut it so they don't end up with an overly harsh ride.

IROC KID

your right about heating the springs,i dont know much about cutting coils,friends have done it but i dont know much about it,how much do you cut for a 2 inch drop?i agree when i have a carload of people,especially fat boys she sits like a low rider,lol.

junkyarddog

FIMBULBETER!!! you better buy my car before I lower it and shave the door handles!!!
$10,000 firm
can you believe some dude told me I should take the IROC 16x8"s off of my car because they don't belong on a pontiac!? then what?,go back to firebird 15x7"s? get the f--k out'a here!!

ImportEater

My daily driver is a 1985 Trans Am as you can tell from the signature. What it doesn't tell you is that the car rides on 16x8" Iroc wheels, sit's 2" lower than it did when it came from the factory, and has custom skid plates because the damn thing does scrape on about everything in site.
Reasoning goes as follows:
1. I bought the thing with 225/70 rubbers on 15x7" wheels and that won't due. So out came the Iroc wheels that I had laying 'round, and they got wrapped in 245/50/ZR16 rubber. Much needed improvement.
2. After the new lower profile rubber came went on, the thing appeared to have the stance of a 4x4, or at the very least a 'way too high' family sedan. You can't have that from an F-body -- it's just unsightly. So I dropped it 2"
3. I really couldn't have cared less about handling, but I'd challenge you to park any stock height F-Body next to my T/A, and tell me that the stance on my T/A doesn't look one HELL of a lot better!

The bottom-scraping is a bad side effect that can get annoying, but due to the custom skid plates, doesn't hurt a damn thing.

------------------
1985 Trans Am - rough and ready -- 3" cat and primary exhaust, lowered 2", custom rust body work mild fender denting. Daily driver.
1976 Corvette Stingray - not so rough, but always ready. mild 350/th350 tranny. mostly stock till I whack the hood for the blower