Cloyes timing chain for a SBC
Your factory roller cam has a turned shoulder on the front journal and a thrust plate bolted to the front of the case to retain the cam. You don't need a "button" or anything else unles you find that your retainer plate is abnormally worn.
The 3145 is a 3-way crank sprocket, steel crank sprocket, cast cam sprocket, with a double row (RC35-2) true roller bushing chain.
If you really want a roller chain instead of a silent chain, I'd suggest checking the GM 12371043, Miloden 15015, or this one: http://www.sdpc2000.com/cart.asp?act...=1952&pid=8915
The 3145 is a 3-way crank sprocket, steel crank sprocket, cast cam sprocket, with a double row (RC35-2) true roller bushing chain.
If you really want a roller chain instead of a silent chain, I'd suggest checking the GM 12371043, Miloden 15015, or this one: http://www.sdpc2000.com/cart.asp?act...=1952&pid=8915
JW,
I mentioned that the Morse/Link Belt silnet chains were stronger, not necessarily any better for the application. They do tend to wear the sprockets faster, however. Then again, this is less of a problem with ductile iron sprockets than teh nylon toothed factory sprockets.
A double row roller chain (RC35-2) is weaker, but lighter. A chain with fully bushed rollers will last longer before it stretches or wears the sprockets.
The really good way to go is with a single roller chain. They are usually fully bushed, use a much larger link (RC60) and are both strong and long lasting. They are also heavier, like the link Belt silent chains.
For a typical street application, any of those should work fine and provide long service. Just avoid the plain double row roller sets that don't use free-rolling chain bushings.
For your '89, you'll need a set to match your factory roller cam drive and cam retention plate.
I mentioned that the Morse/Link Belt silnet chains were stronger, not necessarily any better for the application. They do tend to wear the sprockets faster, however. Then again, this is less of a problem with ductile iron sprockets than teh nylon toothed factory sprockets.
A double row roller chain (RC35-2) is weaker, but lighter. A chain with fully bushed rollers will last longer before it stretches or wears the sprockets.
The really good way to go is with a single roller chain. They are usually fully bushed, use a much larger link (RC60) and are both strong and long lasting. They are also heavier, like the link Belt silent chains.
For a typical street application, any of those should work fine and provide long service. Just avoid the plain double row roller sets that don't use free-rolling chain bushings.
For your '89, you'll need a set to match your factory roller cam drive and cam retention plate.
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Supreme Member
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 18,457
Likes: 16
From: Loveland, OH, US
Car: 4
Engine: 6
Transmission: 5
I wouldn't use a GM tining set either... think about it. Why are you replacing the one you've already got in the first place? Its long-term wear-free perfect longevity and rugged reliability? I don't think so. So why would you put the same thing back into it?
You don't need $150 springs. But when you put real springs in it, you have to trash the factory's stooopid dysfunctional "rotator" dead weight off of the exhaust valves, which requires shimming those up. Go to your local machine shop and get .100" of shims (a .060", a .030", and a .015" will work fine) to go under the exhaust springs. You do however need to get the retainers and keepers to match the springs you get, no matter what springs you buy.
I'd suggest the Comp 3136 timing set; Comp 981 springs and their associated hardware; and the FelPro positive valve guide seals since you'll already be right there.
There are alot of spring mfrs out there. The guy is partially right: Comp doesn't make their own. If you go there or to Lunati (I used to live in Memphis, and did some contract work for Comp, so I pretty much know what they do and don't have; and I didn't work for Lunati, but I've been there a time or 2 as well) you won't see a spring winding machine. But he's very worng in other ways. They both get them made to their specs, out of the material they specify, heat treated the way they want them, tested to whatever level of consistency, etc. etc. No doubt the same is true of Crane and Isky and so forth. It's not like they all just call up some Acme Spring Corp. in Australia, which is the only company in the world that makes springs, and buy the same springs everybody else does. That's typical laughable eBay ad copy.
I have no idea what Competition Products does for springs. But I can tell you, if you buy a cam from Comp and use Comp springs, they'll warranty the cam if it fails; if you buy a cam from Lunati and use their springs, they'll stand behind theirs; but if you buy one of their cams and use some non-cam-mfr's springs, they will not warranty the cam, no matter whose springs they are or what the guy on eBay put in his ad copy. There are some things that it just isn't worth shaving pennies off of the cost, because of the potential for disaster. It's literally a matter of moving hundred-dollar bills out of the way to pick up dimes.
You don't need $150 springs. But when you put real springs in it, you have to trash the factory's stooopid dysfunctional "rotator" dead weight off of the exhaust valves, which requires shimming those up. Go to your local machine shop and get .100" of shims (a .060", a .030", and a .015" will work fine) to go under the exhaust springs. You do however need to get the retainers and keepers to match the springs you get, no matter what springs you buy.
I'd suggest the Comp 3136 timing set; Comp 981 springs and their associated hardware; and the FelPro positive valve guide seals since you'll already be right there.
There are alot of spring mfrs out there. The guy is partially right: Comp doesn't make their own. If you go there or to Lunati (I used to live in Memphis, and did some contract work for Comp, so I pretty much know what they do and don't have; and I didn't work for Lunati, but I've been there a time or 2 as well) you won't see a spring winding machine. But he's very worng in other ways. They both get them made to their specs, out of the material they specify, heat treated the way they want them, tested to whatever level of consistency, etc. etc. No doubt the same is true of Crane and Isky and so forth. It's not like they all just call up some Acme Spring Corp. in Australia, which is the only company in the world that makes springs, and buy the same springs everybody else does. That's typical laughable eBay ad copy.
I have no idea what Competition Products does for springs. But I can tell you, if you buy a cam from Comp and use Comp springs, they'll warranty the cam if it fails; if you buy a cam from Lunati and use their springs, they'll stand behind theirs; but if you buy one of their cams and use some non-cam-mfr's springs, they will not warranty the cam, no matter whose springs they are or what the guy on eBay put in his ad copy. There are some things that it just isn't worth shaving pennies off of the cost, because of the potential for disaster. It's literally a matter of moving hundred-dollar bills out of the way to pick up dimes.
you can use either single or double roller chain with no other changes. the rotator is the silly thing that sits on top the spring. buy keepers to match the retainers. you can buy 100 shims from k line for the same price as 16 from jegs. about 20 dollars a box ,still that's 60 bucks to make up .100. i've used positive seals from fel pro on both intakes and exhaust as well as o rings, all from auto zone, sorry no PNs.
Supreme Member
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 18,457
Likes: 16
From: Loveland, OH, US
Car: 4
Engine: 6
Transmission: 5
K-line is a mfr of all manner of auto machine shop goodies. Another of their handy products is the bronze-wall velve guide inserts, where you drill the guides out and press them in and ream them for a perfect fit. They're not a retail outfit. I doubt you'll find them on the web; everybody that needs to know about them, already does.
Dorman is another brand of them you can get at real parts stores.
Just go to your local parts store that works heads themselves in the back room, they'll probably just give them to you if you buy something while you're there. Don't screw around with CSK or Auto Zone or Advance or any other place where they have high-school girls that look parts up in a computer. Go to the place with the 100-year old greasy bare concrete floor and shelves full of old heads that haven't been moved since they invented dirt and no aisles out front with air fresheners and "sport compact" accessories. In other words, a REAL parts store. They'll hook you up.
Dorman is another brand of them you can get at real parts stores.
Just go to your local parts store that works heads themselves in the back room, they'll probably just give them to you if you buy something while you're there. Don't screw around with CSK or Auto Zone or Advance or any other place where they have high-school girls that look parts up in a computer. Go to the place with the 100-year old greasy bare concrete floor and shelves full of old heads that haven't been moved since they invented dirt and no aisles out front with air fresheners and "sport compact" accessories. In other words, a REAL parts store. They'll hook you up.
Supreme Member
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 18,457
Likes: 16
From: Loveland, OH, US
Car: 4
Engine: 6
Transmission: 5
What other brands
And what is a bronze-wall velve guide inserts? Do you have any pics?
Supreme Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,770
Likes: 1
From: Pacific Northwest
Car: '85 IROC
Engine: LB9
Transmission: 700 R4
Since this thread started, I bought parts for, assembeled and (almost) installed one motor.
And still managed to somehow keep my job.
No more procrastinatin, fella... Get out there and bust yer knuckles.
And still managed to somehow keep my job.
No more procrastinatin, fella... Get out there and bust yer knuckles.
damn 88 that's funny, true also. even the slow *** machine shop i use to use could of doen a set of heads since this thread started. glad i do my own heads now. takes me a few hours if i work at it, less than a day if i don't.
Supreme Member
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,770
Likes: 1
From: Pacific Northwest
Car: '85 IROC
Engine: LB9
Transmission: 700 R4
I couldn't help it... Josh, you've got a unique talent for keeping a thread alive.
So have you decided to do a valve job now?
Or buy a set of heads?
So have you decided to do a valve job now?
Or buy a set of heads?
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