Okay...I have a custom box, designed on a computer, with 4 10", 220 watts, subs. Push 'n Pull desgin. I used 2 Crunch 300 watt amps to push these suckers. Even thought it was loud, it had no BOOM. Bass.

I met Iroc2nv and he told me my amps were ****! He told me to check my RMS. So I did. I believe it was 25 or 35 rms per channel. 4 channel Amp. That means each speaker was only had at most 50 watts going to it.

So I sold both amps for $125 each. In its place I bought an amp I've never heard of.

It's a 2 channel Zapco High Performance 350 AG Series Amp. My question is how good is this amp, how many watts does it have, RMS rating per channel, and what is the best way to wire 4 speakers to a 2 channel amp.

Thanks

88redxtsy

 

1 ohm amp! Mono bridge that is. Try to find a PPI or a Fosgate amp. Each speaker will receive the same amount, all mono though, but you use your mids and highs for the stereo affect.

 

zapco will work fine they are a good amp that make lots of power i have one myself.



DO NOT run them 1ohm mono. you have a push pull box and will blow your speakes. you can run 2 ohm stereo if the subs are 4 ohms. but you must be sure that when one speaker is pushing that the other one is pulling. you do this by revering the + and - so that the speakers are out of phase to each other. it is a must

 

Zapco is a decent reputable brand, but for some weird reason they dont include their power ratings (last time I looked at em anyway)! But there are lots of people out there that test them and mags will too if you ever come accross one with a zapco feature... Do a search and you should find out. You can also find out yourself if you have a volt/ohm meter. I can tell you what you need to get readings on and dig up the formula if you want.

About how to run them, if your box is push/pull then like trigger said DO NOT wire them all in phase. You definately still want to run them mono though. Mono just means all your subs will be doing the adsact same thing at the same time, whereas stereo is just your basic left and right channels. So say if your listening to some alternative song (most rap/techno/synth bass songs already have the bass run the same to both sides) and the bass guitar is set 70% to the left and 30% for staging reasons then only half your subs will be playing loud obviously.

For wiring, you have a plethora (theres my word of the day) of options. More so if your amps are 1 ohm stable and your subs are dual voice coils. Zapco amps I am almost postive are 1 ohm stable. You will need to run them out of phase (180 degrees). If they were all run in phase it would compress the air inside the box and sound like complete crap, probly blow your subs after awhile if they arnt a high quality build. You want to use the airspace to help the subs stay within there excursion range and not bottom out obviously. So you will need to run 2 out of phase by wiring pos to neg and neg to pos and just run the other 2 straight up. Does your box use one big box area for airspace or is it divided into 2? What brand are the subs? Are they DVC type?
I just went back and looked at your questions... Your SOL on the 2 channel to 4 channel stuff, your zapco amp probly wont have the needed power either. You will either need to get another matching (has to be the same model/year) amp or trade it in on 2 new ones.
greg

 

james...

i am glad you took my advice and bought a real amp...now you have to spend some more coin and get a decent head unit *cough alpine cough*

anyways..the guys are telling you the truth although i really dont think you will get your maximum power put of those subs you have because they werent made right.. you need a box that is semi ported if you want that loud make you deaf sound that i have..

if you want ill go somewhere with you to pick up a new box(i can get you the same one i have for like $600 brand new and youll hit like 147db when its tuned properly)

its totally up to you though...

also you need to upgrade your wiring specially that power wire you have...wait til you see my monsterous wire i have in store for next season....1 gauge friggen nuts i tell ya..but i need that because im gonna be running 3 more subs JLW3 15's custom made with the 3 10s i already have....bye bye back seat..

iroc2nv

 

Porting his box will only give him an extra 3 or so db... Thats the least amount of db increase noticeable by the human ear. In other words it helps, but unless your system already pumps, porting your box isnt going to do any wonders...
$600 for a mdf box is a rip. hell I will make you a ported fibreglass box for the hatch if you give me the airspace you want for $600...
how much is the 1 gauge costin ya? Ive been thinking of putting the battery in the back for awhile.
BTW you sure you want to do 3 15s with 3 10s? It seriously sounds like crap if you mix sub sizes. You will hit a nice high db but you will definately want to turn one or the other off while cruising... 3 15s will be golden though
greg

ps james get a clarion

 

ok first things first...my box isnt ported and it friggen pounds...(the guys know that who were at the krispy kreme meet that i actually went to...) i had it not even half way and it was shaking everything a good distance away..

the 1 gauge wire is a secret...(i am partially sponsored) so im getting a nice deal... as for the 15s they will only be on for the comps while the 10s are turned off... and as for cruising the 15s are off and the 10s are on...

clarions imho arent that good...at least he didnt get a SONY!!! lmao

iroc2nv

 

Clarions and pioneers are the best performers (unless you feel like spending over a grand) in my, and many other peoples opinions. Alpines are alright but their quality is complete crap for the amount you pay. Panasonics are decent but they need to catch up with the others if you ask me. Sonys are ridiculous. Sony just needs to stop making car audio and come back in a few years with a clean slate and start making some decent quality stuff. Whats your preference?
greg

 

run your amp in MONO, and then run the speakers in 2 ohm stereo.. yeah.. sounds like I don't know what I am talking about... hard to explain through typing..

so... run 2 subs in parallel on either channel, this will give your 2ohms on either channel, and that should give you good power and punch.

 

Thanks Guys.

Trigger - I knew about the reverse thing from the guy who built the box. Thanks for reminding me.

I found the specs. www.zapco.com. Click on Products, then Reference, than 350 model, then open the manul. The 350 listed is the new model and its rating. However, if you open the manul its for my exact amp. Here is the quick specs:

350 Watt
100 watts x 2 @ 4 ohms
170 watts x 2 @ 4 ohms

Bridged Mono
210 watts x 1 @ 8 ohms
330 watts x 1 @ 4 ohms

No RMS rating. Is there another word for this??

I know I need two amps to run my box. I guess for now I'm going to wire the top two speakers togethor. How do I type this...so that instead of 4 wires going to the amp it will be two instead. One Positive & one negative. The bottom two will be wired the same way except when it's wired to the amp I'll reverse it. Make sense?? Am I right to do this?? I hope. I know I'll get very little power this way, maybe 80 watts each speaker, but what can I do? Until I find another identical model(good luck).

The subs are 4ohms, 220watts each speacker.

I have another amp at home. It's an Alpine V12 MTV - 505 model. That will push my four in car speakers. Fronts and side.

Thanks again.

James

 

connect two of your subs positive to positive, and negative to negative.. then conect each pair of speakers to positive and negative to either channel of the amp. This will runthem 2ohm stereo. If you want to run the amp in mono, get a 2 to 1 RCA adapter and plug the adapter into the left RCA plug, most amps will run 2 Channel Mono like this.. then you will have the same signal going into both channels, thus having all 4 subs pushing at the same time.

 

Nathan..since my box is a push and pull design and going with what you said shouldn't I make one pair of speaker wire connect to the amp in reverse order? Positive to negative and negative to positive? Other than that I get what your saying.

 

my preference used to be sony...until i bought the fold down one with the blue face....its all good until you put a system in the car with that as your head unit..then it blows for no reason...next i put a jvc deck in..reallly nice deck i tell ya...but i gotta say that the alpine is the best that i have used thus far and it does just fine for my needs...im not a pioneer guy or a clarion guy..(too many buttons...it looks cluttered)

but it is only individual taste..

iroc2nv

 

I dont know if the zapco has it but most new amps just have a stereo/mono switch nathan... does it say those ratings are peak james? manufacturers are finally starting to use rms ratings more than peak nowadays. You should be able to get 2 of those zapcos to feed your subs enough juice. You will probly have to bridge them though. You will want to bridge the two that pull on one amp and then bridge the other two that push on the other amp. Assuming your subs are single voice coil 4 ohm type that will put you at 2 ohms. You need to find out if that amp is 2 ohm stable though, Im surprised zapco didnt give 2 ohm ratings actually. Running them at 2 ohms may give you more power than you need to reach the max db, depending on if those sub and amp ratings you posted are peak or rms. I wouldnt be surprised if zapcos posted watts are under rater so it wouldnt hurt for you to test it out yourself.
greg

 

hmmm...I think if you just switch positive and negative on the speakers.. it should work... any specific reason why you went with the push-pull design?

 

ClarionedCanuk - my mistake. If you look below at my second last post it should read: 170 watts x 2 @ 2 ohms. I typed 4 by accident. Dosen't give peak but if I'm reading this correctly I think peak is 380 watts 4 ohms mono. Like an idiot I'm going to try an run the box on this one amop just to see how it hanldes.

Oh ya, I looked at it again last night and it does have a switch for threee settings. 1 for stereo, 1 for Mono and the other for something else.

Nathan - When I worked as an apprentice in a shop, a mechanic at the shop owned an 82 camaro converted to an IRCO Z. He would compete in stereo competitions and win on occaions. He had 7 custom boxes which he had built and designed on his computer. I choose the one I have because 1) It had 4 tens and 2) He won a competition using this box.

The good thing was that he would use the boxes only for competiton and changed his box at everyone. Never used the same box twice. You could see how new the subs and box were.

Another reason I went with this box was because of the price:

$200

Can't complain.

 

iroc2nv- I like buttons! more buttons mean its usually easier to navigate. Alpine is alright but like I said their quality control sucks. So in other words, if you get a well builr alpine your golden, if you get a bad one (local shop says about 1 in 10 alpines get returned) your screwed, their support also sucks and they are hardasses (lost your receipt, too bad, 1 day over warantee, too bad etc.).

james- ok good, if 220 is rms on the subs than 170 will do just fine. If 220 is peak, even better, just make sure you never turn the gain up full.
The mono/stereo switch comes in handy (just leave it on mono obviously) and can save you some pitas.
Be very careful when attempting to wire the 4 subs off the amp. I still wouldnt do it, I would just run 2 of the subs till you can get another amp. But anyway if you do it take extra precautions because it could put a 1 ohm or less load on your amp. It doesnt look like it says a 1 ohm watt rating (or does it?) which most likely means its not recomended. You probly wont, but you could blow the amp. Zapcos are pretty tough and I would be surprised if they didnt have a safety shut off. So if it keeps turning off on ya, dont leave it on and keep trying to turn up the gain
greg

 

i had a solid box, no ports or anything. Pioneer IMPP 12s 2, box perfectly matched the subs, one fosgat punch100 bridged and runnin the subs in parrellel, switch the -/+ and man did it pound my freekin trunk apart (90z24). 4 way 6/9's, pioneer premier 5 1/2 with the seperate tweets, pioneer 150 watt amp for the mids and highs, sounded crisp and loud as hell. may not be a million dollar, advertisement car but hell, it was awasome. ohhh my deck was pioneer premeir as well. i thiunk 2 grand was the totall. got all the wires and fuses for free since i spent that kind of dough (ohhh)

 

My system, as of now, consists of Infinity OEM replacement speakers (really clean sounding), and a Pioneer DEH-P9300 CD Deck (13 Band EQ Built In)... hopefully by next summer, I will have my 10" Rockford HX2 DVC Sub in a sealed box (stealth box) powered by a Rockford Amplifier that pushes around 500x1 into 2ohms bridged.. I haven't checked out the new amps yet... sold my old one to Corey, he's on the board somewhere, forget his nick on here...