thafaz

Hello all,

First and foremost, R.I.P. John Lingenfelter; I just finished reading his book on building up SBCs. This news has officially ruined my day

I have started acquiring parts for building up my 350; so far I have:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2448448036

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2448448639

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2447991073

...and from the classifieds...

CAMS AND LIFTER KITS FOR SALE...

114122
Crane Cams CompuCam 2030
Camshaft and lifter kit
Chev V8 (81-87) 267-350ci

For sound, I have:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...tem=2446718902

What do you guys think? I did as much reading as I could, as these parts seem compatible...then again, this is my first engine build ;-) Any suggestions? I have thick skin; lay it on!!!! I also intend to do all the TPI mods suggested in the Tech section.

Oh yeah, I'm looking at a Borla or Spintech exhaust....depends how much $$$$ I can justify.

Thanx,

FH

91wtROH17's

Watch those header's, I think flowtech only make 1-1/2'' headers!! Better than the stock log's, but if you plan on making good power in the future you should look around some more. Also I beleive those heads are the iron L98 heads, if you really want them then check the boards classified adds, you will find them cheeper than $200 american!! And you prob. won't have to have them shipped too far. Just my .02 cents.

91wtROH17's

Hey, just noticed you are from Ottawa. I have a bunch of other part's so PM me if you are looking for anything you can't find. Just realized the head's where worked a bit, so discard my first statement. For the cam you should really look into the ZZ4 cam if you wanna save the tuning issues. And from what I have heard the cam work's awsome with the TPI.

thafaz

Maybe I'm wrong, but I think the heads are actually these:

3927187....69-70...350..........Camel hump,64cc chambers,accessory holes

.....due to the size of the chamber and the valves (1.94/1.50); I think the one's you're thinking of are:

14102187...87-91...305..........1.84"/1.5" valves

...which would have 58cc chambers and smaller valves.

Uh...yeah....I think....

Tha Faz

91wtROH17's

Ya, you could be right. I don't know much about the casting #'s at all, they just sounded familier(can't spell). What colour is your car, Have you had it long(just trying to figure out if I have seen you around at all).

thafaz

I bought it in October and drove it for only a week; the suspension is teeth shatteringly hard. I'm told that all Camaros ride hard, but this one is brutal, even compared to my Integra.

It's an 86 with a 350 in it; pretty much everything else stock. The paint is pretty rough, but there's no rust; it's maroon/candy apple on the sides, and faded down to primer on the hood, roof and hatch. The interior is clean; only 61k miles (US car); however, there are some severe rattles that need fixing before I put it back on the road...usual stuff, doors that have to be slammed shut, bowed fender, leaky ts. Should be a fun project to get back together; I've wanted one of these cars since highschool.

FH

91wtROH17's

Sound's good. My car does not ride too bad, and it is slammed with 40 series tires. Get that car going good so we can drop those mustang's around here!! They are everywhere, and most of them think third gen's are crap.

Daz

iTrader: (1)

The heads that you got are the newer style.The center bolts started in 1987.Im not familiar with the numbers but I think what you have is the stock iron L98 head

Daz

thafaz

Okay, so will these heads provide an improvement over the 14102193s I'm currently running? From reading on this board, these are the ugly sister of GM heads.

FH

Cruzin Kaz

I hate to be the one to break it to you, but... Those heads you bought, the 187 that were machined with new 1.94 and 1.5 valves will perform exactly like your 193's that you have right now. Both heads are TBI Swirl port heads, the 187's came with 1.84 aznd 1.5 valves, and the 193'sw came with 1.94 and 1.5's. Other then that they are the same head. No performance upgrade for the most part at all. Sorry to be the one to tell you.

Acceld Z

You wouldn't happen to post on redliners.ca, would you?

The stuff you've picked looks ok. You could have probably gotten the flowtech headers and y-pipe new from Keystone for a little more than what you got them for on Ebay. I'm not a big fan of the Crane Compucam series but some people swear by them. I don't know **** about GM head castings so i'm not gonna comment there. All in all the parts should wake that IROC up a little.

thafaz

Not me on redliners.ca; however, I just registered....thanx!!!

Good input guys!!! Keep it coming!!!!

FH

Acceld Z

LOL, don't thank me yet. Wait until you've posted a few times You won't get any good advice concerning thirdgens on there. Most of the guys that know anything just troll the site using AE's now, hehehe.

Hawk92z-TDZ

I agree with Kaz on your heads here.

As for the cam, it'll work good in the 350 TPI, wouldnt of been my choice but it will work nice.

Daz

iTrader: (1)

I thought 305 heads are 58cc?? well I could always be wrong.. ..

Daz

91wtROH17's

That's what I thought???

thafaz

Yeah, and I also thought that the 14102193s on my car are 76cc; therefore, by going with a 64 cc head I will increase compression 1-1.2 points (9.5 - 10 or there abouts), resulting in a performance increase albeit still swirl port....however, since I'm sticking with TPI, there's not much above 5k RPM.....or am I reading too much????

OR!!!!

They took 58cc heads and made 64cc out of them....not likely for a couple hundred bucks.

OR!!! They're completely BSing me, and they's really 58 cc heads...probably not, since all they deal in is heads.

Dunno.... Might have to break out the graduated pipette and cc 'em myself.

FH

91wtROH17's

OK, what I honestly think is that they are the L98 iron casting. That would explain the 64cc. I know someone said they were not, but you should look up the #'s and find out exactly what you bought!!

Hawk92z-TDZ

I'll look them up later this week. If they're swirl ports they wont be the L98 heads.

I even got the flow data somewere if I can find it I'll post it.

thafaz

I got the heads last night; the stamping number is indeed 14102187

In an attempt to salvage some sort of good, I chased down the chamber volume issue.....

Here's what I got from the seller:

***************************************************

I am not sure where you are finding information that states that the 187 castings are 58cc. They are 64 cc heads from GM without any modifications. Let me know if you have any other questions.

Thanks, Tim

***************************************************

...and in response to this:

***************************************************

I thought all 305 castings we're 58cc......too many forum readings ;-) Do you have a reference for the 64cc measurement?

One other question: the 14102193s I have on the car; do you have the cc for those heads?

***************************************************
I got this:

The 193 casting heads are 76 cc. The early Chevy 305 heads casting numbers 601 and 415 are 55cc to 58cc. They are 82-85 years.

Thanks, Tim

***************************************************

Therefore, in summary:

1) I still have swirl port heads No problem; the car has plenty of power now (compared to my **** burner)...when I get the itch, I'll treat myself to a set of Vortecs.

2) However, they are now 64 cc as opposed to 76 cc, so compression will increase. more

3) Not all 305 heads are 58cc (for anyone that's running a 305)

Cool?

FH

Hawk92z-TDZ

14102187...87-91...305, TBI..........1.84"/1.5" valves, Swirl Port

14102193...87-up...305/350, TBI......1.94"/1.5" valves, Swirl Port


I didnt have time to look up the flow rates.

Just so u know, If u change to the Vortec heads u'll need to change the intake.

Heres some info on your cam
http://www.cranecams.com/master/apps/chevy37.htm

Acceld Z

I just looked at the cam specs for that cam..........get a different one. I think Hawk's link said it's a 204/214 cam? That will be a serious waste of time. Is your engine a roller engine? 'cause that's a roller cam. Even a stock MAF car without any PROM work will tolerate alot more cam than that.

thafaz

Yes, it's a roller engine; better cam is recommended, eh? But then I'll need better heads.....DAMN YOU SWIRLPORTS!!!!

Would this cam present any advantage over the stock cam? I bought it because 1) it was cheap, and 2) the emphasis was on mid range torque (lobe separation 116 degrees.....nice off the line, nothing past 5k). I wanted a ride to cruise in, good passing power, and some occasional light-to-light action if any of those sneaky rat bastard Buttstanks decide to get fancy.

What would you recommend with...I can hardly say it.....SWIRLPORTS....

FH

Daz

iTrader: (1)

The computer will tolerate it but the power gains wouldnt be that much.That cam is the biggest I would go for that kind of flowing head.Driveablity issues is what I would be concerned about.

Daz

Acceld Z

IMHO the Crane Compucams are old designs from back when EFI tuning was just getting started. The ramps are weak and a 116 LSA isn't needed on a cam that small. My first choice would be the LPE "216" cam but i'm biased. My second choice would be the Comp EE 206/212 cam. The specs may look the same but that cam is alot more modern than the Crane grind. You'll want to avoid anything with lots of lift because it would be pointless and you'll have to have the spring pockets machined for bigger springs.

Daz

iTrader: (1)

I agree with that they are old design..Like Paul said,go for the same @.050 specs but newer release

Daz

Hawk92z-TDZ

Crane Cams CompuCam 2030 will work fine in your set-up, in that 350, key word is "fine" not extrodenary. Personaly I would of went with a comp cam, in the comp cams XE250 to XE256 range.
But since U already have the cam, dont worrie, it will work fine for u.

Same with the heads, they'll work ok, giving ya some good low end tire peeling power, it'll just fall flat on its face higher up. As long as your ok with that for now, then dont worrie about it. When u want more top end later, get some better heads and cam.

So u know, (cant remember who said they were L98 heads)

14101081......305 TPI heads (LB9) third best flowing 305 head chevrolet makes (#1 being the 305 Vortec heads)

14101083......350..TPI heads (L98), also used on crate motors, 285 or 300 hp, 64cc chambers, 72' center manifold bolt angles

14101128......350...TPI heads (L98).......Aluminum, 58cc, angle plug

10088113... ..350...TPI heads (L98).......Aluminum, 58cc, angle plug, raised "D" port exhaust, 1.94"/1.5" valves

Cruz'N Bruz'R

I have an actual set of 041/186 casting heads up for grabs. They're 64cc camelhumps from the 69 302's. but they'll be about double what you paid for your ebay jobbies. New valves,guides and the lot. 3000km's on my motor, then they came off.

mikesz1984

i have a set of these on my 327 in my z, and they work great for my motor. i hade a set of the regular heads off the 305 beefed up but was not impressed with them, so i took them off and bolted these on, and i could not believe the difference. The flow on these things are awesome

Hawk92z-TDZ

The old Camel humps do kick azz

thafaz

...and the plot thickens.....

I just got the cam in, and it's marked 114142CR on the end, indicating not a 2030, but infact a 2050....too much cam????

Tha Faz

Acceld Z

What are the specs on the 2050 cam?

thafaz

Here's a link...last cam on the page.

http://www.cranecams.com/master/apps/chevy5.htm

Tha Faz

Acceld Z

I don't see the 2050 listed. The cams in the link only go to the 2032.

thafaz

Sorry...I edited the post ;-)

FH

Acceld Z

......and that's a roller cam? Well, i'd use it. I'd add some higher flowing TPI gear to the list when funds allow for it. You may also want to get a higher stall converter. That alone will make the car alot more fun to drive.

thafaz

You are correct.....it's a hydraulic, and therefore completely useless to me

....of course, if it was the 2030 I thought I got, it would have been peachy...not really, just trying to make myself feel better

Of course, this leaves me in the market for a cam

Thanx,

Tha Faz

Acceld Z

*cough*LPE 216 cam*cough*