BitchinRS

Ok I plan on doing the timing chain this weekend, but have a quick question for those with a 3.1L that have changed thier chain.

I was lookinf through my service manule and in the section about the front cover removle it said, that you need to remove the oil pan. Is this true???? It also says that the lower rad hose goes into the timing cover. I found that kinda wierd.

I all most can't belive that you have to remove the oil pan to get the front cover off!

MDv6man

You don't have to remove the whole oil pan. Jus remove the front two bolts. Make sur you use a good amount of RTV on the bottom of the front cover. Otherwise there will be a large oil leak.

9D1BURD

yeah, i was told just drop the front of the pan enough to get the cover off. I hope this is right, i may be doing mine this weekend also. Bitchin, what kind of chain did you get? A stock one or double roller?

BitchinRS

I got the stock chain, I also picked up a water pump and both gears. The engine has 208,000 miles on it so i figure I will replaced while I am there. I would hate to do the timing chain and find myself at the side of the road witha blown water pump a few weeks later.

Just removing the the 2 front bolts gives you eough room? Also does it cause any danger in warping the pan?

MDv6man

I dont think it would cause a problem as long as you're careful. Prying on the wrong area could warp the pan; but if you take your time, it should be okay

TomP

Yeah, no need to remove the pan. Now I thought it was only on 2.8's with two-piece oil pan gaskets that had two pan bolts going into the bottom of the timing chain cover? So a 3.1 wouldn't have those bolts? Am I wrong?

I remember doing my car; my GM manual didn't show those two bolts at all, and I was prying on the chain cover, wondering why it didn't come off. I thought it was really glued down hard to the pan gasket! So after prying for a bit, I decided to feel for bolts; yep, two, at the very bottom, hidden from my "over the radiator" view. So I removed 'em, cover came right off.

My FelPro gasket kit (chain cover gasket, water pump gasket, front seal gasket) came with a little front section of the oil pan gasket. The idea was to put this little cork piece on the pan, and use a blob of RTV at each end to make the little segment "seal" to the rest of the pan. Screw that. I just layed down an overly-thick blob of RTV on that pan flange... why so thick? For the reason MDV6man said, and plus, I might've bent the front of the pan when I was trying to pry it off.

Make sure to use a sharp blade knife to separate the front of the oil pan gasket from the spot where the gasket is sandwiched "tight" between the oil pan and engine. Use brake cleaner on that pan flange to remove all oily residue, to ensure a good seal! Just don't let the brake cleaner get into the oil pan; spray the cleaner on a rag and then wipe the pan flange. Do the same for the entire chain cover flange!

Oh, hey, another point... supposedly the one-piece oil pan gasket is reusable; it's rubber. On a motor using the one piece gasket, would you even need to cut away the front pan flange piece? Or could you just clean the flange and the gasket with brake cleaner and reuse the gasket, without cutting the front off? Hm.

An obvious thing, but- When you're scraping the gasket off the front of the engine, don't let the gasket material fall into the pan; I put tape over that little opening. I also used Permatex Hi-Tack Gasket Sealer (red stuff, in a metal can, with a brush in the cap) on the chain cover gasket and water pump gasket. Reason is, the chain cover is aluminum. You need to scrape the old gaskets (pump side and engine side) off very carefully so as not to deeply gouge the sealing surface. It still gouges, though, so the sealer is a great life saver. It's annoying as hell to work with though! (extremely super super tacky, gets all over the damn place)

I've heard of some guys here that did their chain and found out the tensioner was absolutely shot (falling apart)... and then they had to wait for a new tensioner to come in "special order" from GM. Maybe you want to pick up a tensioner before you start the project? With my cloyes true dual roller chain, they said not to use a tensioner, even the stock one, with the chain- the sprockets are larger and hit the stock tensioner.

And for your engine's sake, don't use the center crank bolt to pull the gear on, OR to pull the balancer back on!! I snapped my center bolt off in the crank = impossible to hold the balancer on = impossible to hold the crank pulley on. My mechanic wound up welding a newer balancer (I got it from a junkyard for $30, he called the yard up and yelled at them for overcharging me!) to the crank for $100. This was almost 4 years ago, still holding strong, thank goodness. Buy a harmonic balancer installation tool (remember we use a metric bolt!), make one yourself, or use the "hammer and block of wood" method. The hammer/wood method is supposed to be bad news for the crank, but it couldn't be worse than snapping a bolt off in the front of the crank and ruining the threads.

BitchinRS

My shop manual ('92) says that there are 2 bolts there. So yeah the 3.1 has them also.

I'm going to be replacing the crank gear while I'm there. Do you know which type of gear puller and install tool I need to get??

Thanks for all of the helpfull replys!!!!

KED85

Turn over engine until at number one TDC
Check balancer you should be at 0* or 10*.
Disconnect battery.
Remove hoses (water)
Remove/push aside the alternator
Same AC compressor.
Start removing the balancer first.
MAY NEED THE BEST REMOVER YOU CAN FIND!
Off now?
Good.
Water pump time.
Now the TC housing. Yep, two fine thread 10mm bolts hold the cover onto the pan.
Upon all bolt removal, tap at the top with a hammer, until the seal is broken.
Breaks off pan easy, also.
NOTE DOT TO DOT LOCATION of the cam & crank gears.
MAKE SURE YOU ARE ALWAYS AT DOT TO DOT
Remove the upper three bolts.
Bottom gear still there right?
Loosly place the top gear back TO BE SURE you have not disturbed PREVIOUS DOT TO DOT location.
Get metal chissel. Find the spot on the bottom gear where the woodruff key is located.
Take the metal chissel, strike exactly at the point. HARD!
GEAR WILL CRACK PROMISE!
Works like a charm & is fun!
AGAIN MAKE SURE ALL PREVIOUS DOTS LINE UP STILL.
Attach top gear, now. USE RTV RED LOCTITE on the bolts.
Bottom gear.
Get block of wood and the old cracked gear.
Lube snout of the crank.
Slip on new gear then apply hammer wacks & use wood to buffer.
MAKE SURE THE GEARS LINE UP STRAIGHT & PROPER.
If not straight (up & down) tap on bottom until perfect (less drag equals a HP or two & longer chain life!).
Start reassembly.
Make sure you get new balancer sleeve.
WHY?
There is now a grove in your balancer.
It'll leak past that point.
Balancer sleeves cost $4.
I got one from Pioneer & one from Fel Pro.

Yes, do score the new tensioner! $10 or so.

coolrimsatleast

Man this is gonna be a pain. I'm trying to get all I need to do my chain also. Still need gear/balancer puller. Need new water pump. Wanted some super aftermarket high-flow pump, but might just settle for whatever. red loctite, got rtv, need tensioner, and thinking about a new balancer too.
Since I just surgery I can't lift over 10 lbs for at least a month. Guess I have a little time to order all of it.

KED85

Any new water pump will be very sufficent.
One ONLY need worry about the timing chain housing for aluminum water/corossion damage.
AND very clean surfaces.
Don't cross thread those 10MM bolts down low.
I am removing my 85 Firebird 3.4 balancr soon. Why?
I neglected to install a balancer sleeve.
Pissed.
Did so on my 85 Blazer 3.4 swap, tho!!