Jonb1032

Finally got my 86 camaro running, it sat for several years after replacing fuel pump, filter, regulator and injectors, it runs good. I had a brilliant idea of washing all the grime off the engine. I used a normal automotive degreaser, let it sit for 10 minutes. Hosed it off. Now won’t start. I did a quick check of distributor cap, let it sit over night, still nothing. Doesn’t seem to have any spark at all. I now know washing it wasn’t to brite. Is there a area. Should focus on. Maybe spray wd40 on connections? Any advice would help me. Right now it just sitting with hood up looking so sad.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

https://www.chevyhardcore.com/news/h...-distributors/

Jonb1032

I don’t have the HEI ignition, I have a 2.8 v6, my distributor cap is the small one. Does that website info apply to mine. Also is there a main fuse that could have blown when trying to start it when wet. I’m not the most mechanical type, but I’m trying.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Hei divorced coil ?

https://easyautodiagnostics.com/gm/4...ed-icm-tests-1

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

If you found no water under the distributor cap , my guess is that your ignition coil had some compromised insulation , got wet inside , and fried itself when you attempted to start it .

But , might as well check the easy stuff like whether the fat pink wire has 12V with the key on , and the other tests in TP's link before loading up the ol parts cannon .....

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

PS , yes the divorced coil HEI is still a variant of the GM HEI system , and no , there is no fuse in the circuit of the pink wire feeding the +12V to the coil . Just a fusible link that when blown , will make a whole bunch of other electrical stuff stop working . So , if ALL the other key operated stuff works (Radio , Wipers , Heater blower , etc) your problem likely doesn't reside in the primary ignition circuit . Of course , the +12V with key on check of the fat pink wire will tell you right off if your lack of spark is primary or secondary ignition circuit related .

My money is still on the coil .....

Jonb1032

Yes fat pink is getting 12 volts. So that means it’s the coil gone bad?

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Is that tested before and after the coil ?
can ohm test the coil. Could be icm or pu coil. Follow the test procedures.

Jonb1032

Just tested the fat pink wire on the plug going into the top of the coil. With power on, it’s getting 12 v

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

When examining the following facts ;

The car ran before the engine got washed , the distributor cap was perfectly dry underneath afterward (?) , and there is +12V on the pink with no spark to the plugs , then the logical conclusion would be that the coil didn't appreciate the bath , and water likely got inside it and it arced internally , burning a "carbon track" electrical path from the coil's secondary side to ground , and destroyed itself .

Yes indeed , without further tests it still COULD be either the coil or the module (ICM) , but given the above facts if we're betting on our "most likely suspect" , my bet is gonna be the coil ......

Jonb1032

Thank you all for the advice. I’m kicking myself for making this dumb mistake. I’m going to replace the coil, it being cheap. And will go from there. Yes it ran fine before the bath. As stated I’m no mechanic. But learning as I go. Thanks again.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

Your money , very easy to check the coil

Jonb1032

Ok, I will check. Thanks.

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

And , , , now for something else to consider here ;

An ignition coil that has been damaged by internal arcing can very well pass those resistance checks and still be bad . Those resistance checks will find an open or shorted primary or secondary winding , but in the case of a coil that has developed a carbon track the ohm meter may not indicate the fault since the fault (the arc to ground resulting in the loss of spark) only presents itself at instant the thousands of volts are present to be able to arc over the carbon track . The Ohm meter measures resistance at the 9 volt potential of it's internal battery and not at the real world working voltage of the coil . The carbon track all too many times is too many megohms to indicate any current path at 9V , but at the high voltage potential of the coil that "barely there" carbon track current path is plenty enough to lead the electrons astray and into jumping the nice handy path to ground .

Jonb1032

Its never simple is it. I’ll check coil tomorrow and will proceed from there.

NoEmissions84TA

iTrader: (1)

Was the engine hot when you washed it?
I made this mistake years ago. I wanted to wash the engine grime off, so on my way home I stopped at the car wash. Used the foaming engine degreaser, and then washed it off. I got it started, but it would not run right after that.
What happened? The cold water hitting the hot spark plugs shattered the porcelain insulators on the plugs. They looked intact until you tried to pull a plug wire off and half the plug came along with the plug wire.

Jonb1032

No, cold engine. I used a degreaser. Let it sit for 15 minutes then hosed it off. I didn’t purposely try to get the electronics wet but was excited I finally got it working. So I probably got either water or greasy dirt into things. After i rinsed it, I tried to start it while it was still soaked. Nothing. Nothing at all. The car sat for several years with gas that went way bad. So I have been working a lot in the fuel system. Basically new from the back to the front. So I was trying to clean all the gunk. I’m going to check coil and icm. Hoping that will be it.

Aaron R.

I would bet on coil too. Water inside can destroy them instantly. If it even looks old just replace it. They are cheap, and if it looks old and rusty chances are it doesn't have much life left anyway

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

Figuring it's best to keep it all in the same thread , I've quoted your post from the V6 forum here since this is the oldest thread about your problem . Having multiple threads on the same problem can result in info getting lost or crossed between threads .

Anyway , I generally do not like straying from the factory configuration of parts without good reason , but here I believe my reason to be good ;

Since I SO didn't trust having my ignition coil and EGR control valve bolted to the hot exhaust manifold on my V6 for the obvious reason of the extreme heat being detrimental to the life of most electrical parts , I relocated my coil to be mounted to the firewall adjacent to where the distributor is , and I relocated the EGR control valve to the area near the HVAC housing on the firewall . As long as you make very sure the metal frame of the coil is electrically grounded to the engine the coil will appreciate not being at exhaust manifold temperature . I ran a wire from the frame of the coil to the same place on the back of the cylinder head where a few other wires are grounded and I haven't had a coil failure in over 8 years now (before the relocation it'd kill a coil every 2 to 3 years) .

Jonb1032

Update..sort of. I put a new coil and icm in. Same exact problem. I pulled a Spark plug, no spark. I still have 12 v to fat pink wire going into top of coil. My mechanics skill level is about a 2 out of 10. So this is way above me. I have power to other things like headlights and rear hatch motor. Is there any sensors up front which would prevent a start. I’m really getting frustrated.

Tuned Performance

iTrader: (92)

What does the pu coil ohm at and does it produce ac voltage?

Jonb1032

Once I look up what the pu coil is and where it’s located. I’ll report my findings.

Jonb1032

I think the pick up coil is the small plug that plugs into the icm,Under the distributor cap. correct? So I will ohm that.
as for checking voltage excuse my ignorance, but do I test on side of this plug and ground to car body with my tester? Also I assume key in the run position to test voltage?

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

https://easyautodiagnostics.com/gm/4...ed-icm-tests-1

Jon , all the info you seek is in this link that T.P. posted for you back in post #4 . If you follow the diagnostics from the beginning you will eventually come to finding out why the spark is missing . If you scroll to page 6 in that link you'll find "Test #7" , which explains exactly how to check the pickup coil and it includes the voltage your supposed to be looking for

Jonb1032

Thank you all, I will follow the link and hopefully track this down. I will post my results. I really appreciate all the advice, thanks again.

OrangeBird

iTrader: (1)

Great ! Now do yourself a favor , while you've got the distributor out , replace the O ring on the distributor body where it goes into the engine . This is a known oil leak place on the V6 and when it does leak it leaks a LOT .


On the distributor on the top of my picture you can see the O ring . See how that O ring looks curved on it's edge ? That's a new O ring . The O ring on the distributor body on the bottom of my pic is flattened on it's edge , that's a bad O ring that has become hard and lost it ability to seal (I modified that distributor into an engine pre oiler for when I rebuilt my V6)

Jonb1032

Update..it’s running! It was the pick up coil, after testing it from your recommendation, it didn’t have the correct ac voltage. Replaced it. For me pulling the distributor and getting to the pick up coil was quite a challenge. But I did it. And now it fires right up. Thanks again, there is no way I could have narrowed down without the help of this board. Thanks again.