thainglo

iTrader: (1)

Just spent the last few days with my doors torn apart to work on speeding up my window movement and replacing the stock door handles with an awesome aftermarket set made by James Hoffman. The project started with just replacing the door handles, but fell into the usual "While I'm in there..." Door handles were super easy, but thought I would post of some pics and info on the work I did with the window tracks and results after deep cleaning and regreasing.


This is the flush mounted handle by James Hoffman. Looks great, this pic does not do it justice. I will be touching up the chipped paint around the handle so it looks good from 20' away. Everything will come off for a paint job.

I opted to remove all the window track pieces, excluding the window glass itself. The factory used special peel type rivets that I don't have on hand, so that track I had to clean and grease inside the door. Everything else, including the regulator came out. NOTE: Since I was working alone, I have found using a couple of the simple rubber door stops (the kind that you kick under the edge of a door) work well for holding the window glass in place while you are working. Not as good as having a buddy there to help guide to the right spot, but good enough to get the job done.

A few pics of the pieces, there were spots where the grease was so crusty, I had to clean it off by gently scraping with a flathead screwdriver. After getting the chunks out, I wiped each one with paint thinner until all remnants of the old grease were removed. New grease was applied - I used lithium based wheel and bearing grease.

Driver side horizontal track

All parts from the passenger side


To remove the rivets holding the regulator in place, I used an angle grinder to cut the middle of the rivet (making sure to NOT cut into the door). Then, I use a nail to punch out the center pin then either drill out the rivet head with a step drill or break it off with a cold chisel and hammer..

I found the roller mounted to the frame that is part of the window glass to be damaged on both doors. On each, the roller could be pushed down on the mounting post. Fortunately, I have a spare set of pieces from my 88 parts car, so I removed the rollers on each of those pieces and pressed them onto the post. Careful removal of the good rollers was a chore. I had to pry them off with a couple of screwdrivers - I tried trim removal tools and a two-jaw puller, neither worked well. Took a long time to finagle each one off. To mount onto the posts, I just used a large set of channel locks. With enough pressure, they popped on.

Damaged roller on the driver side. I had first greased it up and installed it into the track and realized that was a complete bone-head thing to do, since I had replacement rollers available.

Replacement roller and example of the mounting post.

There have been several questions posted on TGO in the past asking if all the rollers are supposed to turn. The answer is a resounding YES. Each post that I saw in my assemblies is identical to the one in the picture above. With cleaning, I was able to get each nylon roller to spin on its post. Not free-spinning wildly, but moving when turned. The rollers might slide in the track if there is less friction there then required to turn, but each should be able to be turned on its post.

Regulators were next. The teeth were all cleaned and all the metal surfaces that move were given a coat of grease.



After some thought, I opted to keep the original motors mounted to the regulators, even though I had one new spare on hand. I tested each one out of the car and had full range of movement, with no squeaking, grinding, etc. My decision was based around the idea that today's aftermarket offerings from overseas might not outlast a good, solid part designed to OEM standards. Based off the results I've seen following this project, I'm glad I kept the original motors.

Reinstalling the parts wasn't too bad. Hardest was keeping the window in place while I moved the regulator assembly back into position. Once that was in and the holes were aligned, I riveted it back into place.

Everyone needs this tool if doing any work on the doors. The factory rivets are 1/4", so the usual rivet guns cannot be used. I bought this for ~$20 from Harbor Freight and picked up an extra package of 1/4" rivets. Made it a piece of cake.

thainglo

iTrader: (1)

After everything was back in, I got looking at the window guides. The felt was really compressed, not leaving much cushion between the glass and the metal bracket. I had a spare set of guides on hand, so I decided to see what steps I could take to improve them. Unfortunately, the original felt material is no longer available, but I found on this site and others the recommendation to use 2" Velcro strips (the soft side). Luckily, the local Home Depot had that in stock, so I raced down and picked up a package for $3.

My spare set. The fabric on one just crumbled off. The second peeled off without difficulty.

$3 at Home Depot


To prep the surface, I used my brass wheel brush and removed all traces of the old adhesive. I then gave everything a good wipe with acetone to clean and remove any residual nastiness.

For adhesive, I used 3M #8090. This stuff is seriously sticky. I had a can from a convertible top install I did several years ago and have used off and on since. Spray it on both surfaces, let it sit for about 5 minutes, then press it together. Those pieces don't move once they make contact, so make sure you have everything where you want it!


Spray both items that are being glued together and let sit for around 5 minutes.

Final result, with the one on the right being an original window guide from my 85 TA that is being replaced with the redone units.

With the redone guides installed, windows work great. I timed each window going up and down before and after this project. Results are seconds to complete movement, with the engine running:

Before: After:
Driver UP: 4.9 3.8
Driver DOWN: 5.1 4.2
Pass UP: 4.9 3.9
Pass DOWN: 6.1 4.3

Reduction of 1 second for each movement, almost a two second improvement in the passenger down movement. In addition, the windows move much quieter, there was lots of squeaking on both sides before this project, and passenger side had a slow spot in the middle of each movement, must have been some binding going on.

thainglo

iTrader: (1)

Almost forgot, another item I fixed (and forgot to take pictures) is replacing the lower window bumpers. I'd sourced a set from Drew last year and had to spend a good hour trying to find them in my parts pile. (Finally found them in a box labeled Underdash Parts from the 88 parts car - inconvenient). These bumpers are great, definitely help control the movement of the window and keep it from popping up when it is lowered too far. I used a 3/16" rivet to hold mine back in place.

Drew has a great writeup of installing these bumpers here:
Bumper Install

He is also selling these, that post is here:
Bumper Purchase

Hope this project writeup can help others with speeding up their windows!

battmann

iTrader: (9)

Thanks for posting your insight. What grease did you use on the regulator and tracks?

Drew

iTrader: (58)

Well done! The doors on thirdgens are full of room for improvement and are generally poorly maintained. A person could build a 'playlist' of threads that detail fixing everything from the hinges, to the latches, to the locks and windows. Just cleaning and lubricating everything, replacing the window stops, ensuring everything is in place and properly assembled can make a huge difference in the perceived 'quality' of the car.

BTW Dorman sells a package of GM window rollers that look like they'd probably work.


74430


74407 looks like it might work to replace the roller on the window frame.

thainglo

iTrader: (1)

I used this grease. Nothing fancy, had it on hand. I did some googling of nylon and lithium grease, appeared this would be fine.

thainglo

iTrader: (1)

Agreed! I previously had installed some Killmat (dynomat knock-off) and some padding to keep the lock rods from jangling around. That made a HUGE difference in the door sound. When closing, it went from "clank/rattle" to "CLUNK." Sounds very solid and quieted the car from rattles while driving.

kalgran

Hey I know this thread is a couple weeks old but I'm doing a complete drivers side door rebuild and I can't figure out how the window regulator goes back in Should I have the glass at the top or bottom of its actuation for reinstallation? Also the regulator spring fell out so what would optimal position be to reinstall that too. I know I sound completely ridiculous cause this is a rookie mistake, but I'm trying to learn so that's what happens I guess.

EDIT: I figured it out actually. I was dumb and connected one of the rollers into the window's track instead of the inner panel track. Huge mistake. I'm hoping I didn't bend or bust anything. Also figured out why this window motor went bad. Make sure to replace ALL the pop rivets that you drilled out with an equivalent fastener. Whoever did the motor installation before me forgot two of the bolts and it cost me $30.

thainglo

iTrader: (1)

Glad to hear you figured it out! To answer your question about glass positioning (in case someone is looking for this in the future), I positioned the regulator to be halfway through its movement. This helped get the arms aligned into a tight package for inserting into the door opening. I used a rubber door stop and some cursing to keep the window at its halfway point, then worked the rollers into the appropriate tracks.

kalgran

Running into more issues. Someone replaced this motor before me and they used the official method of pulling the regulator out to replace the motor. This caused an issue for me as I was trying to remove the motor the easy way but had to remove the bolts holding the regulator assembly to the door; causing the regulator spring to release and fall off. How should I go about putting the spring back in there? Do I now have to take the whole regulator out of the door, install the motor and re-tension the spring outside the door? Or is there a way I can keep the regulator in it's tracks and re tension the spring that way?

scooter

iTrader: (11)

When I did the window motors in my 91 TA one of the springs fell out because I wasn't paying attention. Hardest part was just remembering which direction the spring was facing before it fell out. It isn't hard to put them back in as long as the motor is off. You just put the spring in with the regulator past it's travel for the motor, put the spring in and you just use the leverage from the regulator to tension it again

thainglo

iTrader: (1)

I am almost certain you will have to remove the regulator to replace the spring. Just not sure how you would have enough room to work with it I side the door. When working on my doors earlier, I had bought a 1/4" rivet gun from Harbor Freight and extra pack of 100 rivets. Worked like a champ, and might have cost $25. If pulling your regulator, I recommended that tool.

yankeecarman

iTrader: (9)

A great precise write up. Im sure it is invaluable when performing this job. Again Thanks!!!